Paypal Ban on buying guns and Hi-Cap mags

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Good thing I only use PayPal to purchase ... machine tools and, uh, scrap metal. Yep.

edit: Here's the full link: http://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=p/gen/ua/use/index_frame-outside&ed=firearms

In addition, you may not use PayPal to sell or advertise kits (that can be used to create a firearm) or illegal firearm components such as silencers, converters (which converts a firearm to automatic capability), and short barrels.
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Golly, I can't use PayPal to buy gun "converters"? But-but- I'd just set up a buy on one that drops right into my revolvers, and it worked with Mauser rifles, too!

Yeesh...where did they learn about guns, anyway?
 
Same as ebay policy, so what? They only say you cant "sell" using their services. For Gunbroker, just use a different service.
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What's that supposed to mean? I wasn't aware that I could sell a firearm-related article to someone who wants to pay via paypal without accepting payment via paypal. :)

I'm sending them a flame about how "high capacity magazines" don't exist, and how the "illegal firearms components" they list aren't always illegal.

Are dummy grenades deactivated in the way they require (permanently filled with non-explosive and not readily convertable), or are they just empty?

What maroons.
 
Guys, just for clarification, two points:

1) Ebay owns PayPal, hence it makes sense that their policy is the same.

2) Loophole Alert:
You may not use PayPal to sell any firearm manufactured after 1898.
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I'm not SELLING using PAYPAL. I'm selling using GunBroker, AuctionArms, Gunsamerica.... or whatever. I'm only using PayPal to receive or send funds.

2) Just because that's their policy doesn't mean that if you can't still use their service. When sending or receiving payments, just be sure to not list the item as firearms related. List it instead as Ian suggests - machine parts, mechanical parts, bicycle parts, hardware... whatever.

Your thoughts?
 
I agree

I agree with Rovert.............Buy machine parts. Its not like you are breaking any LAWS just paypal's RULES.
However there are a bunch of FFL dealers out there who use Paypal as their means of accepting credit cards and this is going to hurt them


When a strong man, fully armed, guards his house, his possessions are safe.............LUKE: 11:21 NIV
 
Well you could certainly get away with using the loop hole as you suggest . My question is why support them if they are going to take the anti stance ? If they would take a neutral stance that would be ok by me but I will not help ANYONE who take's up the position with the anti gun folks . It sucks because I have used them allot to buy and sell stuff on gun broker but their must be some other company to do business with . Surely they are not the only game in town are they ?
 
They're not prohibiting the transfer of funds for any type of items. What they're doing is stating the policy of what may and may not be sold on PayPal Shops. Has noting at all to do with transfering funds. Ebay does not allow firearms sales - PayPal is now an Ebay company.

You can still buy "gun parts" using PayPal. The restriction is the seller won't be allow ti list his "gun parts" on a PayPal Shop.

Go here: PayPal Shops This is where the restriction is.

I don't like the restriction either but I'll continue to use PaPal where it makes sense, just like I still crusie Ebay now and then when I'm looking for something I can't find at a reasonable price elsewhere.
 
Does anyone know why the restriction is really being put in place?

I am not sure we can jump to the conclusion that they are anti...

I have heard -- and again this is just rumor stuff too -- that these restrictions are in place to get BATF and others off their backs -- to insure they don't have any liability as a knowing intermediatory for illegal sales. The problem becomes that they can't distinguish what is legal and what is not very easily -- so they cast the rule very broadly to cover their butts.

It is possible that this is a decision made of business necessity and not a political statement. After all -- if it was political, why would they ban sales of all firearm related items -- which they clearly did not do.

I have sold normal cap mags on eBay since the policy was put in place -- you just do so with a wink and a nod and everybody is happy.

The problem is that PayPal is a very good service. Who else offers all that they do -- including interest bearing accounts, free credit card/ATM access, virtual debit cards, etc.?
 
If boycotting PayPal means that fewer guns will be sold, aren't we playing into the hands of the Antis?

I will, like those who sell "10-round pre-ban" mags on eBay, continue to flount their stupid rules to my benefit.

What is really needed is competition to both eBay and PayPal.
 
I refuse to do business with any company that publicly states that people with my particular hobby are evil.

EBay/Paypal don't allow the sale of firearms through their systems because they believe firearms are evil. At some level I would expect people who hold such views would be active in revoking our right to keep and bear arms (if nothing else by the people they vote for).

F- em ... let the free market speak ... there are alternatives:

http://paypalsucks.com/options.shtml
 
What?

Seriously, Zund, educate me.

Where does eBay and PayPal say that firearms are evil? If they are so evil, why do they permit the sale of post ban mags, holsters, scopes, sights, slings, etc.?

I haven't seen anything that is inconsistent with them trying to get the govt. off their backs.

If I am wrong -- then lets get it out in the open and a boycott may be appropriate.

On the other hand -- if I am right, then the next best alternative to PayPal may find themselves as the next government target. Hard to blame eBay or PayPal if they are just reacting to the pressure. In that case, the gripe is with the government regulators, not the service providers.
 
Fair enough DDGator.

here's a quote from Kevin Pursglove, eBay's senior director of communications when asked about eBay's anti gun rules

"You can still buy guns at other online sites. This was a decision that the management of eBay made about the kind of company they wanted to be: a positive, friendly, safe and enthusiastic trading environment."


Apparently us gun owners are negative, unfriendly and dangerous.

Maybe I'm just being overly sensitive, but that sounds like more anti gun owner bigotry to me.
 
Thanks Zund, that is the kind of stuff I wanted to hear-- well, I didn't want to hear it -- but I am glad to know.

I agree -- even if they were feeling some pressure from the feds and didn't want to say it directly -- the statement they made is not what they should have said. That does sound political and offensive to me.
 
Well I'm not so sure I'm comfortable with any of the others listed on that link so I guess Ill be sending check's and that's fine by me . As I see it Pay Pal and E-Bay have a definite view on firearms and I will no longer do business with them . If we don't stand together against these companies who inject their political views into their business practices we are not helping our cause any . If they want my business they had at least stay neutral.
 
Why any of you continue to support a company like that is amazing. This isn't breaking news - these stories have been going around for years, in addition to all of the other hijinks and questionable actions Paypal has taken against it's suckers, I mean, customers.

Guys, it's *your* money. Why aren't you using a service that supports you?
 
Yeah, I think this only pertains to PayPal shops. I don't see how they could enforce who you can send and receive money from. It's just like writing a check to someone. BofA cannot tell me that I cannot write a check to buy a gun.

GT
 
Well, here is my E-Mail to PAYPAL:

Just a courteous message to apprise you that I and a large contingent of friends, associates and members of my various web sites will immediately cease & desist use of PAYPAL for various and assundried purchases as a result of your recent edict which prohibits the use of PAYPAL for purchases related to the legal exchange or purchase of firearm-related products including, but not limited to: current legal arms, parts and ammunition and other firearm-related accessories. I will endeavor to spread the word amongst enthusiasts, hunters, sport shooters, CCW owners, fishermen, sportsmen and any other groups with a concern in these areas. You have taken a business decision as well as a moral one. You must now live with it.

Kind Regards, XXXXXXXXXXXXXX
 
I stopped using them when they started sucking money out of my bank account without notifying me! I learned that PayPal isn't limited to the funds you deposit in it. It will freely attack any bank account you've given it access to.
 
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