i think the question should be why shouldnt a homeowner need it. i imagine that for just about everyone here, their guns' main purpose is to protect themselves, especially while home. if you have a weapon and are willing to confront someone who breaks into your house than having a vest on would just be common sense. you dont know if that person is armed or not so you might as well be prepared for it.
Private Citizens and Body Armor? Good or Bad?
- Thread starter AZRickD
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Zach S
Member
I'm not trying to start a fire here, but does anyone else find this funny?
Treylis
Member
I've never seen a compelling, logical argument put forth as to why private citizens should not own body armor, and I can see that it has definite utility. Good thing.
Justin
Moderator Emeritus
The rational answer has already been given. In a free nation citizens don't need to justify the ownership of private property, be it a deck of Pokemon cards or a Kevlar vest.
Any discussion beyond that belongs in the strategies and tactics forum.
Zach- I suspect WA was being ironic.
Any discussion beyond that belongs in the strategies and tactics forum.
Zach- I suspect WA was being ironic.
Wildalaska
member
Sorry Justin, I agree that no one needs to justify it on a constituional basis...then let me rephrase it...
What is your view of life and socieity that would make you want to own body armor suffienct to stop a rifle round...
??
And Im not talking about "if comes"...and btw I see a philosophical difference between BOBs and body armour...
Does that take it out of strategy and tactics..?
WildandiwasbeingironicAlaska
Chuck Dye
Member
Marketing opportunity...
OK, now I want a Kevlar and polyethylene plate house coat! As frumpy as a fat, fifty-something woman in curlers, complete with factory installed frayed cuffs and hemline (camouflage
.) Better yet, a Kevlar and plate yukata, male pattern with the partially sewn sleeve ends (hard to call’em cuffs on a yukata) and appropriate storage slots for BUGs and spare magazines.
OK, now I want a Kevlar and polyethylene plate house coat! As frumpy as a fat, fifty-something woman in curlers, complete with factory installed frayed cuffs and hemline (camouflage
.) Better yet, a Kevlar and plate yukata, male pattern with the partially sewn sleeve ends (hard to call’em cuffs on a yukata) and appropriate storage slots for BUGs and spare magazines.
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Don't Tread
Member
"What is your view of life and socieity that would make you want to own body armor suffienct to stop a rifle round...??"
Good Question, here's an answer, not everyone who means to harm you is going to use a pistol, some will use hunting rifles, either because that's all they have or because they know that most body armor won't stop a rifle round.
Is that a good answer???
Good Question, here's an answer, not everyone who means to harm you is going to use a pistol, some will use hunting rifles, either because that's all they have or because they know that most body armor won't stop a rifle round.
Is that a good answer???
telomerase
Member
The world would be a better place...
If Dallas convenience-store clerks all had body armor.
Why don't you ask the 200 million people killed by their own governments in the 20th century? Oh, that's right, you can't. (I admit that lots of them were killed by mere pistols and subguns, and could have made do with Level III).
Well, if the intruder gets by my wolves, then I'd be foolish not to put on armor before confronting them, wouldn't I?
We can't all have sheltered lives like you Alaskan softies.
If Dallas convenience-store clerks all had body armor.
Why don't you ask the 200 million people killed by their own governments in the 20th century? Oh, that's right, you can't. (I admit that lots of them were killed by mere pistols and subguns, and could have made do with Level III).
Well, if the intruder gets by my wolves, then I'd be foolish not to put on armor before confronting them, wouldn't I?
We can't all have sheltered lives like you Alaskan softies.
dustind
Member
I think the way you worded it, and the use of "law abiding" put people on edge.
I will probably buy some someday in case some crazy guy tries to break into my house, for use on some two or four wheel off road or race vehicles, wild animals, any time I think I may be hit by any lethal or non lethal projectile sent form a human or nature, and for any unknown situation where I would like to have it.
I can think of a lot of jobs where I would want it if I lived in a bad city, from gas station employee, taxi driver, to pizza delivery person, etc.
I will probably buy some someday in case some crazy guy tries to break into my house, for use on some two or four wheel off road or race vehicles, wild animals, any time I think I may be hit by any lethal or non lethal projectile sent form a human or nature, and for any unknown situation where I would like to have it.
I can think of a lot of jobs where I would want it if I lived in a bad city, from gas station employee, taxi driver, to pizza delivery person, etc.
artherd
member
Because somebody, sometime, may shoot a rifle at me, either accidentally, or with purpose?
Because another race riot could happen at any time, and who knows where I'll be at the time?
Because police now carry M-16s as general issue, and while most LE are good and moral people, the ONLY murder committed with a registered machine gun in recent history was commited by an off-duty LEO.
41mag
Member
dustind makes a point that mebee Wildalaska might help with an answer.
re.wild animals.I wonder what protection,if any,current body armor would provide against bear chewings?
I wonder if any guides/hunters in the frozen north have tried wearing one?
41isn'ttheinternetawondefultoymag
re.wild animals.I wonder what protection,if any,current body armor would provide against bear chewings?
I wonder if any guides/hunters in the frozen north have tried wearing one?
41isn'ttheinternetawondefultoymag
Marshall
Member
For home break-in's, I see the advantage going to the BG if body armor and plates are readily available in Wal Mart. The more intelligent BG's already assume were armed, give them the ability to have less risk and we increase their confidence.
I see this scenario: I have a break in, I awake suddenly and stumble to get my body armor, try my best to put it on quickly while also getting my gun and flashlight and hoping he isn't storming my bedroom with his body armor already on! Wait, I have no underwear on, I can't be shot like this! Oh yea, I forgot, my wife or girlfriend need some too and so do my kids so they don't get shot dead. I yell at my dog, body armor time boy, body armor, I don't want Rover dead.
I guess I could sleep in it but that might cut down on my sexual prowess?
I see this scenario: I have a break in, I awake suddenly and stumble to get my body armor, try my best to put it on quickly while also getting my gun and flashlight and hoping he isn't storming my bedroom with his body armor already on! Wait, I have no underwear on, I can't be shot like this! Oh yea, I forgot, my wife or girlfriend need some too and so do my kids so they don't get shot dead. I yell at my dog, body armor time boy, body armor, I don't want Rover dead.
I guess I could sleep in it but that might cut down on my sexual prowess?
Whatever works for you, works for you... I have several vests that I have purchased or been issued and all of them are a pain to wear. They sit in the closet collecting dust... And BTW, they expire every 5 years so they must be replaced. As to the plates and whatnot, buy all you want...but for the life of me, I can't figure out why anyone outside DOD or certain LE groups would want a level 4 plate. Those things are HEAVY and a real pain to wear around. Plus, it takes a few minutes to get suited up in all that stuff... those few minutes could be better spent moving to a point of dimination or securing your family.
Justin
Moderator Emeritus
There are really only two reasons why I would want body armor:
1) To tweak the nose of those who think it should be illegal.
2) Because it's cool.
[/doesn't own any, can't speak for everyone.]
Highland Ranger
Member
The difference in outlook is perhaps the difference between a mountain top in Alaska and a housing project in Red Hook Brooklyn (where a law abiding citizen might use one to wrap their two year old in bed)
Dude you need to leave the tundra and visit a few cities.
Dude you need to leave the tundra and visit a few cities.
Wildalaska
member
And that says it all..
Me I used to wear my flak vest with my LBE amd my cammie pajamas
Dude I live in a city...and dont need no Level II vest...
And I lived in NYC when it was real nasty...didnt need a Level II there either...
WildoffthetundraAlaska
Half-Baked-Alaska.
I've created this thread for you to get your answer as to why some would want body armor. Are there any answers you need to satisfy this issue for you? Or was this just a little trolling on your part?
You said you were just curious, and now you are making jokes about "cammie pajamies."
Rick
I've created this thread for you to get your answer as to why some would want body armor. Are there any answers you need to satisfy this issue for you? Or was this just a little trolling on your part?
You said you were just curious, and now you are making jokes about "cammie pajamies."
Rick
there is this one show that had a guy on who invented bear armor after being attacked. the guy put the armor on and the host of the show broke a baseball bat across this guys chest. then they hit him a couple times with a battering ram. they couldnt test on a real bear so they made these big mechanical claws and tried to crush the guy with them but his armor held strong. then they put a punching bag in the claws and ripped it to shreds. the armor was impressive but the guy could barely move with it on.
Wildalaska
member
Buy guns, to the best of my knowledge no civilian wears body armor for bears in Alaska..
The Troopers do (as do Fish and Game) but they are required to.
WilddonthtinkthatbodyarmourwouldstopabearanywayAlaska
The Troopers do (as do Fish and Game) but they are required to.
WilddonthtinkthatbodyarmourwouldstopabearanywayAlaska
madcowburger
member
Armor against animal attacks? Hm, I stand to be corrected here, but my understanding has been that big bears generally go for the head and neck first. Ditto for the big cats. Wolves and mean dogs like to go low, especially for the crotch. A kevlar vest, or even one with rifle-proof steel or ceramic inserts, wouldn't necessarily help much. It seems like what you'd want would be a helmet of some kind and a kevlar or chain mail codpiece.
MCB
MCB
dustind
Member
I wonder what animals shark chain mail could stop. I would guess anything that does not maul you would have a hard time getting you.
Marshall
Member
Geeze guy's, give ol' Wild a break. All he's saying is that he really doesn't see a need for the average American to wear body armor. Frankly, I don't either. Does it mean you should be banned from buying it? No. Wild said that too and I agree.
I mean damn, if you live in an area that you fear your life so much as to have to wear body armor, you might be better suited spending your time thinking on how to get out of there and move to a safer area to live. Avoiding a gun fight is in fact a better way to stay alive than hanging in an area wearing body armor where gun fights are a way of life.
Someone spoke of steering wheels? Don't most cars made for the decade or longer have Air Bags, drivers side at least? Oh yea, how many of us are really going to do that anyway? LOL
I already posted about home a defense senario. I think that's wishful thinking too for the most part.
When it get's down to the nut-cuttin, BG's will wear it for a specific reason and purpose in mind. To be combative with them we would have to wear it all the time to be ready.
I spend my money on alarms, dogs, proper lighting and a 12 guage and feel very comfortable.
I mean damn, if you live in an area that you fear your life so much as to have to wear body armor, you might be better suited spending your time thinking on how to get out of there and move to a safer area to live. Avoiding a gun fight is in fact a better way to stay alive than hanging in an area wearing body armor where gun fights are a way of life.
Someone spoke of steering wheels? Don't most cars made for the decade or longer have Air Bags, drivers side at least? Oh yea, how many of us are really going to do that anyway? LOL
I already posted about home a defense senario. I think that's wishful thinking too for the most part.
When it get's down to the nut-cuttin, BG's will wear it for a specific reason and purpose in mind. To be combative with them we would have to wear it all the time to be ready.
I spend my money on alarms, dogs, proper lighting and a 12 guage and feel very comfortable.
artherd
member
I've been wanting to ask people who suggest moving as a safety measure.
Where would you have me go? Where would you have me move to that I am guarenteed 100% to NEVER have a rifle shot at me (or house invaded, or daughter raped, etc.), by anybody?
Where's this mythical 'crime-free zone' where nothing bad happens?
Yes, ok, you can stack the odds in your favor to a degree with a well-planned real-estate transaction.
But where is the place where you can guarentee me I will NEVER need that armour?
7.62FullMetalJacket
Member
"Never" is tough.
We have experienced 5 murders in 15 years, three on one day from an off-interstate robbery. None were rifles. 2 accidental gunshot deaths from 2 kids.
I would be more afraid of lightning here than rifle shots.
Utah: Armed and People Know It
We have experienced 5 murders in 15 years, three on one day from an off-interstate robbery. None were rifles. 2 accidental gunshot deaths from 2 kids.
I would be more afraid of lightning here than rifle shots.
Utah: Armed and People Know It
Marshall
Member
No one can guarentee what you're asking. But life is all about odds and if you live a very bad area, there are better places out there.
Additionally, if you ever cross a street do wear yellow or blaze orange to be seen better? Do you drive a Volvo for safety? Oh yea, and what are you going to wear to protect you from shoulder launched rockets? I mean sometime you have to realize that life is a risk in itself and there are some things that are almost unreasonable to expect. Asking yourself to wear body armor 24/7 is a tad much to ask of yourself, don't you think?
Additionally, if you ever cross a street do wear yellow or blaze orange to be seen better? Do you drive a Volvo for safety? Oh yea, and what are you going to wear to protect you from shoulder launched rockets? I mean sometime you have to realize that life is a risk in itself and there are some things that are almost unreasonable to expect. Asking yourself to wear body armor 24/7 is a tad much to ask of yourself, don't you think?
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