repeated 1911 colt failure

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It's been a while since I've compared them, but I believe that the Series 70 collet bushings were mated to a barrel which had a slightly increased flared diameter at the last inch or so towards the muzzle.

The collet bushing on a Series 70 barrel should readily and loosely slide up and down the barrel (chamber end to about 3/4 of the way towards the muzzle) until it encounters the muzzle end. There, it should be friction engaged by the slighty thickened barrel and require moderate finger pressure to slide off the end of the muzzle.

You appear to have a Series 70 bushing slid onto a Series 80 barrel. Check the barrel marking on the polished exterior of the barrel's chamber just behind the barrel lugs. Does it say: MKIV Series 70?

Does the prongs of your bushing "grasp" the muzzle end of the barrel (with tension from the three prongs) when the end of the muzzle is pulled through the the prongs of the collet bushing? They should.

When holding the loose barrel, does the bushing slide loosely around the muzzle area and can the bushing simply slide off the end when you tilt it towards the floor? It shouldn't.

With the weapon assembled and looking at the business end, is there significant gap, play, or jiggle room between the collet bushing and the surface of the barrel. There shouldn't be. The collet bushing was Colt's transitory attempt to transfer Gold Cup target gun features onto the Government Model (tightening up barrel play at the muzzle). It was not especially successful and there were occasional reports of one of the three "fingers" breaking off during firing, causing jams.

This may be the problem. In over 35 years of owning 1911s, I've never seen that uniquely depicted type of damage in a weapon equipped with OEM parts.

As Oro mentioned, replace the bushing with a standard (solid) one and get a new Recoil Spring Plug as well as a new standard 16 pound recoil spring. You can on-line order either Colt factory or reputable aftermarket parts from Brownells or Wolff Gun Springs.

http://www.gunsprings.com/Semi-Auto Pistols/COLT/1911 GOV'T%

http://www.coltsmfg.com/shop-c25-p0-g8-b0-.aspx
 
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Let's try this hypothetical situation: The recoil Spring plug has been contacting the recoil spring guide, due to hot loads or (more probably) a weak recoil spring. The thin wall of the recoil spring plug was partially collapsed and consequently didn't allow the spring to compress into the plug upon recoil. That resulted inexcesive unsupported spring length, which developed a kink, or bend, with repeated firing.

How long has the recoil spring plug been damaged as shown in your photos?

I think a new recoil spring guide and recoil spring (hopefully both made by Colt) will solve the problem.

I can't encourage anyone to install a FLGR for this or any other reason. Several (million) 1911s are out there as we speak, demonstrating that the as-designed recoil spring guide provides long & trouble-free functioning of the firearm.
 
The bushing does slide easily except at the muzzle end where it becomes a friction fit. Using simple calipers I measure less than a 1/64” larger diameter on the barrel at the muzzle end. The barrel is Marked colt .45 AUTO.
The slide is marked Series 80 Mark IV.

With the bushing on the barrel and slid into the muzzle position there is no visible gap between the bushing and the barrel, no "jiggle room" no movment I can see.
 
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I dont know how long the plug has been damaged. I do know i wouldn’t have reassembled it if it was damaged as shown.
FLGR????
 
Begins to look like I have a series 70 barrel and bushing in a series 80 gun. This is a factory set up, not my doing, as I am absolutely certain that I have never replaced the barrel since buying the gun new, in box, from a colt dealer.


The bushing fit’s the barrel very closely similar to the pix by ORO above on left except that there is no gap between the bushing and barrel. Barrel and bushing are closely concentric as opposed to the visible offset on ORO’s left pix.


Given the above I dont see how the bushing barrel combo is the cause of the problem.
 
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I don't think there is a problem with your barrel to bushing fit. As you noted, looks like you've got a Series 70 barrel & bushing.

I also believe that the Series 70 bushing/barrel setup should be able to work fine in a Series 80 slide.

However, the fact that you have Series 70 parts in a Series 80 gun means that someone (possibly the factory, possibly not) has done some modifications, gunsmithing, or simple parts swapping. It happens, even NIB from factory distributors.

The more I think about, the more convinced I am that the recoil spring is not providing enough resistance at full recoil (at full spring compression). In other words, the spring is "bottoming out" and the nose of the recoil spring guide is impacting the rear of the recoil spring plug. The spring itself is not doing the main damage to the recoil spring plug, but has no where else to go and kinks. I think the gun is under sprung for the ammo you are using.

From the photos, your recoil spring appears to have 32 coils, which would be normal for a full-sized .45 ACP Government Model. It is apparently the proper length as well.

What I don't know, is whether it's actually a standard 16# spring for a 5" slide length 1911.

Might it be possible that the spring is for .38 Super, 9mm, or .40?

Or...is it in fact a reduced poundage .45 ACP spring for lightweight (and low recoil) .45 target loads?

What ammo are you using? 230 Gr Hardball? 200 Gr Premium Self Defense +P? Soft recoiling 185 Gr SWC Target Loads?

I'm not sure of the coil count on .38 Super or 9mm Recoil Springs. I think they run 27 or 28 coils? Perhaps someone else can chime in...

If you have too light of a spring (say...11 lbs or so...it might lead to this problem with full power ammo).

I'm still thinking new Standard 16# Recoil Spring, new Recoil Spring Plug, and a new Recoil Spring Guide. About $35 worth of parts from Colt.

Forget installing a FLRG. Adding that "improvement" should have nothing whatsoever to do with the current problem and is simply an unnecessary device that brings a new set of potential problems to the gun.

Hope this ultimately helps. Good luck.
 
However, the fact that you have Series 70 parts in a Series 80 gun means that someone (possibly the factory, possibly not) has done some modifications, gunsmithing, or simple parts swapping. It happens, even NIB from factory distributors.
Click to expand...

Er, no, it means he has a Mk IV Series 80 gun. The collet/barrel bushing arrange post-dated the introduction of the '80 series firing pin safety c.1983 and was used up to 1989. If the gun was purchased new in that time frame - as the poster has said - it looks entirely stock.

Since Bru88 says the spring tunnel itself looks good, I'd say get a fresh 16lb. spring and spring cap. I would think a burr or defect in the interior edge of the spring cap was the culprit and it slowly was dinged and bent until it hammered itself even further out of shape on the guide rod and kinked the spring. Make sure the guide rod is straight, no bent, and also square against it's base (e.g., if you stand it on it's base it stands vertical on a flat surface and not like the Leaning Tower of Pisa ;)).
 
Chindo:
since the spring is a replacement it is possible that it is not proper strength. Of course I replaced it due to a previous problem. Now that I think about it if I remember correctly the original spring
It is strange that the barrel is marked 45 auto not MK IV Series 70as you indicate series 70 barrels would be. That leads me to suspect that the factory delivered this combination, how else would the barrel be marked 45 Auto? If it was changed by a dealer then I think the barrel would be marked series 70. If I remember correctly the first spring broke and the second bent as shown in the pix. The second and third springs may have both been too soft since they both bent as shown above. I‘ll need to be certain of the new springs strength. I am shooting 230G FMJ. and 185 JHP I will replace all three parts as you suggest and see what happens.
 
strangly Colt doesent seem to have a parts list or ordering web site. I would buy the Wolf spring but want to order all the parts from one source.
 
Bru88: As Oro noted (I was wrong...old age), your gun came from the factory with the collet bushing. I've obviously forgotten some things about the older 70's I formerly owned. My current Colts are 80's.

I'm able to view and order all parts directly from the Colt website:

http://www.coltsmfg.com/shop-c25-p0-g8-b0-.aspx
 
Bru: FLGR = Full Length Guide Rod: A solution for a non-existant problem.

Your problems will be solved with a new 16 pound recoil spring and a new recoil spring plug.;)
 
Some of the earlier Series 80 guns had collet bushings. I'm not sure when the transition back to solid bushings occurred, but I own a Series 80 that came from the factory with a collet bushing.
 
Before you go running out and buying your new spring you might want to check your Colt for spring stacking. Stacking your recoil spring is not supposed to happen.
I did have one gun that needed to have a coil or two (don’t remember) cut off. Just put your gun together without the spring in it. Slide the slide all the back. Take
a pencil and draw witness marks on the slide and frame so you can tell how far back the slide will travel. Now put your gun back together with the spring in place.
Slide the slide back all the way. Do the marks still line up? If they do, go buy your spring. If not, cut your spring down until it does. If you have to cut your spring,
you may want to go up to an 18# spring.
Just a thought
Steve
 
Chin: thanks but i found that link and noticed that it doesent show any parts specifically listed for my type bushing and barrel. No mention of series 80 or MK IV at all really strange.
 
The dismissive sentiments of ambidextrous1 & others notwithstanding, I had a nice Colt 1911 made in May 1918 that ate recoil springs. I spoke with a nationally known smith (Alex Hamilton) & he said the simplest approach would be a FLGR. I installed it and never had another problem. He did not have strong sentiments about them and said if you like it, fine, and if not, fine. In my case, the problem existed, and the FLGR solved it without any alterations to a pristine, if imperfect 1911. If you continue to have problems, it's a relatively inexpensive thing to try. I have one in my Combat Commander because I like it and it adds a little weight on the front end (it would be more of a difference on a Commander). If it doesn't solve your problem or you decide you don't like it, post it in the "For Sale" area & move on.
Just my 2 cents & experience,
Maj Dad
 
Assemble the gun and pull up/push down on the front of the slide to see how much vertical slop is present. I've seen a couple with a lot of slack eat springs and guide rods like that. If that's the problem, a FLGR will stop it as a quick fix. The real cure is to tighten the vertical slop. Peening and other stuff required.
 
Bru88: Standard recoil plugs & recoil spring guide rods are universal for all Colt full-sized Government Models (they fit both the Series 70 & 80 models).

Nothing special to look for other than desired finish (blued, stainless, or nickel).

The ones listed on the Colt website will fit your weapon.

Springs are procured based upon poundage you desire. Again, the standard factory spring is the 16 lb. one listed for the .45 ACP Government Model.
 
Tuner

I don’t have any wire gauges at the moment so I used newspaper as a gauge.

With the slide in normal firing position I was able to fit one strip cut from newspaper between the front most end of the frame and the slide. Two pieces of paper were too much to move in the slot even when holding the slide away from the frame. When squeezing the frame and slide together they held the one sheet of paper tightly. So my estimate is that the play at the front end is a little more than one sheet of newspaper.

Seems tight enough to me. What do you say???
 
Is it me or is something odd about the barrel link? It appears cracked and could be the cause of the whole problem.
 
Plenty tight, Bru...so that's not your problem, even though the damage to the spring and the end of the guide rod is identical to those that are loose enough to throw the slide up at the front. The damage to the plug is being caused by the spring becoming pinched between the end of the guide rod and the lip of the plug.

That only leaves the issue of a misalignment between the spring tunnels in the frame and slide. There's also a possibility that the impact abutment in the frame wasn't machined square, and is causing the guide rod to angle upward as the spring compresses.

If you can borrow a FLGR and install it in the gun, you'll probably find that the slide gets into a bind at roughly half travel. If it does...it's either misaligned, or the impact abutment is cattywampus...with my best WAG pointing toward the former.

I saw a 1918 Colt...loose as a goose...that would eat the spring and the end of the guide rod with one magazine. Peening the rails to reduce the vertical slop cured it.
 
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