Requirements Set For Ultimate Survival Rifle

[ImARugerFan]

A 223 is too large of a gun and the ammo takes up too much space. Also you may not be able to preserve large game so you will need to take small game. A .22 is your best bet. I'd opt for a lever model. You can still take deer with a well placed head shot and you can bring thousands of rounds of ammo easily. A .22 mag or 17HMR might be even better, but expensive to stockpile the ammo.

 

[JFrame]

Mp7 said:

Hmmm.....

after reading ALL this

i think a .22 magnum bolt action
and a .22 magnum revolver
would be the optimum in efficiency.

one brick of magnum ammo for hunting
and sniping the BGs
and 2 bricks of regular .22 for small game.

Since I already have a Winchester Trapper in .357, a S&W 686, and a S&W Pro-60, that would prolly be my "go to" combo.

But if I had to start from the ground up, Mp7's solution intrigues me.

In fact -- I may pick up a bolt .22 magnum, just for the heck of it...

 

[IndianaBoy]

No question in my mind.

Bolt action 22 rifle.

Only 22 rimfire or perhaps 22 magnum can you carry enough ammunition for a true survival rifle to be worth the weight of carrying it around.

How much ammo can you carry for a centerfire? 100 rounds? 200 maybe? It starts to get heavy.


1500 rounds of 22lr will last a long time for getting game. Eventually that too will run out.

Survival is not the same game as self defense.. not by a long shot.

Anyone considering a semi-auto is smoking something. A myriad of parts and springs to potentially break.

Less is more... when it absolutely has to work.

 

[Nolo]

The M14 has me covered. It's the ultimate do-it-all rifle. Accurate, easy to shoot, powerful, high capacity, easy to find parts.

Ugh.
You know why I used the M14 as an example in the OP?
Because the M14 is the rifle I would probably love if it weren't for the legion of people who interject everywhere saying it's the best rifle in the world for EVERYTHING.
It's not.
Do the M14 a favor: stop tooting its horn.

 

[freedom lover]

I did'nt read the whole thread, but I think a 30-30 levergun with a suppressor and a .22lr revolver would probably work pretty well.

You could take big game up to moose relatively easily, defend against black bears in a pinch, and use the quieter .22 for hunting other things.

It's light and rugged. The ammo is plentiful. The suppressor allows you greater maneuverability against larger enemy forces by making you harder to find. The rifle also allows quick follow-up shots. There are no mags to lose.

Hopefully with this set-up you could hunt, reload brass, and sneak around without being noticed. With this, some basic survival gear, and alot of knowledge, you could live for a good while.

 

[Tarvis]

A 223 is too large of a gun and the ammo takes up too much space. Also you may not be able to preserve large game so you will need to take small game.

Poppycock. My vote is 223 for it's light weight, ample energy for survival and low enough energy to take small game without making hamburger. Also, it can be had in a light enough platform to make packing it a non-issue. ALSO, in a platform such as the AR-15, you can get a 22lr conversion, making it very ideal. Boosh.

If you're looking for ideas, how about this thought: though a piston system is good for keeping your rifle clean, a DI system has fewer moving parts that can break. Breakage parts (extractor, bolt) on an AR can be stored in a grip system such as the MIAD, but piston parts would be difficult. If you are hunting for food in a survival situation, you wouldn't be worried about going hungry if you had malfunctions due to fouling, which despite what the know-nothings say, is quite a lot more than 10.

Here's my ideal survival rifle: AR15 with a 11.5 inch chrome lined barrel, A2 sights, collapsible stock with a suppressor. 2 stanag magazines and a ceiner 22lr conversion kit with 1 magazine.

M14...easy to find parts

Yeah right. When the world ends as we know it, the internet probably won't be running and I'm sure Dick and Harry's Tickle Shop will be pretty much closed.

A myriad of parts and springs to potentially break

After how many rounds? What is the practical life of an AR bolt, 8000 rounds before you even consider replacing the extractor?

You've either brought enough for yourself, or tough noogies

Enter Tarvis the ant, who is more than willing to trade some 22lr ammo to the grasshopper for some supplies . Business man till the end.

Remember, for a SHTF rifle, you don't need to kill attackers, just wound them so they can't chase you.

Excellent point, never thought of that.

 

[goon]

Most people who have seriously investigated long-term survival scenarios tend to agree that what you have when you start is all you can expect to have.

See there's proponents of all views...

Didn't quote your whole post to save space.
But I think the point of the OP is to consider all of those scenarios.
It seems that versatility would be our friend.

Enter Tarvis the ant, who is more than willing to trade some 22lr ammo to the grasshopper for some supplies . Business man till the end.

Sure you would, at least if it benefits you.
But what if the grasshopper doesn't have anything you need to trade to you?
In that case, it doesn't matter how many rounds of .22 you have on your shelves because he ain't getting any of it.
So much for common ammo that can be found in any home in the US being the most important thing, huh?
Looks like the grasshopper should have filled two ammo cans with .22LR back when he had the chance...

 

[SwampWolf]

Survival is not the same game as self defense.. not by a long shot.

Well, survival may not always mean self-defense but self-defense always means survival...

 

[HB]

My vote is 223 for it's light weight, ample energy for survival and low enough energy to take small game without making hamburger.

I'm pretty sure if you shot a squirrel with .223, you'd get a lot less than hamburger.... Think beverage.

My vote goes to a .22 bolt or semi. I don't have bears, not real worried about people, and confiendent that I can shoot it well. I think the best gun though, is still a 12 gauge. Wide range of ammo makes the 12 gauge king inside 100 yards.

The .22 is great because it will kill a deer if you are close, and is OK on everything smaller.

A pistol would be pretty worthless outside of the city. It's just to hard to shoot well when your real hungry

 

[gvnwst]

I would choose anything from the .223 family, from a .221 rem fireball to the 6.5 MPC. a .22lr would be my other choice, but range is limited to 100yd.

 

[hoosier8]

10/22 and a wheelbarrow.

Don't you mean "assault wheelbarrow"???

 

[hoosier8]

U.S.SFC_RET said one each AR-7 .22lr if you had to pick only one rifle.

The AR-7 which is now sold by Henry Repeating Arms for general use. The barrel and two magazines store in the stock and floats. If it is SHTF then pull a rifle from the house. For a BOB, this will stow in a 3-day pack and is only something like 2.5 pounds.

http://www.henryrepeating.com/h002_survival.cfm

Or if you want to share ammunition with a pistol in a common caliber of either 9mm or .40 and still have a packable rifle. A bit heavier at 4 pounds.

http://www.kel-tec-cnc.com/sub2000.htm

If you have a BOL, then anything you can store there is fine but if you are going to have to travel, every pound will count.

 

[jpatterson]

Ehrm, according to the Zombie Survival Guide a bolt .22 is the ultimate survival gun.

Yes that is a real book. Yes, I read it

 

[Deer Hunter]

It was only one of the tools mentioned in Max Brooks's The Zombie Survival Guide, Patterson. Don't forget about the other rifles and tools mentioned.

 

[Nolo]

Ehrm, according to the Zombie Survival Guide a bolt .22 is the ultimate survival gun.

Yes that is a real book. Yes, I read it

Actually, Max was a much bigger fan of the M1 Carbine, from what I understand.
Doesn't matter, though, everyone knows the American 180 is the end-all, be-all zombie survival gun...

 

[Blakenzy]

If I were lost, cold and hungry, facing the fact that I would probably have to walk great distances in horrible terrain and live off either insects or small furry(or slimy) animals, I would choose to carry a Henry survival .22LR as mentioned above.

At most, I would burden myself with short trapper-style .357 lever carbine, but that would be a distant second.

Now if were talking a Mad Max survival scenario... I would go with an M249 automatic rifle.

 

[HB]

Ehrm, according to the Zombie Survival Guide a bolt .22 is the ultimate survival gun.

Yes that is a real book. Yes, I read it

The best book ever written, kept me and my friends entertained for hours, especially because my friend owns 4, and keeps one by his bed, one by his front and back door, and one in his car. Yeah, he'll be ready...... Did I mention this dude is a strange bird indeed.

HB

 

[fletchbutt152]

Tough Question

For simplicity and reliability: Jap Arisaka Type 99. Very strong action and mine comes apart in less than 2 dozen pieces...completely (or close to it). One of my friends no kidding shot a deer 5 times with 7.7mm in the time I could bring up my Browning BAR.

For a semi, may I suggest inertia driven? Haven't shot a rifle but the shotguns by Benelli are amazing. Simple, clean, reliable. Any thoughts on this one?

Phil

 

[JFrame]

fletchbutt152 said:

For simplicity and reliability: Jap Arisaka Type 99. Very strong action and mine comes apart in less than 2 dozen pieces...completely (or close to it). One of my friends no kidding shot a deer 5 times with 7.7mm in the time I could bring up my Browning BAR.

I hope this is a reflection on your friend's marksmanship, and not a reflection on the dropping power of the 7.7mm!

 

[tango2echo]

Just my 9/10ths of a penny...but I would love to have a marlin papoose in .17HMR in SS with a hollow composite stock <that holds extra ammo>. Camo dipped finish with a low magnification dot scope would be nice too.

...or...How about a Ruger Charger pistol in .17 HMR that also has the above features.

 

[chad1043]

I think your best options would be a 30-30... Lever action.

I would also consider a .22... You can get a 981T that take 22shorts, longs, and long rifles... I hear those 22 shorts are pretty quite...

Chad

 

[futureranger]

a mini-14 might work, semi auto, 223, hi cap mags, not heavy, can put optics on it... i dont know how reliable they are but if its close to the m1a1 you cant go wrong

 

[d2wing]

XD9fan has the best answer I think. I have a wide variety to choose from.
My short list is my 30-30, rem 30-06, ar, Saiga 7.62x39, 10/22, 357 revolver, 9mm pistol, 22lr target pistol. My first thought was the ar, but if I had to carry everything on my back I'm thinking 22 target pistol. An A7 or other small 22lr rifle would be appealing too. Of course if I could stay home or have gas to drive, that would be different. But everyone has their own ideas.
A target pistol with a light rifle stock, bingo. I see merit in many ideas, but I would not devote too much weight to guns and ammo, if I have to carry everything I need. Food, shelter, medical supplies, fishing gear, snares.
This would be different in an urban area. In a city you may have to fight others to survive in which case an ar with a 22lr insert makes sense. I shoot shotgun more than anything because I hunt upland game, But in a survival situation that really isn't efficient, Unless you have a basecamp and stockpile of ammo. Same with a big game rifle unless you have a camp and need to feed a group of people. I don't know if theres a size fits all.

 

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

I thought some pics of my wilderness-survival type guns would help this thread along some.

From the top:

1. NEF Survivor SB1, .45 Colt & .410 shot
2. CZ/Springfield M6 Scout, .22 lr over / .410 shot under
3. Savage 24, .22lr over / 20 ga under
4. Baikal/Spartan SPR94, 12 ga over / .223 Rem under

And I stand by what I said on page 3 (with mild editing) - it has yet to be topped:

Seems we focusing on subsistence survival where the gun's main use is food gathering. So I will bring this up....

I was saving this for a future thread, but for my aforementioned Spartan/Baikal SPR 94 combo gun in 12 ga & .223 Rem, I am ordering chamber adapters which will allow .22lr in the .223 chamber, one for .22 mag, and one for .22 hornet.

So, once I get these chamber adapters, with this gun I'll be able to shoot:

1. Anything 12 gauge from smoothbore, with all that that entails
--Foster slugs
--Buckshot
--Birdshot
(so already we can kill anything on earth, standing still or moving, except maybe a blue whale. But range is a bit limited).
2. .223 Remington for long shots on small, medium, and large game. And with a heavy bonded bullet and a head shot, there's virtually nothing on earth that cannot be killed with this.
3. .22 hornet for small and medium game
4. .22 magnum for small game
5. .22lr for small game, with very lightweight & cheap ammo
I can also shoot .22lr shotshells and .22 magnum shotshells through the .223 bore with the chamber adapters. With these small shotshells, you can shoot "tweety birds" without destroying much meat, and the reality is that tweety birds are the most common and easy to find/easy to hunt edible protein in the wilderness, so this is an important point.

Store the chamber adapters in a stock cheekpiece unit with a zipper pocket, and just cannot possibly get any more versatile. I don't think there's any way to say that any other gun is better for the food gathering / subsistence survival scenario.

Let's not forget that the vast majority of shootable meat/protein food in a real survival situation are small, smaller, and smallest in size, where the .308 scout rifle will blow them to smithereens, leaving no meat. Raccoons, beaver, opossum, groundhogs, armadillos, turkeys, ducks, quail, doves, crows, tweety birds, squirrels, rabbits, rats, mice, voles, gophers, etc. The scout rifle or any "full-powered" rifle chambered in .308 or similar may be an excellent choice for survival where self-defense is involved, it is an exceptionally poor choice (relative to the alternatives) for subsistence/food-gathering survival (and incidentally, both are inferior to a fishing pole & some snares - if you're limited to either/or for some reason). You might hit the jackpot with an ungulate (deer), or you might go a whole season without getting one, as I have done in the past. Dunno about you, but I cannot survive 3 months without food. Tweety birds will taste mighty yummy after a mere 3 days in the woods - and tweety birds take all of about 5-10 minutes of sitting still to see and shoot one.

 

[d2wing]

I looks like you're doing your homework, LOL. I suppose a person could wear 2 ammo belts.