Revolver Training Help Request

[richardluther]

I'll come clean...

Former Marine who's shot the M9 religiously since 1992. Love my service weapon. After discharge I purchased my own and with the .22lr conversion and a year long range pass I shoot a brick a week out of my M9.

However...

After purchasing a S&W .38+p snubby as a backup I realize how much I suck at shooting double action revolvers.

1. My trigger pull is terrible
2. The gun shatters my hand upon recoil
3. Zero consistency on my part

It's like I'm a boot cherry picking up a weapon for the first time.

Question: Best training DVD, method, book for learning defensive revolver.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Rexster]

First of all, welcome to THR, and thanks for being a Marine!

Search for stuff by Ed Lovette, Mas Ayoob and Michael DeBethancourt. They have written GOOD stuff on using small snubbies. Ed Lovette's book is readily available through normal booksellers, and is a good place to start. Mas Ayoob and Michael DeBethancourt teach classes, and Michael teaches actual snubby classes.

Small-framed snubbies are a different animal than larger-framed autos and revolvers. Don't feel bad about having problems. Unless a person has really petite hands, small-framed snubbies are a challenge. Make sure to hold high on the backstrap. While this is true of all handguns, it is doubly important with snubbies, yet is easy to overlook when trying to make a tiny weapon fit a large hand. Try to use the strong middle finger and ring finger to really lock that grip tightly against the web of your hand. If your pinkie is not able to grab onto the grip, curl it tightly under the grip; this is a snubby tip I read that was written by Mas, though I am able to get all of my fingers on a J-frame and SP101 snubbies, so pass it on with faith that it works for guys with bigger hands than mine.

Placement of the trigger finger will have to be adapted, and will depend on the size and shape of your hand. If you are using the "pad" of your finger on a regular-sized weapon's trigger, you will almost certainly have to reach just a bit further with a small snubby. This may cause the fingertip to hit the frame near the end of the trigger stroke, or be pinched between the trigger and frame, so watch out for that.

 

[Rexster]

www.snubtraining.com

This is Michael DeBethancourt's website, which I just found in an online search. It has FAQs and links that seem to be really helpful. He is more or less THE snubby guru. I attended a two-hour class he taught at the Snubby Summit in December 2005, a one-time event that brought together other giants of handgun training. This two-hour class was a sampler of Michael's two-day class. I hope to someday travel to the Northeast to attend the two-day class.

Don't call him Mike! He is a very humble, personable guy, but does not like Mike.

 

[Oyeboten]

Hi richardluther,



Consider to begin practice with light-load flat Wadcutters...say, at 10 Yards.


Arbitrarily load only two chambers of the Cylinder, and, ignore their position so you shall not know to anticipate a live or dead chamber when firing.


Operate the Revolver in the Double Action mode.


Then, you may better see if you are being smooth and steady, or, flinching or leading or other making an adverse motion during pulls or when the Hammer falls.

Have your interest be on the manner and awareness of hold and operation of the mechanism, and, with-hold interest from Target results or looking to the Target to see about how the shots or groups are doing.

Aim sensibly for the Bulls Eye, of course, but, go slow, and, have your interest in handling the Revolver, foremost.

Is the Revolver's Grip too large or small or too shallow for your Hand size?

Would different Stocks/Grips remedy this?

And or, a 'Tyler-T' augmentation?



I only shoot one-handed...or, with rare exception.

If learning a 'Snubby', I'd suggest you do so one Handed also...then, later, once proficient, if you like, adapt the second Hand to join the hold.




Trigger 'Pull' should be as if Hydraulic - slow, constant, definite...not sudden or in any way irregular from start to finish...unconcerned as for when the Hammer falls.

Go through six shots/pulls if your Cylinder holds 'six', or, five if 'five'...with a steady, smooth sequence and no pauses or hurry.

Merely keep your Sights toward the Bullseye as the Revolver and Sight Picture wanders, and, it is normal for it to wander...and ignore the wander, while having your interest on a smooth steady operation of the mechanism.


Index Finger...the center of the 'pad' should be on the Trigger...or, the part just slightly past/outside the center of the pad, either way, depending on finger strength. Center of 'pad' is fine, probably best....but not the last joint's wrinkle or fold, nor close to it, which puts the finger too far in or past the optimum position.


One's hold or grip should be absolutely firm, rock solid...and as high as possible on the Revolver's Grip-Frame, and, as much as possible, of a sort where the Hand and Wrist are in a straight line/align with the long bones of the forearm...and, for the long axis of the Revolver, to be in this line/align.


Try these things, patiently, and, I am confident you will find satisfaction.

 

[Oro]

I agree with what Oyeboten said and reduce it to:

1) Get a grip adapter
2) Tight fore-aft grip on the gun to stabilize the platform.
3) Lots of dry firing to learn the grip and trigger skills as well as trigger strength.

A lot of practice with this (LOTS of dry firing) and you will be amazed how accurately you can shoot a 2" S&W j frame.

 

[pezo]

+1 on the dryfiring. You need to get the trigger control down while maintaing a sight picture. Revolvers are all about the dryfiring.

 

[Colt Smith]

richardluther,

Just wanted to say, thanks for your service.

 

[Colt Smith]

These are helpful. Click the link for the streaming video of Jerry Miculek down the left side bar.

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/...1&storeId=10001&catalogId=10001&content=11001

 

[MrBorland]

Question: Best training DVD, method, book for learning defensive revolver.

Check out Clint Smith's promo. My bet is his DVD is very good.

Oh, yeah, and practice, dry fire, yadda yadda....


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xOVWwOahGf8

americanhandgunner.com/TRvids. html

 

[M2 Carbine]

After purchasing a S&W .38+p snubby as a backup I realize how much I suck at shooting double action revolvers.

1. My trigger pull is terrible
2. The gun shatters my hand upon recoil
3. Zero consistency on my part

You're working too hard at it.
Just get a good grip.
Keep your mind on MAINTAINING the proper sight picture as you squeeze the trigger.
Try loading just one round and spinning the cylinder before closing it. You will see what you are doing wrong.
Do this when ever you are getting wild.

At the moment I have two young girls and a 11 year old boy shooting my 2-3 inch S&W J Frames. The practice ammo is 158 grain full load lead SWC.
The kids shoot a lot of ammo at a time, so not only would shooting all +P be too expensive, it would be too punishing. Save the +P for defense.

Shooting is shooting. If you shoot the M9 well you can shoot the little revolver well.
Sight picture and trigger squeeze is all it takes.

Having never touched a gun in her life, in about an hour, the first time shooting, this girl went from a Ruger 22/45 to shooting the J Frame while moving.
Shooting DA while back-peddling.


This is her target. Shooting while moving backward, right and left. By now she had put about 50 rounds through the J Frame.
The last thing I had her do is shoot SA, 10 yards, 5 shots in the head. She made a smiley face.
(The missed shot over the shoulder and the near miss in the head and shoulder were three of her shots when she was moving right and left.)



A couple days ago I shot this 2x2 foot steel plate at 52 yards, DA, standing, two hands, with a 3 inch S&W J Frame. I missed one shot.



The point I'm trying to make is, target shooting with most any gun just isn't all that hard.
Maintain the correct sight picture and use proper trigger control and the bullet has to hit pretty close to where you want it.

If a young girl in her first hour of shooting and a 72 year old fart with weak eyes and shaking hands can shoot the J Frame decently, most anyone can.


(USMC 1955-1963)





.

 

[Sam1911]

Shooting a revolver is fundamentally different from shooting an autoloader. There are a few things that you should do with a revolver that are distinctly contrary to best autopistol practice.

The genius, the dean, the wizard of revolver shooters is Jerry Miculek. He has six short videos covering his techniques available for free.

Watch each of these a few times. Pay careful attention to what he says about grip and trigger control. His instructions are not what you probably expect.

http://www.myoutdoortv.com/pdk/web/smith.html?feedPID=00zG15zm84msK0GbWemanhJ0KNWQYqM4

Good luck!

-Sam