Crowman
Member
This is a long one because a certain amount of background to the problem is needed.
Now for a little background...My friend's all-weather stainless steel (with black plastic stock) Ruger M77 Hawkeye rifle started rusting last year on the barrel exterior. He keeps it in a gunsafe with a working Golden Rod heater in it. There are other stainless rifles and blued ones also stored there with no oxidation problems.
We contacted Ruger about the rust problem and they had him return the rifle with bolt and the scope rings, but less sling and scope, to the factory.
It was repaired and returned a couple of months later with no comment as to what work was done. We carefully examined the returned rifle and noted that there was not a single scratch anywhere on the rifle action or stock despite previous use. There was no wear in the bolt area and lug locking area of the action. Interestingly enough, the returned bolt was definitely the original. It showed normal wear and use. You could tell that it had been fired before. The bore was immaculate. Before he returned the rifle to Ruger, you could definitely tell that the rifle had been used. Even though the serial number was the same, it appears that he got a brand new rifle back, but with the original rings and bolt.
Because of all this, we needed to re-install his scope and re-zero the rifle. They returned the original stainless scope rings, which were still completely oxidized with almost black and brown splotches. We were surprised at this and would have thought they would have returned new rings. We were careful to keep the rings together as a matched pair. The rings were checked for concentricity using a pair of 1" centers and then lapped until concentric. Then the scope ring screws were uniformly torqued to about 16 inch/lbs. We also checked that his rifle's action screws were tight...they were. Very tight. Also noted that there was firm contact between the stock fore-end and the barrel. Looked like it was firmly "bedded" in the plastic stock.
Yesterday, my friend and I went to our range to zero our hunting rifles. Mine is a Remington 700 LSS Mountain Rifle in .260 Remington (firing a 140 grain Nosler Partition handload). His all-weather Ruger M77 Hawkeye rifle is chambered in 7mm-08 Remington (Firing 140 grain Combined Technologies bullet and 139 grain Hornady SST handloads). Both of us are using Nikon ProStaff 3-9X40 BDC scopes. He is using the original Ruger rings. His Ruger was previously zero'ed with the two handloads shooting about 1" to 1-1/4" groups of each other at 100 yards prior to being returned to the factory. This was so he could select what bullet he wanted and still have both hit to roughly the same point of aim.
We started with both our rifles in a gun vise and we re-checked scope screws, then used a collimator to adjust both scopes. Next we went to the 25 yard bench and set-up a Lead Sled with two lead shot bags (50#). We set his rifle into the rest and shot a 3-shot string and adjusted his scope so that the shots were hitting paper. His shots did not group but all were on the paper. We next shot mine. They were well grouped.
Now for the problem...We moved to the 100 yard range, set up the Lead Sled and zero'ed my rifle. Shot practically one ragged hole. I'm done. Next we set up his rifle. Could not get a group smaller than 5-6 inches with either load. Shots would not group consistently, some stringing vertically with several inches in between impacts. Others were 12 o-clock, 3 o-clock, and about 7 o-clock, with over 4' between shots. Both of us shot the rifle just to make sure there was no "operator error". Also noted that small scope corrections did not affect point of impact much. We tried three of his proven handloads and none would group.
Not sure whether problem is that the original handloads no longer work in this rifle now, or whether there may be some stock issues, or what. The scope was kept in original factory box while rifle was out for repair, and never dropped. Don't think scope will go from great to dud sitting in a box for a couple of months.
We are two old retired farts on a fixed income (can't afford fancy gunsmith work) who've been shooting a variety of guns for more than a century between the two of us. We're stumped.
Any thoughts?
Now for a little background...My friend's all-weather stainless steel (with black plastic stock) Ruger M77 Hawkeye rifle started rusting last year on the barrel exterior. He keeps it in a gunsafe with a working Golden Rod heater in it. There are other stainless rifles and blued ones also stored there with no oxidation problems.
We contacted Ruger about the rust problem and they had him return the rifle with bolt and the scope rings, but less sling and scope, to the factory.
It was repaired and returned a couple of months later with no comment as to what work was done. We carefully examined the returned rifle and noted that there was not a single scratch anywhere on the rifle action or stock despite previous use. There was no wear in the bolt area and lug locking area of the action. Interestingly enough, the returned bolt was definitely the original. It showed normal wear and use. You could tell that it had been fired before. The bore was immaculate. Before he returned the rifle to Ruger, you could definitely tell that the rifle had been used. Even though the serial number was the same, it appears that he got a brand new rifle back, but with the original rings and bolt.
Because of all this, we needed to re-install his scope and re-zero the rifle. They returned the original stainless scope rings, which were still completely oxidized with almost black and brown splotches. We were surprised at this and would have thought they would have returned new rings. We were careful to keep the rings together as a matched pair. The rings were checked for concentricity using a pair of 1" centers and then lapped until concentric. Then the scope ring screws were uniformly torqued to about 16 inch/lbs. We also checked that his rifle's action screws were tight...they were. Very tight. Also noted that there was firm contact between the stock fore-end and the barrel. Looked like it was firmly "bedded" in the plastic stock.
Yesterday, my friend and I went to our range to zero our hunting rifles. Mine is a Remington 700 LSS Mountain Rifle in .260 Remington (firing a 140 grain Nosler Partition handload). His all-weather Ruger M77 Hawkeye rifle is chambered in 7mm-08 Remington (Firing 140 grain Combined Technologies bullet and 139 grain Hornady SST handloads). Both of us are using Nikon ProStaff 3-9X40 BDC scopes. He is using the original Ruger rings. His Ruger was previously zero'ed with the two handloads shooting about 1" to 1-1/4" groups of each other at 100 yards prior to being returned to the factory. This was so he could select what bullet he wanted and still have both hit to roughly the same point of aim.
We started with both our rifles in a gun vise and we re-checked scope screws, then used a collimator to adjust both scopes. Next we went to the 25 yard bench and set-up a Lead Sled with two lead shot bags (50#). We set his rifle into the rest and shot a 3-shot string and adjusted his scope so that the shots were hitting paper. His shots did not group but all were on the paper. We next shot mine. They were well grouped.
Now for the problem...We moved to the 100 yard range, set up the Lead Sled and zero'ed my rifle. Shot practically one ragged hole. I'm done. Next we set up his rifle. Could not get a group smaller than 5-6 inches with either load. Shots would not group consistently, some stringing vertically with several inches in between impacts. Others were 12 o-clock, 3 o-clock, and about 7 o-clock, with over 4' between shots. Both of us shot the rifle just to make sure there was no "operator error". Also noted that small scope corrections did not affect point of impact much. We tried three of his proven handloads and none would group.
Not sure whether problem is that the original handloads no longer work in this rifle now, or whether there may be some stock issues, or what. The scope was kept in original factory box while rifle was out for repair, and never dropped. Don't think scope will go from great to dud sitting in a box for a couple of months.
We are two old retired farts on a fixed income (can't afford fancy gunsmith work) who've been shooting a variety of guns for more than a century between the two of us. We're stumped.
Any thoughts?