Rimfire "assault" weapons "re-banned" in CT

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Stargazer65

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OK, so much for the surge in new rimfire AR-15s in CT I had previously predicted.:( This was snuck through the legislature, I didn't even hear about it until this morning. Of course you can still buy AR-15 style 22's, they just can only have one scary feature like before.

http://www.ctpost.com/local/article/Legislature-closes-gun-law-loophole-4573142.php
The state House and Senate grappled with unintended consequences of the landmark response to the Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting on Monday, repairing a mistake in the law that since April legalized a formerly banned style of rifle.
Both chambers acted to again make lower-powered .22-caliber rifles illegal if they take detachable ammunition magazines and have two characteristics of assault-style weapons, such as a pistol grip, a folding stock or a clip for a bayonet.
The rifles, called rimfire weapons, were not addressed in April's wide-ranging bill, but had previously been prohibited under the state's 20-year-old ban on assault weapons.l
 
Wow. Really??

I was planning on using M&P 22's in my rifle training courses later this year in IL. Considering most new gun owners go straight to AR platforms it makes sense to get kids used to the ergonomics.

I guess this wouldn't go over too well in CT...
 
I think we can still get a CT version of an M&P22 with the stock pinned, no flash arrestor, no bayonet lug as before. The stores still sell them, as long as it only has one scary feature (the pistol grip).:rolleyes: The new stricter ban that doesn't allow any scary features applies only to centerfire. This issue was when they passed the new tighter AWB they went from allowing one scary feature to allowing none, and so effectively banned centerfire AR-15s. However when they did that the wording was such that rimfires were completely exempted, whereas previously rimfires could not have more than one scary feature. This was actually an unintentional loosening of the ban as applied to rimfire. I thought this was an intentional concession, but apparently it was not.

If this all sounds very confusing, you're not alone. When people who are gun enthusiasts find it confusing, you know it's a bad law. The people voting for it don't find it confusing because they use a BLF data processor (Brady Logic Filter: gun=bad, gun control=good). :banghead:
 
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Well, that's kinda what we discussed last week, Stargazer...

So, after our last conversation, (when i realized .22's were GTG in current CT law), i went back to a project I'd shelved a while back, to put a Carcano cavalry carbine folding bayonet on a 10/22....so i'm assuming it's grandfathered now...

So, all the S&W M+P sport rifles are banned by name, but the .22's were still being sold...i guess this changed that? or will they just need a stripped model with no muzzle device, etc.
 
Life, they don't care. Proper terminology means nothing to them, (the shoulder thing that goes up?), what matters is disarming the peasants, nothing more.
 
Politicians need to learn what the term Assault Rifle even means

Why? What makes you think that the vast majority of them don't already know what it means?

You could post the definition along with pictures, explanations, etc, across the front of the legislative chambers in 4 foot high letters and it wouldn't make a bit of difference in how they vote.
 
So, all the S&W M+P sport rifles are banned by name, but the .22's were still being sold...i guess this changed that? or will they just need a stripped model with no muzzle device, etc.

As I understand it, you will still be able to buy a stripped .22 Rimfire AR-15 model. The naughty list specifically says centerfire:

(Embellishment mine)
The bill expands the banned weapons to include the following evil:evil: semiautomatic centerfire rifles, or copies or duplicates with the capability or evil:evil: of any such rifles, that were in production before or on the effective date of the bill: AK 47; AK 74, AKM, AKS-74U, ARM, MAADI AK 47, MAK90, MISR, NHM90, NHM91, Norinco 56, 56S, 84S and 86S, Poly Technologies AKS and AK47, SA 85, SA 93, VEPR, WASR-10, WUM, Rock River Arms LAR-47 and Vector Arms AK-47; AR-10; AR-15; Bushmaster Carbon 15, Bushmaster XM15, Bushmaster ACR Rifles, Bushmaster MOE Rifles; Colt Match Target Rifles; Armalite M15; Olympic Arms AR-15, A1, CAR, PCR, K3B, K30R, K16, K48, K8 and K9 Rifles; DPMS Tactical Rifles; Smith and Wesson M&P15 Rifles; Rock River Arms LAR-15; Doublestar AR Rifles; Barrett REC7; Beretta Storm; Calico Liberty 50, 50 Tactical, 100, 100 Tactical, I, I Tactical, II and II Tactical Rifles; Hi-Point Carbine Rifles; HK-PSG-1; Kel-Tec Sub-2000, SU Rifles, and RFB; Remington Tactical Rifle Model 7615; SAR-8, SAR-4800 and SR9; SLG 95; SLR 95 or 96; TNW M230 and M2HB; Vector Arms UZI, Galil and Galil Sporter; Daewoo AR 100 and AR 110C; Fabrique Nationale/FN 308 Match and L1A1 Sporter; HK USC; IZHMASH Saiga AK; SIG Sauer 551-A1, 556, 516, 716 and M400 Rifles; Valmet M62S, M71S and M78S; Wilkinson Arms Linda Carbine; and Barrett M107A1.

So you can have a stripped rimfire AR-15 because rimfire allows one naughty feature (pistol grip) , but you cannot have a centerfire AR-15 at all because zero naughty features are allowed on centerfire.
 
So you can have a stripped rimfire AR-15 because rimfire allows one naughty feature (pistol grip) , but you cannot have a centerfire AR-15 at all because zero naughty features are allowed on centerfire.

Well you can still have an AR without a pistol grip, it being like a thumb hole stock. So what's their reasoning for outright banning AR's if you're able to make one with zero evil features?

I believe a lot if folks do this in Cali to reduce the number of evil features while still being in compliance with other features on their gun.
 
I suspect this may have happened in one way or another due to Stag Arms' decision to come out with a .22lr AR variant, which was publicized in local media. I believe one of "Stutters" Malloy's cronies said that by doing so, Stag "violates the spirit of the law." Knowing how vindictive and wildly anti-gun these people are, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if it was at least part of this move against rimfires.

Pathetic, really. I'm not the least bit upset with Stag, but it appears Hoffman's in Newington, was -

aty3ysa8_zpse7d972d5.jpg

They took this down shortly thereafter. Pretty amazing, first they required a pistol permit to buy an AR-15 or similar a while back, now this.
 
Well you can still have an AR without a pistol grip, it being like a thumb hole stock. So what's their reasoning for outright banning AR's if you're able to make one with zero evil features?

They covered thumbhole stocks and other workarounds also:


The bill also bans any semiautomatic, centerfire rifle, regardless of the date produced, that can accept a detachable magazine that has at least one of the following features:

1. a folding or telescoping stock;

2. any grip of the weapon, including a pistol grip, thumbhole stock, or other stock that would allow an individual to grip the weapon, resulting in any finger on the trigger hand in addition to the trigger finger being directly below any portion of the action of the weapon when firing;

3. a forward pistol grip;

4. a flash suppressor; or

5. a grenade launcher or flare launcher.

Maybe somebody will make a new legal workaround, but I don't see how you could get around #2. I suppose you could make one and not put on the pistol grip, but how would you handle it?
 
Well damn. Maybe they're not as stupid as I thought. Would a traditional rifle stock technically put you "under the action"? I'm sure someone could fab something up.

I've found that if there is a law that needs something fabricated to scoot around, the two types of people to do so are gun enthusiasts, and car enthusiasts.
 
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Getting tired of Hoffmans guns, they've got to be the least pro-gun gun shop I've yet to go into, with some of the worst counter-staff of ANY store I've been into...

That aside, I suppose this was only a matter of time, with any luck the lawsuit thats pending at least gets the law put on hold, which would just lead to a massive influx for a short time, I'm certain.
 
Would a traditional rifle stock technically put you "under the action"? I'm sure someone could fab something up.


On an AR I imagine it does, although it does on several untargeted rifles with traditional stocks too, to a lesser extent.
However the trigger on an AR is clearly well below the stock, and the stock lines up with the bolt and action of the firearm. To get the trigger up to the stock would require some sort of linkage system in addition to a traditional rifle stock.
This could be done, but considering how small a market CT is and the production costs to design and market it...
It would also likely result in a mushy gritty trigger with a lousy trigger pull much like many bullpup type conversions do that also use a linkage system.

But yes a stock could be designed that when installed would convert an AR into a firearm that complied with that wording. Where your hand is around the buffer tube area and trigger finger is manipulating a trigger in that area connected to the action of the weapon through some sort of linkage.
But you may be giving up several benefits of the AR platform. Including things beyond just the scope of the legislation such as: Modularity of several areas which would cease to be standard with tons of competing aftermarket accessories, as well as giving up a clean crisp trigger on an accurate gun in favor of a bad one that complies with the law.
 
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Oh, I wasn't expecting a whole contraption to be marketed just to CT. Abd i figured there had to be compromise with functionality. But if I lived in CT, and wanted an AR, I'd fab one up myself just to go :neener: to the ones who wrote and passed these stupid laws.

If they tell me I can't have it, I feel like it's now a necessity to own.
 
This is one direction being taken here in CA. This is the Thorsden FRS-15 stock on my M&P 15 Sport.

DSC_3360-2.jpg

It shoulders really well and is very comfortable to shoot with. The only issue I came up against was reaching the safety lever from a shooting grip. But I worked around it by installing a Hera MPSS 45° ambidextrous safety and fabbing an extended lever for it.

DSC_3370-2.jpg
 
While that's pretty sweet, it'd still not be compliant, I guess. Your hand would be "under the action".

Yeah. Reading the wording of the CT law it would seem that any AR-based rifle is banned...

The bill expands the banned weapons to include the following semiautomatic centerfire rifles, or copies or duplicates with the capability of any such rifles, that were in production before or on the effective date of the bill:...

It's really hard for me to believe that there are actually states with more insane gun laws than we have here in CA.
 
Bharada;

Dude. That stock/grip/whatever thing. That looks cool as hell.

We don't have an AWB in IL but I might just buy one of those because I like the aesthetics.
 
But if I lived in CT, and wanted an AR, I'd fab one up myself just to go:neener: to the ones who wrote and passed these stupid laws.

If they tell me I can't have it, I feel like it's now a necessity to own.

Yeah, I know what you mean. I haven't felt a desire to own one before this year, but I almost impulse bought a $1000 Windham AR-15 in April instead of the $500 Ruger Single Six I was in the shop to buy just because of that feeling. In the end, I bought the revolver anyway because I didn't think a :neener: was worth the $1000.:D
 
Politicians need to learn what the term Assault Rifle even means

Ironically, the term "Assault Rifle" means EXACTLY whatever any politician says it means. That's the purpose of the term.

It's not, in any way, a conceptually defined term with respect to any firearm production or use...not even in the military. The sole purpose of the term is as a scary descriptor to make any gun so described sound "evil", "wicked", or otherwise scary.
 
So I guess my two ruger 10/22's with Butler Creek folding stocks would be included as well?
 
So I guess my two ruger 10/22's with Butler Creek folding stocks would be included as well?

Yep they put a pistol grip on the firearm below the action.


Ironically, the term "Assault Rifle" means EXACTLY whatever any politician says it means.

No that is 'assault weapon' not 'assault rifle'.
Although the two often get used interchangeably adding confusion.
Assault rifles are an actual military item with a definition, which is becoming more fuzzy but is still well defined.
Assault rifles were designed to replace fully automatic submachineguns. Giving increased range and power over pistol caliber subguns.
They found the long range accuracy of many rifles at the time was wasted as few military engagements with small arms were that far away, and so something between a subgun and rifle would be better.
To accomplish this they used weaker cartridges than standard rifles suitable for man sized animals, these weaker cartridges now termed intermediate cartridges, and were designed to fire in fully automatic mode.
The selective fire capability was key to the definition, as the entire purpose of the weaker cartridge that would not hit as hard being utilized was to allow control while being fired fully automatic in the role of a submachinegun.
Without fully automatic capabilities they wouldn't have been using a weaker round to begin with, and would have stuck with battle rifle cartridges that were more effective.

The reason things are slightly outdated today is for example our own military retaining the intermediate cartridge, while primarily using semi automatic fire. While touting benefits like the ability to carry more ammunition.
While the whole purpose behind designs like the AK and original M16 were to compensate for reduced ballistics with fully automatic fire at closer ranges.
'Special forces' still use fully automatic capable versions which is what the platform was designed for, apparently the standard soldier is incapable of wisely using such versions.
Other modern forces can get away with this semi auto weak caliber rifle because they have a lot of other weapons, and 5.56 rifle fire is used more for suppression while bringing a heavy machinegun, more potent rifle, artillery, air support, armored vehicle, etc into the fight.
If the enemy stays put because they can't move without getting hit by 5.56 then something bigger comes along and kills them.
However if the rifleman's role was more like it was in the past they wouldn't be using 5.56 in semi auto. The roles the average rifleman used to fill now reserved for a designated marksman, which don't use 5.56.


While 'assault weapon' on the other hand means whatever they say it means. And includes handguns, shotguns, rifles, and various other firearms. The definition changes on a whim, and means something different in different states.
It often includes civilian semi auto versions of things like AKs and ARs and similar rifles as well, which is what many naive assume it refers to, but goes well beyond that to mean anything they want. In California a regular semi-automatic pistol with a threaded barrel is an 'assault weapon' for example. Just threading the barrel turns it into an assault weapon.

This is one direction being taken here in CA.

The thorsden frs-15 stock would probably not comply with CT law.
However another stock that put the trigger near the rear through some sort of linkage should. That position though could require risers on the rails to give proper height on the sights and optics as the hand would be in the way. It would also require that hand be removed to operate the charging handle.
 
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