S&W pinned and recessed question.

[RobertFBurnett]

Hello...so I might have figured something out tonight...maybe a flash of brilliance...maybe not.

So I'm going over in my head why newer S&Ws aren't recessed...then it comes to me...is it because the recessing was part of the hammer mounted pin system?

Pinned barrels went away for a cheaper alternative as I understand it?

Anyhow, just wondered if I had something with this theory or not.

RFB

 

[Will5A1]

Recessed went away as a cost cutting measure also - S&W continued to use hammer mounted firing pin well into the 90's and beyond; the new, lock free 37-2's currently on the market (RSR still has some in stock) have the old style frame and hammer mounted firing pins.

 

[Feanaro]

Neither was necessary and they cost extra. That's the long and short of it.

 

[Master Blaster]

.22lr revolvers still have recessed chambers, and the firing pin on those (k frames, and J frames since 1930) has always been frame mounted.

A Hammer mounted firing pin is more suseptable to damage than a frame mounted one. The frame mounted pin also allows S&W to use fewer different hammer sizes in their guns so it reduces costs across the line by requiring fewer variations be produced.
The frame mounted pin can be changed by the user fairly easily, while the hammer mounted model requires some real gunsmithing.

The recessed chamber cylinders no longer being made were on magnum calibers only, .38 spl and other non magnum calibers never used a recessed chamber. On magnum calibers it was used to enhance safety, because some balloon head cases were still being used (thinner case head than modern brass) and they could rupture under magnum pressures.

 

[Hawk]

As others have noted there's no connection - recessed and non-recessed cylinders were produced concurrently while hammers had firing pins. The recessed cylinders went away before firing pins migrated to the frame.

I have a tangential question: doesn't the Python have neither recessed cylinders nor hammer mounted firing pins and wasn't it that way since 1955? If so, what would be a guess as to why it took S&W nearly another 30 years to lose the recess? 'Course my memory might be fogged on the Python's configuration and things may have been different in 1955 anyway. It just seems this doesn't come up with the late lamented Colt product.

 

[csmkersh]

.22lr revolvers still have recessed chambers, and the firing pin on those (k frames, and J frames since 1930) has always been frame mounted.

emphasis mine

Say what???

The two handguns in the attached picture are post-1982 and both have hammer mounted firing pins. A Model 36 on the left and a Model 13 on the right.


FWIW, I've an "S" serial numbered Model 57 with pinned barrel, recessed cylinder and hammer mounted firing pin. I've a Model 25 Mountain Gun with an un-pinned barrel, non-recessed cylinder and hammer mounted firing pin. Then there's my Model 29 Mountain Gun with un-pinned barrel, non-recessed cylinder and frame mounted firing pin.

​

 

[The Bushmaster]

Ooops.........

 

[Shear_stress]

Say what???

Master Blaster's talking about rimfire revolvers, not centerfire--though I thought that all S&W rimfire revolvers in the I, J, and K-frames had frame-mounted firing pins going back to about 1911, not 1930 (there was no J-frame in 1930, and, for that matter, no rimfire K-frame until 1931).

 

[Master Blaster]

.22lr revolvers still have recessed chambers, and the firing pin on those (k frames, and J frames since 1930) has always been frame mounted.

 

[Shear_stress]

Again, there were frame-mounted firing pins on I-frame rimfires going back to 1911 and on K-frame rimfires from 1931 (the year the K22 was introduced). There were no frame-mounted firing pins on J-frame rimfires in 1930 because there was no such thing as a J-frame until the 1950s.

 

[csmkersh]

Master Blaster, please note the edit comment on my post.
​

 

[Majic]

On magnum calibers it was used to enhance safety, because some balloon head cases were still being used (thinner case head than modern brass) and they could rupture under magnum pressures.

The .38 spl that the .357 magnum evolved from and the .44 spl that the .44 magnum evolved from never used a balloon head case. They had modern solid head cases. The last balloon head case used was the .45 Colt and Smith didn't recess the chambers for that caliber.

 

[CSA 357]

 

[tipoc]

The recessed cylinders were not due to the balloon head brass, which as Majic pointed out was not used on the 38 or .357., S&W added the recesses as an extra margin of protection against case blowout.

Remember, when the .357 was introduced in the 30s no other handgun round was operating at the pressures it was operating at. Colt's .38 Super was the closest but that was chambered for the 1911. The .357 was S&Ws response to the .38 Super. S&W was concerned about the higher pressures of the new round particularly for reloaders. It was the first time any revolver had been made for a steady diet of round at higher pressures so they added the recessed cylinders for safety. It was the first time the ammo manufacturers were making brass for the new round.

When Colt introduced the Python it was after they had made a serious study of heat treatment for the cylinders and close to 2 decades since the introduction of the round by S&W. They needed no recesses.

The recesses were dropped from all S&W magnum guns by Bangor Punta in the 80s as were the pinned barrrels.

tipoc

 

[M1911]

So I'm going over in my head why newer S&Ws aren't recessed...then it comes to me...is it because the recessing was part of the hammer mounted pin system?

As others have pointed out, there is no connection between the two. I have S&W revolvers with a hammer mounted firing pin, but no pinned barrel and recessed cylinder.