S&W Trigger Work Questions

[ceestand]

If anyone can help me out with some advice here...

First off, I have the Kuhnhausen book (plus the companion video which I have yet to watch). The info in this book is invaluable! I thoroughly recommend it to anyone even thinking of removing a sideplate. I would imagine the other books in the series are as good and I will buy one for future firearms.

Now on to my questions. I have a model 36 which the trigger "sticks." It takes a lot of pressure to get the trigger to start moving, once it initially "breaks" trigger pull feels smooth. I originally pulled the sideplate off and got some gunk out and I thought that was it. But it wasn't. Even if it is gunk inside, I am convinced I will have to pull all the internals out and detail clean them.

If it's not just dirt, my first guess is the cylinder stop is jamming against the trigger or something else. Second guess is the rebound slide sticking. My plan is not to open the gun up again until I get a Brownell's order in (replacing the sideplate makes me nervous).

I am thinking of ordering the following:
The rebound slide spring tool, basic Arkansas stone kit, a spring kit, some polishing paper & oil. I am also considering the kit they sell to put in a front sight insert. Am I forgetting anything necessary or desired in order to do a "trigger job?"

I'd like to lighten the DA trigger pull slightly. Why would I want to adjust/replace the rebound slide spring? Wouldn't changing the mainspring lighten trigger pull but not the return?

The Kuhnhausen book says to lightly grease some internals. Can I get recommendations for grease?

Thanks in advance to all replys. BTW, today I put a deposit on a 696. Would I be in this deep if not for this forum?

 

[HSMITH]

I prefer to not polish anything unless it really needs it. Pop the sideplate off and pull the guts out. Scrub them down well and degrease them. Look for burrs, dings, scratches, shiny spots and that sort of thing. If you see a burr or something take care of it, but don't stone or sand or polish anything unless it needs it. I don't use grease in my wheelguns, I use Mobil 1 15w-50 and find it perfect. If you want to use grease just about any grease will do fine with white lithium seeming to be the most popular in guns. Lube up the parts where they touch each other and the gun and put it back together. Make sure it works OK.

Hold tension against the hammer, and cycle it slowly and smoothly with the trigger. You are adding resistance is all, not a lot but enough that you have to pull on the trigger a bit. Do that 6 or 8 times. Dry fire 30-50 times a day until you have 1000 rounds through the gun on the range, clean and re-lube the internals. Then see if you want to start changing springs and such. Betcha lunch you don't, and if you do you want a heavier trigger return spring so you don't have to wait on the trigger to come forward.

You can't lighten the pull much without compromising reliability, you can get it smoother but not a lot lighter. Use smooths them out as well as anything. A 36 isn't much of a target gun, so don't take a chance on losing reliability. Reliability is what it is all about.

 

[Majic]

Mainspring controls the hammer which in turn does have some effect to the trigger. The rebound spring directly affects the trigger movement. You can change the rebound spring to lighten the trigger pull and leave the mainspring standard for positive hammer ignition of primers. Now if you get to low in rebound spring power you can lose the ability to quickly reset the trigger in fast double action shooting.

BTW the tool is not needed for replacing the rebound slide and spring. A little imagination and ingenuity can go a long way.

 

[Sprout]

I just put the Wolff spring kit--mainspring and rebound spring--in my 686+. The trigger, which I considered near perfect for me, is quite a bit lighter, and just as smooth as before.

I haven't had a chance to shoot it yet, but I'l let you'll know if it has trouble busting primers. The 13# rebound spring doesn't seem to mess up my reset any, but maybe I just shoot slow.

BTW a 1x60 Phillips head screwdriver makes a pretty good rebound spring tool.

 

[Jim K]

It is easy to see if the problem is in the cylinder stop timing. Just open the cylinder and hold the cylinder release to the rear. Then work the trigger. If the problem goes away, look to the timing.

You don't say if the gun is new. If not, a previous owner may have worked on it and messed things up.

Jim

 

[ceestand]

So that solves that. If I were to only change the mainspring, then while the terigger reaset would be the same, I would have less power to the hammer hitting the round - maybe to little power.

Jim, I tried that, it's not the timing. I was cleaning my Model 10, so I decided to open up the 36 anyway. I thought it might be the cylinder stop jamming. This would happen regardless of the cylinder being in the frame or not. But it doesn't look like it's the cylinder stop. I'm thinking that it might be now either the rebound slide sticking or the hand catching in it's window. Probably the former. Oh, and it's a used 36. I don't think any previous owner messed with it, at least not that I can tell.

I may rethink whether buying the rebound spring tool is necessary.

HSMITH, what would be the harm in polishing things? I don't mean stoning to the point of removing an amount of metal, but maybe a once-over with some #600 grit sandcloth?

 

[HSMITH]

ceestand, the hardening on the surfaces is very shallow. If you get through it the parts will gall and be ruined. I also don't find it necessary, by the time I get to know a gun it is plenty smooth and plenty light if I have been doing my homework. A good clean and lube keeps reliablity where it has to be, and with practice on your part that is all that is needed. An action job is one thing, but when you start swapping springs I get very very cautious. I do NOT believe in swapping any springs in a S&W wheelgun other than increasing the power of the trigger return spring.

 

[Standing Wolf]

I'm thinking that it might be now either the rebound slide sticking or the hand catching in it's window.

I've seen one or two "sticky" hands over the years. Without exception, they were the result of kitchen table gunsmithing by people who think steel is impervious to carelessness.

Rebound slide springs can be bothersome to push back in. I use an old screw driver just the right size, plus most of the curses I know. One of these days, I'll get around to buying the tool. It's not unheard of for oil to coagulate around the rebound slide and make it feel sticky. Simple test: flood it with oil and see whether that temporarily solves the problem.

You can buy replacement hands. Sometimes they fit perfectly; usually, they don't, and require fitting.

My inclination would be to strip the gun all the way down to the frame, clean everything within a sixteenth of an inch of its life, oil or grease everything, and see what develops. Dirt tends to hide a multitude of sins.

 

[BluesBear]

Take an old flat blade screwdriver. File a V notch about 1/16" deep, about 1/8" from the edge. Makes a great trigger rebound spring tool.

 

[bountyhunter]

Ceestand: some pointers.

1) the parts that are surface hardened are the hammer and trigger. never stone or polish the sear faces of these parts at all.

2) The rebound slide is not hardened, and it should be polished on the twoi surfaces that ride against the frame. 600# papaer and oil work fine.

3) I also polish the two frame surfaces that the RB slide rides on. I cut the end of a popsicle stick square and fold the paper across it and use it to polish with.

3) Any good gun grease will work. I have used Tetra, Wilson Ultima Lube, Slide Glide.

4) Do buy the rebound slide spring installation tool. It's worth it.

5) If it's just for targets, install the wolff reduced power mainspring and rebound springs. For defense, use only stock springs.

Best way to see whats hanging up is strip it to the frame (leave the cylinder stop in place and the trigger) without the RB slide/spring. Cycle it and see if you find the snag. Put in the RB slide and spring and check again. Install the hammer (no mainspring) and cycle those. Eventually, you should find the problem.

 

[ceestand]

Miracles do happen!

I'll get to that in a second. First, I want to thank everyone who helped me out with advice here. I ended up just cleaning all the internals and applying a tiny bit of lithium grease to parts that rub against the frame with a Q-tip. The problem seems to have gone, but I thought that before, so we'll have to see.

While I was cleaning (and this is where the miracle happens) the cylinder stop spring shot out while I was attempting to replace it. Shot across my living room. My cluttered living room. Well, I intantly assumed it would it would be months before I saw that spring, if at all. Somehow I found it within 30 seconds of starting my search.

 

[M1911]

Somehow I found it within 30 seconds of starting my search.

Don't worry, you'll pay for that good luck somewhere down the line