shaky roomate situation

[ka50]

I have one roomate who is liberal-hippie. I repsect him and his rights as far as I'm aware. I allow him to play guitar and generally don't intrude on him.

However, lately he has been getting violent (this is a frigging oxymoron: peaceful liberal getting violent). He came few times drunk throwing my things around and calling me names. I tried to reason with him, maintaing my calm and cool, tried to evaluate his point of view from a rational perspective and discuss the issue despite his namecalling. The problem is that he cannot rationally fustify his actions, other than "we don't like you" kind of justification.

As far as I'm aware he never lashed out at people, but I'm not taking any chances and locked and loaded 24/7.

Today I was in my room and someone knocked. Two individuals came in to "look" at my room, claiming they will be moving in next month. One guy was giving me direct un-friendly eye contact. Ok, ???? it, I gave him the eye contact back, well aware that he's in my territory. I didn't let them in, just informed them as far as I'm aware the lease hasn't expired yet.

I'm trying to move out of this place, cuz I don't want to live with a psycho, however I haven't been able to find a place that suits my needs just yet.

Man it sure does feel good packing heat and knowing that you can stand your ground no matter what.

Course of action?

 

[whm1974]

'm trying to move out of this place, cuz I don't want to live with a psycho, however I haven't been able to find a place that suits my needs just yet.

Myself I don't trust other people enough to let them become "roommates". Less if they are related to me.

Man it sure does feel good packing heat and knowing that you can stand your ground no matter what.

I had a sitration three years ago when someone followed me home a week after I ran ran across him during a bike ride. Din't own guns then, but...

-Bill

 

[Pilgrim]

I think the chances of you mounting a successful "burning bed" or "enraged whacko liberal" defense are slim to none. If you have to shoot your roommate or his friends, you can expect to spend some serious time in jail awaiting trial for at least a voluntary manslaughter charge.

I think you should have moved out yesterday.

Pilgrim

 

[RandyB]

I hate to say this, but something just doesn't sound right about your post.

1. If you feel the need to 'pack heat' because of a roommate and his friends. Simple: Leave.

2. The only reason you need to stand your ground is when your options are limited to that.

3. If he is drunk and causing problems, call the police and have him arrested.

4. If he is a liberal, so what? He actions of name-calling and throwing things are the problem and the direct threat to you. See #3.

 

[ka50]

I think the chances of you mounting a successful "burning bed" or "enraged whacko liberal" defense are slim to none. If you have to shoot your roommate or his friends, you can expect to spend some serious time in jail awaiting trial for at least a voluntary manslaughter charge.

I think you should have moved out yesterday.

Pilgrim

Well... nobody's saying shoot anyone.

However in case of immideate threat of grave injury or death I will be prepared. Him being my roomate doesn't grant him any special rights. It doesn't grant me any special rights, either.

I just don't feel it's right to move out simply because someone is trying to impose pressure on you. This is a victim mentality. I will move out when I make approriate arrangements that fit my needs. Sometimes you just gotta stand up and be a man, ya know.

 

[TarpleyG]

Sometimes you just gotta stand up and be a man, ya know.

Yep, and sometimes you gotta let your ego take a hit and walk away which is exactly what you should be doing. Have any other friends you can bunk with for a couple of days until you find somewhere else?

Greg

 

[ka50]

Yep, and sometimes you gotta let your ego take a hit and walk away which is exactly what you should be doing. Have any other friends you can bunk with for a couple of days until you find somewhere else?

Greg

I'm just not following this concept. My roomate has a problem with me, not the other way around. Why should I move if someone doesn't like me? Why doesn't he move if he has problems?

Why would you recommend me to retreat from this situation? I just don't get it.

 

[MDG1976]

Ka50- Get out now. If you had to use a firearm against your roomie or his friends, this thread (if found) would be all a prosecutor would need to "prove" that your shooting was premeditated.

 

[roscoe]

At least you ALLOW him to play guitar . . .

 

[ka50]

Ka50- Get out now. If you had to use a firearm against your roomie or his friends, this thread (if found) would be all a prosecutor would need to "prove" that your shooting was premeditated.

Does that mean that if you expect a possible intrusion from a stalker at your place of residence your shooting is on par with murder, because it was premeditated?

This is my legal place of residence, why would I need to run from my place of residence for any reason? It's not like I'm a guest at his house, it is MY PLACE OF RETREAT.

Evaluation of possibilities and being prepared for the worst is not premeditation, rather a precaution.

I'm not trying to argue, I'm trying to understand your point guys and I'm not sure that I do.

 

[MatthewVanitas]

I'm just not following this concept. My roomate has a problem with me, not the other way around. Why should I move if someone doesn't like me? Why doesn't he move if he has problems?

This kind of falls in line with "Someone threw garbage in my front lawn, why should I pick it up?"

You may not have started the problem, but someone has _made_ it your problem. Something's got to give, and your giving up and leaving is probably a safer pressure release then his going ape and things getting bad-fast.

If he's subletting from you (or your name's on the lease), and you can convince him to move (and then change locks), more power to you.

-MV

 

[ccw007]

Seems like I saw something like this on Cops once.

I had a roommate once (never again) found him smoking the wacky weed in my house and gave him two options leave now with his dope or leave with the police and his dope.
He left and I put his crap outside under my carport and changed the locks before he got back with a truck to get his crap.
You really should get out of that situation now it will be cheaper in the long run and depending on the lease the landlord he may let you out of the lease if you explain the situation or may may give you a fair price to get out.

 

[NIMBY]

Fight won

Any fight you walk away from is a fight you just won. Sometimes, arguing with liberals is like trying to teach a pig to sing: It just frustrates you and pisses the pig off.

Remember the old saying:

His way was right and his will was strong;
But he's just as dead as if he'd been wrong.

 

[hso]

"Sometimes you just gotta stand up and be a man, ya know."

This is juvenile thinking.

Do you hold the lease or does he?

If he holds the lease he has control and your options are limited to finding out what the problem is and mending fences or getting out immediately. I say immediately simply because if you do not have the skills to defuse the situation so that you don't feel threatened enough by your roomate that you're carrying 24/7 then your only adult option is the avoid the possible deadly conflict and get your self to a place of safety.

If you hold the lease then it's equally simple to throw him out or require him to mend the relationship.

Our first obligation in carrying firearms is to avoid conflict that might become deadly. Our second is to deescilate conflict we weren't able to avoid so that it doesn't become deadly. If you honestly think you need to carry a gun all the time in your own home for fear that you might need it to shoot your roommate then your either seriously deranged or you're failing to follow the basic rules of a gun fight, i.e. don't have one.

 

[sacp81170a]

IANAL, but you should check your state and local domestic violence statutes. As far as I'm aware, at least in my jurisdiction, domestic violence statutes apply to people living in the same house, not just boyfriend-girlfriend or husband-wife type relationships. Displaying your firearm to get someone to break off an attack puts you in a bad situation. Even if you don't fire your weapon, you may have to prove that you were justified in committing what amounts to an aggravated assault. Regardless, you will go to jail as the aggressor, and you will probably have your firearm(s) confiscated until the matter can be adjudicated. If you fail to win the legal battle, then you lose your ability to legally "pack heat" for the rest of your life. Not a good trade.

Sun Tzu said it best: "to fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists in breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting."

I don't know the details of your lease, but if you can get him out, do it. If you have to leave, do it, immediately. Don't risk your future by depending on an idiot to act in a way that you expect.

Again, IANAL, my advice is worth exactly what you paid for it.

 

[Pilgrim]

I'm not trying to argue, I'm trying to understand your point guys and I'm not sure that I do.

If you have all kinds of money to spend on a criminal defense attorney, then by all means stand your ground. Just know that the three questions your attorney will ask are:
1. How much money do you have?
2. Where can you get more money?
3. Do you have any other guns you can sell to get more money?

Pilgrim

 

[MDG1976]

Man it sure does feel good packing heat and knowing that you can stand your ground no matter what.

ka50- I'm on your side but any decent lawyer could turn this statment against you in a very bad way.

Sometimes you just gotta stand up and be a man, ya know.

There's a name for people with this mentality; "inmate".

Get out while the gettin's good. Who wants to live with a hippie anyway?

 

[joab]

I'm more on your side than the others.

Stand your ground but don't look for a fight.

But start making serious plans to vacate

 

[33-805]

Whoever has the lease or owns the property stays, the other leaves. No other course will give you any peace. Not to put too fine a point on it, but the other posters here have given you some excellent advice. I hope you follow it, for your own good.

One more tip, no matter what it does to your commute or your expenses, live alone or with people you are related to. Any other course usually ends badly. Your thought that you may have to shoot it out in your "own home" with this guy is a pretty frightening concept, if you step back mentally from the situation for a second and look at it as dispassionately as you can.

I have been in enough altercations to know that, although I learned from them all, I would have been better off not to have them in the first place. Your trouble is avoidable by someone's departure. Get some LEO help on civil standby when this occurs. Trust me, you be the one to call for this. Best wishes, hope it all turns out well for you!!

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Ka50- Get out now. If you had to use a firearm against your roomie or his friends, this thread (if found) would be all a prosecutor would need to "prove" that your shooting was premeditated.

No it would not, not anymore than any other thread where folks state they carry because of possible dangers in their lives.

Maybe the shooting would be seen as premeditated? What law does this break, premeditation? The only thing premeditated would be that the gun was carried in case it was ever needed.

Heck, some states even give people the option to procure emergency concealed carry permits if they feel they are endangered by a particular threat, such as an abusive estranged spouse. They don't consider that being prepared to use lethal force in a self defense situation constitutes premeditation.

Him being my roomate doesn't grant him any special rights. It doesn't grant me any special rights, either.

I just don't feel it's right to move out simply because someone is trying to impose pressure on you. This is a victim mentality. I will move out when I make approriate arrangements that fit my needs. Sometimes you just gotta stand up and be a man, ya know.

Actually, being a resident in the home does grant special rights. For example, you can't kick him out of the residence as he has just as much right to be there as you.

Moving out because of pressure imposed on you is not necessarily victim mentality anymore than deciding that you need to pack a gun 24/7 because your roommate is a psycho who commits violent acts within your residence. You are packing 24/7 because you feel it is prudent in that you are fearful of your roommates potential threats to you. Given that you feel endangered, moving out will reduce or nullify that threat to you. This is akin to walking away from bad situations on the street. The best defense is to not there, there being where the threat is located.

Sometimes you just gotta stand up and be a man? What? Is being a man defined as keeping yourself in a potentially dangerous situation unnecessarily? If so, then being a man means not being an intelligent man.

 

[grimjaw]

Having dealt with this situation in the past, I will offer some advice.

Leave. Leave now. If you can't leave now, then start making preparations to leave as soon as humanly possible.

Long story short. An ex-gf of mine was living with two roommates, a female and her boyfriend. The male started to drink more regularly and become verbally abusive to my ex. I went straight to the police, explaining that not only was he underage and drinking, his belligerent behavior just continued to escalate. Their response?

"We can't do anything until he hits her."

Well that wasn't going to happen. This was long before I owned a firearm of my own, and I've never been a physically intimidating specimen. We moved her out of there, costs be damned. The landlord was completely unsympathetic. I think it cost us about $1000, with the loss of her deposit and such. I removed the people I cared about from the situation, and that was that. We never saw him again, except once when I was back in that miserable town on vacation, and he swerved into my lane of traffic, nearly colliding with me head on.

It still galls me to think about it, that I didn't quietly creep into the guy's room and soak his pillow with his splattered brains. I try not to think about it. If there is any justice in the world, he is 'serving thirty years for armed robbery, being sodomized in hourly shifts.' All I would have gotten for taking care of the problem myself with violence was to end up in court or worse. He never directly threatened me or mine.

jmm

 

[Preacherman]

There's a name for people with this mentality; "inmate".

Best response so far. Prisons are full of people who proclaim proudly "I did what I had to do!" The judge and jury said "Yep - now we're going to do what we have to do", and put them behind bars for years, if not for life.

Think about this. You have just posted, in a public forum, where anyone and everyone can read it, that:

1. You and your roommate have a serious problem;

2. You're glad you can carry a gun in this situation.

Without having to admit to anything illegal, you've just made it possible for the prosecution (or a lawyer representing your roommate and/or his family) to allege that you have cold-bloodedly and pre-meditatedly chosen violence as a potential solution to this situation. If that situation now turns violent, they've got all they need - regardless of the facts of the situation - to allege that you were the cause of the violence, due to your attitude as publicly displayed by you, without provocation or cause.

My friend, you're in an unwinnable situation. Leave now, or face the consequences - and those consequences are likely to be the concrete-and-bars hotel for a long, long time...

 

[spacemanspiff]

Sometimes you just gotta stand up and be a man, ya know

not when you are armed with a deadly weapon. the responsibility is upon you to de-escalate any and all situations before moving to the use of force.

this means you have to let someone call you names. you have to let them call into question your genetic makeup, and insinuate disgusting things about your parents. you have to let them behave as immature as they possibly can.

you can always walk away, you can always run, you can always move.

when you make the decision to carry, and have the option of using deadly force to defend your life, you give up the ability to ever defend your honor.

 

[Headless Thompson Gunner]

I'm just not following this concept. My roomate has a problem with me, not the other way around. Why should I move if someone doesn't like me? Why doesn't he move if he has problems?

Why would you recommend me to retreat from this situation? I just don't get it.

Because if you don't, there's a very real possibility that someone could end up dead. Not having to kill someone beats the pants off being able to claim the moral high ground.

If you don't trust the guy, you should leave ASAP. Find a cheap weekly hotel or something, and move in TOMORROW. Then working finding permanent accomodations that you can afford to live in ALONE.

Where do you store your firearms? If this guy is as bad as you say, you don't want him to be anywhere near a gun. Does he know you own firearms? Does he know how/where they're stored? Even if you won't move yourself out, at least have the brains to move your guns out. Keep only the one you need for immediate defense, and keep it on your person or locked up at all times.

 

[antsi]

Sometimes you just gotta stand up and be a man, ya know.

Let's see... psycho roomate, you have to be armed to feel safe. Normally I would say you need to get out of this situation immediately.

But if it is a question of proving your manhood, then by all means, stay and shoot it out with the psycho

.