Shooting 357 magnum in an Airlight.

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miko

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This weekend I finally got a chance to shoot my three new revolvers - 3 inch 66, 3 inch 60 and 340 Scandium.

Shooting a 357 Magnum out of a 12 ounce gun is certainly not for the faint of heart - but it is doable.

I shot 2 125 grain 357s and then 3 158 grain 357s from the K-frame 3" Model 66. That felt quite reasonable.
Then I did the same with the 24 ounces Model 60. It was workable as well.

By the time I was ready to start on 340 my web was already a bit sore. I was planning to follow the same regimen with it but after the two shots of 125 grain I had to call it quits. Way too painfull on the web and I did not know how disabling it would be. It wasn't really. The pain was in the soft tissue when squeezed, not in the bones/joints so my yard work did not suffer. After a couple of days the last of pain went away.

I am sure that in a real-life SD situation I would have emptied the cylinder without concern to the ill effects. I will do some chrony testing to determine whether I will keep it loaded with 357s of 38 +P+ 147 grain Hydroshoks. I shot a couple of those at the very end and they did not feel much different from 125 grain 357s, tough my palm was pretty sore by that point.

I found the feel of shooting a magnum out of 340 very comforting, if hardly comfortable - you just feel the enormous power of the cartridge.


Anyone is willing to share his favorite SD ammo for 4, 3 and 2 inch barrels, preferably with data on muzzle velocity achieved?

miko
 
familiar with the 340 Scandium

One day, ohhhh a couple years ago, the memory still makes me wince, a friend of mine and I were in Left Hand Canyon, by Boulder Colorado. We had our various ARs, fun guns and the occasional .308. We were shooting up there with a couple guys from the Boulder County Sherriff's office or as we found out later, a couple of sadistic guys with badges.

We were all shooting and having a fun time, when one of these sadists, err officers brought out his backup gun, a Scandium 340 .357. "Wow, Cool", we all said as he plopped in a few rounds and offered to let us shoot it, a gleam in his eye. Our eyes watered as we drooled over the cool lines of that small .357 with the matte black frame and the gentle disposition. Apparently, amidst the drooling, we missed the part where he mentioned these were some of his personal handloads.

My friend shot it first, if my memory serves me right. I remember the dazed look as he handed it back immediatly and said "nice gun". I should have noticed he never took the second shot. I also must have missed the call to the orthopedic surgeon he made just after that.

Now it was my turn. I walked up and grasped that itty bitty gun in both hands thinking to myself, "How bad can this be?" Well, I only have to assume that while I held my eyes closed and prayed to all that was holy to still have a hand when this was all over, someone replaced the gun with a live grenade. There was this annoying screaming going on, then I realized I should probably stop that. My hand, which before this I considered a wonderful part of my body, now seemed like so much painful meat. After prying open my fused fingers and handing back the gun, I said "Nice Gun".

My day of shooting was done. I had nothing left to do but pack up my guns and leave. Even the thought of firing a .22 brought new tears to my eyes. While I did so, I saw others shoot the gun... once, and only once. No one wanted the second shot.

The sadists themselves took a shot as well. The surprise on their faces told the tail.... Hoisted on their own petard, they were. I smiled smugly and nursed my hand.
 
Har.

The S&W .357 Scandium is now my summer carry gun. Crimson Trace lasergrips makes it incredibly easy to shoot and hit what you want. That said, it does kick.

I practice with 38 Specials and end the day with 15 shots of .357 Mag. I don't push this gun to the limit and use factory .357 Hydrashok. While noticeably stiffer recoil than .38 Special, it is controllable with the slightly larger and softer Crimson Trace grips. Not a load I'd want to shoot all day but controllable.

This gun retired my Sig P230 .380 as my summer carry gun. A .357 is a big improvement if power.
 
This gun retired my Sig P230 .380 as my summer carry gun. A .357 is a big improvement if power.
Click to expand...

Yeah, well, so is 9mm or .38 special +P and double taps are a little quicker I'd imagine. But, to each his own. Just the name, .357 magnum, should kill 'em I reckon. It's certainly an easy gun to carry and conceal at 12 ounces and it WILL shoot .38 +P which is a plenty effective round. If I had one, that's probably what I'd carry it with. They aren't too bad in my 15 ounce Taurus snubby. And, it ain't just the recoil I don't like about a 2" .357, it's the flash/bang indoors. It could blow out your friggin' ears! :what: 9 and .38's bad enough.

If I ever get my hands on a .357 2" gun to chronograph, I'd like to see how some of the factory .357 loads stack up. The articles I've read on the subject say around 400 ft lbs for a good .357 load. I'm getting 1260 fps, 410 ft lbs from my 11 shot 14 ounce Kel Tec P11 and it's easy to shoot by comparison. I load it with Unique behind a 115 grain JHP which burns a lot faster and has a lot less flash that typical magnum powders like 2400 and W296. I wouldn't wanna touch off some of my hot .357s out of my 4" medium frame gun in the house. :what: Heck, you can see the flash in broad daylight and it pays to wear your muffs even outdoors even with that gun. Nothin' like a magnum to get the testosterone flowing at the range, though.:evil:
 
Shooting 357 magnum in an Airlight....

isn't fun.

Morover, NONE of the available 125gr+P JHP .357 Magnum premium factory rounds were as accuate in my two 340PDs as the better .38 Special+P JHP rounds, and I tried ALL the commercially available .357 JHP rounds in 125gr+P from the major makers (specifically Speer, Winchester, Federal, Remington and Cor-Bon).
Precision was mediocre, though accuracy was acceptable with the .357s, but some of the .38 Special rounds were VERY precise PLUS accurate, including Federal Nyclad .38 Special+P 158gr HP (now out of production) and the Speer Gold Dot "short barrel" 135gr .38 Special+P JHP. The latter is what is now carried in my S&W J-frames.
 
357 in an Airlite

I have a 360 PD and it was a bear to shoot 357 mags with the bantum grips it came with. The kick would smack my trigger finger. I put on a pair of Hogue rubber grips which allowed all fingers to grasp the grip. Having done that, no more finger "bite". I still wouldn't want to shoot it all day with mags but it is much easier and less painful to shoot now.
 
PS: Note the warning from S&W not to use less than 120gr bullets in the scandium .357, another reason why I carry the 125gr factory hydrashock.
 
I can stand about 50 rounds in a 23 oz. all steel snub revolver in 125gr. Golden Saber, but that's it. After 50, I'm done....and that's WITH gloves.
 
Snubby-itis

I have an SP101 in .357 that I carry with 147gr Hydra-shock.
My practice load is a 158gr JSP .357.

That gun weighs 25oz. and feels like I'm catching a baseball bare-handed when I shoot it. If you are standing next to someone shooting a .357 snubby, you feel the concussion and you better have really good hearing protection.

I have looked at the various light weight models, but I'll stick with my all steel thumper. The lighter weight is no help when you cannot stand to practice with a weapon you may have to depend on for your life.

My SP101 carries very nicely under a suit coat in a Galco Speedmaster holster, or in an Uncle Mikes pocket holster in a pair of Dockers.
 
It's entirely doable. And the Airlite I've shot was very accurate, too.

It's not, however, fun. Your hand and/or wrist can hurt for several days if you shoot too many .357 rounds through the thing.

It's simply not a recreational gun. It's a defensive tool, and a good one.

I'd like to try .38 Cowboy loads, though. That might make it pleasant enough to plink with.
 
I LOVE MY 340!

There is a secret to taming the little beast though. Grips with open backstrap = pain. Rubber grips that cover the backstrap = :evil:

Mine had hard plastic CT lasergrips on it when I bought it and I didn't like them much. I replaced them with some pretty wood boot grips. Looked better but still a little uncomfortable to shoot. Finally, I installed a Hogue rubber monogrip that covers the back strap and she is more like an angry little girl now than a caged lion.

Still with really hot stuff like Federal 158gr jhp in 357mag it's quite a monster but with moderate loads it's a pussycat.

Here are my two favorite loads for the 340 and my own chronograph measurements:

Remington 125gr Golden Saber 357Mag 5 shot avg 1081 fps :eek: 324.427 ft-lbs

and for a 38spl load:

Speer 135gr 38 spl +P GDHP for short barrels 5 shot avg 869fps 226.428 ft-lbs

My friends love shooting my 340. They always ask if I can bring it to the range. ;)

YMMV
 
Remington 125gr Golden Saber 357Mag 5 shot avg 1081 fps 324.427 ft-lbs

and for a 38spl load:

Speer 135gr 38 spl +P GDHP for short barrels 5 shot avg 869fps 226.428 ft-lbs
Click to expand...

That's a light .38+P load, but it is a factory round. I get 265 ft lbs with 140 grain or 158 grain JHP out of my snubbie. The 125 .357 grain load with all its flash bang is only puttin' out 324 ft lbs? That's my point. I'd rather shoot my 14 ounce 9mm compact with easier recoil and a lot less flash/bang and putting down 1260 fps/410 ft lbs with a 115 grain Hornady XTP JHP and I have 11 rounds on tap. 12 round flush fit mags are available which would give me 13 on tap. While that +P handload is pretty hot in the little P11, it ain't squat to the recoil and muzzle blast of a snubby in .357. It's quite controllable for double taps in fact.

When you bob a .357 that short, it ain't a magnum any more. You've taken the sting out of the bullet and put it in your ears and eyes. That's the very reason I'd rather carry a 3" gun like the Ruger SP101, but also that gun is more controllable with the hot magnum stuff. It's got enough weight and the rubber grip helps, too. I would expect over 400 ft lbs from the .357 out of a 3" SP101. Has anyone here got a number, chronographed one????? Factory stuff routinely breaks 500 ft lbs out of a 4" barrel and stuff like buffalo bore puts those rounds to shame.
 
Greetings.

Back in the late '70s I bought a small, 2-shot .357 derringer that I quickly learned to shoot .38s in. Can't remember who made it, but it didn't always fire one of the two rounds. I did find, however, that shooting a .357 was "doable" if one psyched oneself up to it.

It let out an unholy roar and belched flame and could bruise, but if one's life were hanging in the balance, I doubt not that it would have been effective.
 
I shoot 180 gr Remington SJHP that clocks at around 1000 fps in my S&W 360.
I put Pachmayer Gripper Decelerator grips on it and it's less painful. I can shoot about 10 rounds at a time without any lasting discomfort.

I am going to test the same bullet at around 850 fps this weekend for reliable expansion. If these work I think this gun could turn into a "shoot allot" gun.

Mike G.
 
12 oz .357 Magnum

It can be did. DA only is the key, imho. 50 rounds of factory 158 grain is not an impossibility for a seasoned pistoleer. YMMV
 
BigG,

I found that shooting Remington factory 125 gr, with the original grips, would rip the top layer of skin right off the web of my hand, by the thumb. That's after 15 rounds or so. If I shot 25-30 of those I would have a pain in my hand for a week following. Even using gloves, it would start ripping the skin after a prolonged session of shooting. I find the 180 gr rounds hurt less, (less felt recoil,) and have less blast effect than the 125 grainers. But there is no other gun that can conceal as well, carries as easy, and can equal the power for the size, than these light 357 mags. The 180 gr at 1013 fps penetrates 45 inches of water. If I can get the 180 gr moving at 850 fps to penetrate at least 24-30 inches, and expand, this will be an even better, fairly easy shooting piece.

Mike G.
 
Control is the name of the game. I bought a Model 66, 2/12 inch this morning. I have no intention of running full bore .357's through it...Essex
 
yeah...what he said.

I have owned a 360 and two 340s, in addition to several other j-frames. I have also sold most of them, and those which remain, may not be with me much longer.

The Airlight 340 is very impressive in concept and execution, but in practice I find it wanting. I am unable to deliver anything resembling a double tap, nor am I able to withstand (for any length of time) the beating it administers to my hands/wrists. It is no fun, and does not encourage practice or proficiency.

I still carry it once in a while (mostly so I can rationalise keeping it?) but these days my Kahr PM9 has pretty much put the 340 on the trailer. The Kahr is every bit as small, weighs 14.8, holds 6+1, reloads right now, and the Ranger 127 gr +P+ is formidable but controllable. Mine is also dead reliable with anything I stick in it.

While the 340 is an engineering marvel, the PM9 is a real-world pocket rocket.
 
158 Grain Federal works best in mine.

Hi Mike G:

I haven't tried any 125 grain 357 thru my 360. I kept the stock grips on it and fired it DAO, except for two or three that I touched off SA for experimental purposes to confirm my suspicion that the J-frame was not designed for SA work with its teensie boot grip. Yup - I was right!

The little 360 does bark the edge of my trigger finger where it rubs along the trigger guard but no skin lost off my web (so far).

PS: The shooter really needs to check iaw the manual that the bullets are not unseating and moving forward under recoil. I had quite a few that pulled the bullet out so far that it was jammed by the third shot. This was with S&B and Remington.
 
Essex County, a snub model 66 is a pussycat with full loads.
It's the original pocket rocket .357.
Back in the day it was the #1 off duty magnum.
The only problen was the muzzle blast and flash.
But todays loadings with the new low flash powders has pretty much eliminated the big ball of fire problem.
 
Whine and Cheese

There's more whine here than in my shop, wish I were selling cheese to go with it, I'd be a millionaire.
Grip it like you mean it but don't try to strangle it.
Lock your wrist and you'll be fine even with the fullhouse stuff.
If you limp wrist this little tigger, it will bite you! :fire:
Great carry gun, I have 2 reloads on me if that don't get it done then you had better have another plan, I have several.
It's not paranoia, it has happened before.
Be aware and prepared.
DAve
 
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