Sighting In A Rifle....Opinion?

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texagun

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I recently read an article by Jack O'Connor in which he recommends sighting in a rifle at 25 yds. He says if all rifles are sighted in at 25 yards, you will be within approximately 2-3" out to 300 yds. The following table was appended to the article to support the premise. (I might add that the article also says to be sure and RE-CHECK your rifle at the intended hunting range). Just wondering what the opinion of those who do considerable rifle shooting is regarding this method?

SightinginTable-3.jpg
 
I always start at 25 yards if for no other reason than to be sure I will be on the target when going to longer range. I am certainly no rifle marksman though. Not sure about the 2-3 inches. I guess it depends on how exact you are with 25 yard sighting.
 
I think the major factor here is the sighting system. If iron sights then this approach will probably be a good approximation.

Once tho there is a scope - the offset from bore-line and parallax issues make a whole world of difference. If tho I get a scoped rifle ''right'' at 100 then things can be well estimated ''back to 25'' and out to 200 and beyond.

So - these figures above for me are only re iron sights.
 
My local indoor range is only 25 yards and I can't always make it to a rifle range. I often sight in at 25 and it always gets me within a couple inches of where I want to be at 100 (about 2.5" high). Its not an exact science though and you really shouldn't depend on it for anything beyond bore sighting. Slight changes at 25 get exagerated at 100 and beyond.
 
Yup......ballistics....

just follow the ballistics chart for your round. I do it also, at 25yds. Its much
easier to get your elevation at that range. For instance, with my marlin
1894c in .357: If I zero at 25yards (following the ballistic path of the round)
it will be .50" high at 100yds, and 2.5" low at 150yds. Obviously a faster rifle
round will have better ballistics but you get the idea.

BTW this only works for elevation. Usually after I set my elevation at 25yds,
I'll back it off to 100yds to get the windage. :D
 
Its not an exact science though and you really shouldn't depend on it for anything beyond bore sighting. Slight changes at 25 get exagerated at 100 and beyond
For a new guy, cliffy109 speaks with much wisdom. ;)
 
I agree with the 25yd sight-in too. In my reading and communicating with Garand afficianados, I learned that the military does sight-in on what they used to call the "thousand inch" range which is 25 or 27 yards, not really sure which. This is to find "battle sight zero". If elevation is dead on at 25yds, it'll theoretically be dead on a 225yds. Now, following the chart in the original post, you see that if a 150gr .30-06 is 2.25" high at 100yds and 150yds, 1.25" high at 200yds and 1.25" low at 250yds, this isn't far off the mark. Jack O'Connor's pet caliber was the .270Winchester and by reputation it shoots flatter than the old '06. By this chart, if the .270 fires a 130gr bullet 2.25" high at 100yds, it'll be dead on at 250yds. Now, consider that the kill zone of most North American big game animals (deer and elk in particular) is about the size of a pie plate (not an excuse for bad shooting), and you can see that those numbers are well within the margin of error. It then falls to the individual hunter to be a better rifleman, both knowing what the rifle/ammo is doing and knowing how to put the shot together at the moment of truth.
 
Laws of Physics always apply....

The amount any given bullet falls in a fixed time period is related to the pull of gravity. Nothing will ever alter that.

A bullet that moves relatively fast will have less time to fall at 100 yards than a slower moving bullet. Once the velocity of the bullet is known, calculating the drop at any given distance is just a matter of running the formula. The only real problem is that factory ammo claiming to produce X fps of muzzle velocity, may be faster or slower in this particular rifle.

Someone brought up the difference between iron sights and scopes. The only difference is the scope has (usually) a greater distance between 'line of sight' and 'line of departure'; which is to say, the line of sight through a scope is higher above the boreline, usually. This is not true if one compares a scoped model 700 in .223 Remington and an AR15 variant. The sights on AR15 type rifles are pretty high in comparison to a bolt gun.

However, in sighting in a rifle, a lot of the mathmatical calculations can be deleted. Simply sighting in at 25 yards will put the bullet strikes 'on paper' at 100 yards. For most centerfires with a muzzle velocity above 2500 fps, it's probably on paper at 200 yards as well.

And yes, it also works for windage. However, remember values for 'clicks' vary with the distance. One 'click', either iron sight or scope, will move the bullet strike four times as much at 100 yards as it does at 25 yards. To put it another way, if your bullet strike is one inch 'out' at 25 yards, it will be 'out' the same direction, but four inches 'out' at 100 yards.

Someone mentioned 'battlesight zero'. The idea here is to get as much range without changing sights as possible. The concept works very well for hunting rifles.
Take a look at the attached chart for the information on the .30-30 rifle: it shows a 25 yard 'spot on' impact, 2.75" high at 100 yards, 2.25" high at 150 yards, .25" low at 200 yards and 5 inches low at 250 yards. So if your .30-30 rifle is sighted in as shown, you can use the same sight picture, not hold high or low, and get bullet impacts out to 250 yards that are never more than five inches from your point of aim.
This is presuming you are using 150 grain bullets and they actually develop the velocity, not shown here, as used to calculate this chart, your rifle will shoot this tightly and you can hold that well.

Mustanger, when I was in the Marine Corps, the 1,000 inch range was used as a sighting in mechanism only. By the way, 1,000 inches divided by 12 is 83.33 feet, divided by 3 is 27.77 yards. It was designed to be perfectly compatable for zeroing the military ball ammo loads for both Garand and M14 rifles. Turns out it's close enough for M16 rifles as well.

The long and the short of it for sighting in is this: Getting on paper at 25 yards beats the heck out of wasting the first six or eight shots (out of your box of twenty) trying to figure out where your shots are going off the paper at 100 with your brother in law telling you "Yer tooo fut ovv 'n da'dirt t'da rate!"
 
The amount any given bullet falls in a fixed time period is related to the pull of gravity. Nothing will ever alter that.
That law only applies in a vacum (Physics 101). As the bullet traverses any media, it will slow and other forces will have an increasingly strong effect on the flight. That's why a 1" group at 25 yards does not equate to a 4" group at 100; and why the same group will typically be centered on a different location on the paper (spinning projectile, gaseous medium, grooves in bullet, you get the idea...).

I believe the term we're looking for is the "Mayflower Effect".

MBRs sight in at 36 yards to get them an approximate 300 yd zero, but that's just it, approximate.

Getting back to the subject at hand, according to my ballistics software, a 25 yard zero may get the shooter in a deer's humane kill zone at 100 yards, but that same zero puts him about 8" low at 125.
 
according to my ballistics software, a 25 yard zero may get the shooter in a deer's humane kill zone at 100 yards, but that same zero puts him about 8" low at 125.

which caliber?
 
i have done this a lot, JUST TO ROUGH IN THE SIGHTS. it works well enough to get the group on the paper at 100 yds, but certainly not well enough to use by itself and consider the rifle sighted in. i suggest to try it, then shoot at 100. you will almost certainly need to adjust the sights some more.

monty
 
With a scope and "for all practical purposes":

Generally if you are dead center at 25 yards, you will be roughly two inches high at 100 yards, give or take an inch. So, you're on paper at 100 yards and near a desirable point of aim.

Ignoring the magnums and centerfire .22s, two inches high at 100 yards puts you close to dead on at 200 yards and roughly six inches low at 300. This holds for the majority of all "deer cartridges". The "hotshots" reach a bit farther out, of course.

Few hunting shots are taken beyond 250 yards, so for all practical purposes, a 200-yard zero means "point it and pull" and watch Bambi go flop.

Sure, some of the standard centerfire cartridges are a hair flatter or a tad "loopier", but the great majority will work within these parameters in a give-or-take-an-inch way...

FWIW,

Art
 
nipprdog, sorry about that: chalk it up to a senior moment. Speaking to 115fgrmj's secnario: 357 out of a 1894.
 
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