MurrayNevada
Member
I pocket carry a Kahr PM9 most of the time. I would like a .45 pistol that I could also carry in a pocket holster occassionally. It must be small and light to do this. Is there a relatively small and light .45 out there?
Smallest and lightest .45 ACP ?
- Thread starter MurrayNevada
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The only one that small coming to mind is an AMT Backup .45. If you can go a little bigger, I'd say go with a Glock 36 or a S&W Chiefs Special 45 or even a little bigger a Glock 30, Colt 45 Defender, Para-Ordnance P-10. SIG 245. The latter few might be a little bigger than you want though. With .45 being your choice (a great choice in my opinion) you are left with not too many options. Hope that helps. ....Whit
Double Naught Spy
Sus Venator
I can't recall specifics of the other potential options, but in 1911s, the lightest I know of are the Kimber Ultra series, right around 25 oz. It has a 3.16" barrel and officer's frame.
wally
Member
AMT Backup 45 is small but its not light. My Kimber Ultra Carry is lighter, but larger.
I go with a Kahr PM40 when the Kimber UC is too large for what I'm wearing. My AMT had its day, but either of these newer (to me) guns is much better.
--wally.
I go with a Kahr PM40 when the Kimber UC is too large for what I'm wearing. My AMT had its day, but either of these newer (to me) guns is much better.
--wally.
Tropical Z
Member
7.62FullMetalJacket
Member
Glcok. Light as a Cobra. Barrel is 3.78 inches for good performance. Probably too small for my hands. I would go with the 30 if I wanted smaller than the 21.
Glock 36
.45 Auto
Length (slide)
6.77 in. 172 mm
Height 2)
4.76 in. 121 mm
Width
1.13 in 28.5 mm.
Barrel length
3.78 in. 96 mm
Magazine capacity 4)
6
Mass (weight)
Empty without magazine
20.11 oz. 570 g
Empty magazine
2.40 oz. 68 g
Full magazine 5)
~6.88 oz. ~195 g
Glock 36
.45 Auto
Length (slide)
6.77 in. 172 mm
Height 2)
4.76 in. 121 mm
Width
1.13 in 28.5 mm.
Barrel length
3.78 in. 96 mm
Magazine capacity 4)
6
Mass (weight)
Empty without magazine
20.11 oz. 570 g
Empty magazine
2.40 oz. 68 g
Full magazine 5)
~6.88 oz. ~195 g
SnWnMe
Member
Semmerling
Not an auto.
Not an auto.
gunfan
Member
WSP...
Double action single-shot "pistol." This is the smallest there is!
Scott
Double action single-shot "pistol." This is the smallest there is!
Scott
WonderNine
member
Detonics made a really small .45. It is a "1911 style", but does not have the grip safety. I think George Hill or somebody here has one. I believe it takes Commander magazines. There's a really nice one at the gunshop that I wouldn't mind owning.
George Hill
Member
http://www.downsizer.com/
I had one. Kick myself in the butt everytime someone says Detonics.... Should NEVER have sold it. Ever.
I had one. Kick myself in the butt everytime someone says Detonics.... Should NEVER have sold it. Ever.
7.62FullMetalJacket
Member
11 ounces 
1911Tuner
Moderator Emeritus
Smallest and Lightest?
Easy...The Liberator.
Easy...The Liberator.
usnavymasterchief
member
You can't beat a Smith and Wesson CS45 (Chief's Special) it is small at 6.5" long and 23 ozs and totally reliable. You don't want a heavy caliber in an ultra light pistol the CS45 is just about right. Keep in mind that short barreled .45ACP's suffer a slight loss of velocity and energy compared to their 4" and 5" barreled cousins. But for easy carry and excellent close in CCW I don't think you can do better than the S&W CS45. Go to the search engine on this website and www.smith-wessonforum.com you'll find that those who own them really like them. The grip is a little wide lengthwise but hasn't been a problem for me.
Don't count out the Kahr micro .40's they are ballistically very close to a .45ACP and very small. I've heard bad vibes about the polymer framed Kahrs and nothing but good about their all stainless models. I recently aquired an all stainless MK40 Elite and love it.
Don't count out the Kahr micro .40's they are ballistically very close to a .45ACP and very small. I've heard bad vibes about the polymer framed Kahrs and nothing but good about their all stainless models. I recently aquired an all stainless MK40 Elite and love it.
Lone_Gunman
Member
7.62FullMetalJacket,
If you pocket carry a Glock 30, you must have really big pockets!
If you pocket carry a Glock 30, you must have really big pockets!
Tamara
Senior Member
WonderNine,
FWIW, there's no such thing as "Commander magazines". Commanders take full-length 1911 mags. The Officer's Model uses shorter magazines, but they are still too long to fit flush in a Detonics.
FWIW, there's no such thing as "Commander magazines". Commanders take full-length 1911 mags. The Officer's Model uses shorter magazines, but they are still too long to fit flush in a Detonics.
7.62FullMetalJacket
Member
Cry your pardon. No, my pockets are not large enough for a G30. I forgot about the purpose of the thread.
WonderNine
member
Yea, I meant to say Officer's magazines...... I always get those two confused for some reason. Yuppers, I had a good discussion with the gunshop guy about the gun, I think we came to the conclusion that the Officer's mags will fit reasonably flush with the correct baseplate or bumper pad. I think the Detonic's mags were 5 rounders, not sure though....
WonderNine
member
The WSP does look pretty cool, however I'd rather have 6-7 rounds of .32-.380 in the same sized package. Just my preference.
I imagine you'd want to load that thing with some +P hardball. I would.
I imagine you'd want to load that thing with some +P hardball. I would.
Badger Arms
Member
I'll second the Taurus PT 145 based on my personal experience HANDLING them and what everybody has said. The proof is in the pudding. I'll be able to give a range report soon.
longeyes
member
The Glock 36 is the lightest I'm aware of (only one ounce more loaded, 27 oz., than a Glock 26) but it's no pocket pistol.
WonderNine
member
I hope it doesn't suffer from light strike syndrome.
Badger Arms
Member
I plan on shooting it dry and cold in 10-20 below weather. If it'll suffer from any light-strike syndrome, I think this would shake that malfunction out. I hope not. As cute as the gun is, I'd hate for it to be a lemon. Have you suffered any light-strikes? If so, is this with the Pro? Comparing the pistols side-by-side, it appears they redesigned the striker.
fastbolt
Member
I'm in agreement with usnavymasterchief ... The S&W CS45 is a great diminutive pistol chambered for a large caliber.
Notice it only weighs 23.9 ounces (empty). I believe the G36 weighs 20.11 ounces, empty & without a magazine, and the overall length of the G36 is 6.77". Neither the G36 or the CS45 are exactly "pocket pistols", unless you're talking about large, heavy coats/vests with large, sturdy pockets.
Model: CS45
Caliber: .45 ACP
Barrel Length: 3-1/4"
Capacity: 6 Rounds +1
External Safety: Ambidextrous
Hammer: .260" Bobbed
Grip: Hogue Wrap Around Rubber
Trigger: .305" Combat
Frame: Compact
Front Sight: Novak Lo Mount Carry
Finish: Glassbead
Rear Sight: Fixed 2-Dot
Overall length: 6-1/2" Weight: 23.9 ounces
Material: Aluminum Alloy / Stainless Steel
I also agree you should consider browsing the S&W enthusiast's forum, as it does contain some interesting info from owners ... of which I'm one.
I'm not a big fan of +P ammunition in .45 pistols in general, however, but especially not when fired from subcompact platforms. (The line between "compact" & "subcompact" is an indistinct one, it seems, and more something to be decided by the potential purchaser). The lessened slide mass/increased slide velocity issues ... not to mention the potential for increased perceived recoil, and its potential adverse effect upon controllability ... can sometimes offer the potential for a shooter of such a little pistol to reach a point of "diminishing returns" ...
Some folks will relate their opinions, or experiences, that many HP bullets may not expand when fired from short barreled .45's ...
Maybe not, and certainly maybe not with consistency ... what round will? ... but when we were hosting some limited gelatin testing at our range, both some standard pressure Winchester RA45T 230gr, as well as the RA45TP 230gr (+P), penetrated and expanded similarly in the 4-layer denim test when fired out of my personally owned CS45 ...
If I couldn't get the RA45T loads, I'd opt for the 230gr Gold Dot ammunition, or the 230-gr Golden Sabre ...
It simply shoots MUCH better than it LOOKS ...
Much more accurate than some folks might expect, too ....
Not exactly inexpensive, however ...
A couple of our guys looking for small .45's, one of them a die-hard Colt fan who has generally carried one of the little Colt 1911's for an off duty weapon, bought CS45's of their own after shooting mine at our range ...
You could do worse ...
Notice it only weighs 23.9 ounces (empty). I believe the G36 weighs 20.11 ounces, empty & without a magazine, and the overall length of the G36 is 6.77". Neither the G36 or the CS45 are exactly "pocket pistols", unless you're talking about large, heavy coats/vests with large, sturdy pockets.
Model: CS45
Caliber: .45 ACP
Barrel Length: 3-1/4"
Capacity: 6 Rounds +1
External Safety: Ambidextrous
Hammer: .260" Bobbed
Grip: Hogue Wrap Around Rubber
Trigger: .305" Combat
Frame: Compact
Front Sight: Novak Lo Mount Carry
Finish: Glassbead
Rear Sight: Fixed 2-Dot
Overall length: 6-1/2" Weight: 23.9 ounces
Material: Aluminum Alloy / Stainless Steel
I also agree you should consider browsing the S&W enthusiast's forum, as it does contain some interesting info from owners ... of which I'm one.
I'm not a big fan of +P ammunition in .45 pistols in general, however, but especially not when fired from subcompact platforms. (The line between "compact" & "subcompact" is an indistinct one, it seems, and more something to be decided by the potential purchaser). The lessened slide mass/increased slide velocity issues ... not to mention the potential for increased perceived recoil, and its potential adverse effect upon controllability ... can sometimes offer the potential for a shooter of such a little pistol to reach a point of "diminishing returns" ...
Some folks will relate their opinions, or experiences, that many HP bullets may not expand when fired from short barreled .45's ...
Maybe not, and certainly maybe not with consistency ... what round will? ... but when we were hosting some limited gelatin testing at our range, both some standard pressure Winchester RA45T 230gr, as well as the RA45TP 230gr (+P), penetrated and expanded similarly in the 4-layer denim test when fired out of my personally owned CS45 ...
If I couldn't get the RA45T loads, I'd opt for the 230gr Gold Dot ammunition, or the 230-gr Golden Sabre ...
It simply shoots MUCH better than it LOOKS ...
Much more accurate than some folks might expect, too ....
Not exactly inexpensive, however ...
A couple of our guys looking for small .45's, one of them a die-hard Colt fan who has generally carried one of the little Colt 1911's for an off duty weapon, bought CS45's of their own after shooting mine at our range ...
You could do worse ...
MrAcheson
Member
I've shot the a friends S&W CS45. Not a bad gun, but I'm not sure whether my friend is going to keep it forever though. Give the choice I think I'd rather have a gun in a more manageable caliber for its size.
It has the common faults of small guns in large calibers. It recoils and flashes a fair bit. Enough that some shooters were developing a flinch that disappeared when they switched back to bigger guns in the caliber. We had a few reliability problems that may or may not have been user created. We were shooting at 25 yards because thats the closest we could at the range. Suffice it to say we were hitting the berm, but nothing else reliably.
It has the common faults of small guns in large calibers. It recoils and flashes a fair bit. Enough that some shooters were developing a flinch that disappeared when they switched back to bigger guns in the caliber. We had a few reliability problems that may or may not have been user created. We were shooting at 25 yards because thats the closest we could at the range. Suffice it to say we were hitting the berm, but nothing else reliably.
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