Steyr-Mannlicher Boycott

[SamlautRanger]

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/world/ny-woiran0210,0,2926375.story

Here is a recent news article about Steyr-Mannlicher selling eight hundred 12.5 mm (.50 equiv) sniper rifles to Iran! This really pisses me off and I hope many firearm owners in the USA will boycott buying Steyr-Mannlicher products.

As one who just recently returned from serving in Iraq, I can assure you that many of the terrorist and their weapons are coming over from Iran. When I was there there were several truck loads of several hundred Draganov sniper rifles confiscated, coming over from Iran through the Iraqi town of Al Kut. They were hidden in water trucks. Many more are coming over. I have a real good idea that many of these new Austrian sniper rifles may be used on our men in Iraq.

I am all for Capitalism and believe in making a product for profit, but when one is selling firearms, they should have some moral responsibility. Selling weapons to terrorist states is wrong.

 

[c_yeager]

On the other hand there is just a touch of hypocrisy in an RKBA enthusiast complaining about the sale of small arms to anyone. I suppose that Iran would probably fail a NICS check here but, then again i oppose the NICS check anyways. I guess i'm not that concerned with this. These rifles have a pretty limited application as it is. Frankly I WISH the terrorists would starting lugging around 20-30lb rifles. It would would make them a lot easier to shoot.

If we boycotted every company that ever sold a firearm to the "bad guys" we wouldnt be buying many guns, even from American companies.

 

[max popenker]

to SamlautRanger
Well, are you gonna to boycott the McDonnlel Douglas CCorp who sold plenty of F14 Tomcat jet fighters to Iran?

And why one independent country could not buy any arms to protect their independnce? are there any UNO bans on arms trade with Iran?

I found this plain stupid - sometimes you americans think that all world belongs to you. Beliveve me, that's wrong.

 

[c_yeager]

I found this plain stupid - sometimes you americans think that all world belongs to you. Beliveve me, that's wrong.

Interesting response to a thread posted by a person who lists their location as Cambodia. There is only one response that preceeds yours, Max and that is mine, which is firmly against the boycott. Maybe a bit of a rush to indictment here.

 

[Malice]

I dont think they...

... have the internet in Cambodia.

 

[Kharn]

SamlautRanger:
Thank you for your service, but reading the article a little more closely turns up this gem:

He said that U.S. Embassy personnel asked him to stop such sales not only to Iran but to potential customers in other Middle East countries -- something he said he was prepared to consider only if Washington in return lifts restrictions that prevent his company from selling certain high-tech weapons in the United States.

It sounds to me like they're offering a compromise to the US: Drop the import ban, and they'll stop selling guns to the Middle East. I wish we'd take that deal, its win-win for us.

Kharn

Editted to add:
12.7 x 99 mm is the metric designation for .50bmg

 

[50 Shooter]

Let me help everyone, BOO!!! Did that scare anyone?

Just more hype, the .50 isn't anymore dangerous then any other rifle. It just happens to be bigger and weigh more. Plus they'll need ammo for them, if they plan to use them for snipers they'll need match grade stuff.

I'm sure the VPC will be exploiting this on the next 60 minutes episode.

 

[mattf7184]

I think double tap should look into making some 50BMG ammo as well to sell for those firearms (maybe with a double charge perhaps? )

We shoulda took Steyr up on their deal, more cool guns for us

 

[max popenker]

2 c_yeager
yes, i missed the location of the original poster.
And yes, i'm not against americans - i just do not like international politics of US government.
But it is OT here, so lets' cease this talk

and what i hate really strong, is any sort of gun grabbers/prohibitors (criminal guns do not count).

 

[Cool Hand Luke 22:36]

to SamlautRanger
Well, are you gonna to boycott the McDonnlel Douglas CCorp who sold plenty of F14 Tomcat jet fighters to Iran?

Those were sold to Iran while it was still ruled by the semi-pro western Shah, as protection against any Kremlin designs on denying the West access to the oil resources of the Persian Gulf. They were not sold to a terror state as Iran is today.

And why one independent country could not buy any arms to protect their independnce? are there any UNO bans on arms trade with Iran?

The point is that these arms are most likely not going to be used to protect the independence of Iran, they will be used to exert Iranian influence over another country: Iraq.

I found this plain stupid - sometimes you americans think that all world belongs to you. Beliveve me, that's wrong.

Sometime I think you Europeans fail to believe that the attacks on 9/11 ever happened. We have every right to be acting proactively to douse any major threats from the psychopaths who attack us.

Are you going to be sending a letter to President Putin calling for the withdrawal of Russian troops from Cuba?

 

[sturmruger]

I didn't even know Steyr made a .50 caliber rifle!! While I do not support the goverment of Iran if they want to buy firearms more power to them. I kind of doubt that they will send 50 brand new rifles into iraq. I have a feeling they will use these rifles to gaurd their nuclear facilities.

 

[MobileSuitPilotX]

This isn't new.

Look up the Neutrality Acts of 1935-1941 and how they pertain to arms sales by the US in WW1 and afterwards. First we can sell arms to both sides in a conflict. Then we can't sell to any belligerents at all. That expires and FDR asks for non-interference and a "moral embargo". Then they ban all sales to belligerents again, but have a cash-and-carry exemption for a couple of years. Then...........

In other words, the politics involved in arms sales is constantly changing, and the guys we buddy up with this year and sell arms to may be the very people whose butt gets kicked by us 10 years later.

 

[Zundfolge]

He said that U.S. Embassy personnel asked him to stop such sales not only to Iran but to potential customers in other Middle East countries -- something he said he was prepared to consider only if Washington in return lifts restrictions that prevent his company from selling certain high-tech weapons in the United States.

I wonder if he means AUGs

 

[nomadboi]

Wouldn't surprise me if Iran wanted them for themselves... they've been getting some pressure from the US as well, and since Iran (and not Iraq) seems to have had some links to the 9-11 attacks, they're probably wanting to beef up their own defenses just in case.

Not that this means the rifles won't ever be used against the US anyway...

 

[Preacherman]

Talk of boycotts is silly, in this case. Steyr-Mannlicher made a totally legal sale, in terms of Austrian and international law. The USA might not like it, but we have no say in the matter. Don't forget that the USA supplied Barrett .50 rifles to Middle East nations as well... who knows whether one or more of those might not be turned against our own forces one day?

 

[Bruce H]

 

[Bart Noir]

As stated, the F-14's were sold to the Iran of the Shah, not the Mullahs.

And it was Grumman, not McDonald Douglas that made them. So that argument just made a bad approach, missed the wire and rolled off the end of the carrier deck.

Bart Noir

 

[nomadboi]

Perhaps a better example would be the CIA giving weapons to the Taliban when they were resisting the USSR...

 

[Kharn]

Nomadboi:
That wasnt the Taliban, they're a distinct (ethnic? religious? both? I cant remember) group that showed up and siezed power after the Russians pulled out. The Barretts, stingers, etc were given to the mujahiddean, who became the Northern Alliance, who duked it out with the Taliban for years and were in seriously bad shape until we showed up shortly after September 11 and started kicking Taliban butt.

The senior Northern Alliance commander was even executed by two of Osama's suicide bombers on September 10, 2001, when they were able to get an interview with him claiming to be TV reporters.

Kharn

 

[Boats]

Methinks I have already been on a 20 year boycott of Austrian products in their entirety, unless one counts Gov. Arnie's action movies as an Austrian export.

They have nothing I want and this story doesn't change that at all.

 

[Sparks]

I await the call to boycott Barrett for their sales of .50 calibre rifles that wound up in the hands of the IRA...

 

[Glock Glockler]

If Steyr doesnt sell them to Iran someone else will, maybe Russia or China, or someone will just buy them in a different country and ship them unofficially to Iran.

 

[buzz_knox]

I await the call to boycott Barrett for their sales of .50 calibre rifles that wound up in the hands of the IRA...

For the argument to work, you have to establish that Barett sold the rifles to a group that Barrett knew or should have known had links to the IRA. Your argument fails for lack of evidence.

 

[Sylvilagus Aquaticus]

uh...just because you own a tool doesn't mean you know how to use it.

How many of those F14's/F4's/F5's are still flying today? I knew some guys who were A&P contractors there in the late 70's. When they left the country, not only did the smarts to keep them flying went away but <ahem> some of the components turned up defective, missing, or inoperable. Not a few of the Royal Iranian (Palavi) air force pilots went away, too. Between 1978 and the 1980-89 Iran/Iraq war, there isn't much left with a 'made in USA' sticker inside the cockpit that's remotely intact.

How many yeehaws can snatch up a .50 off the rack and start hitting BMP's at 2000 meters without specialized training? Odds are, not many Dan'l Boone.

Regards,
Rabbit.

 

[buzz_knox]

How many yeehaws can snatch up a .50 off the rack and start hitting BMP's at 2000 meters without specialized training? Odds are, not many Dan'l Boone.

I'd be real cautious about going down this route. A lot of those "yeehaws" do have specialized training, and many of them have a history of marksmanship. I'd daresay some of those whom the .50s are going to grew up shooting like we did, only they were shooting humans in the mountains of Afghanistan, whether in opposition to the Russians or the Taliban's enemies.