T7 versus Pyrodex - BIG difference in 58 rifle

[celem]

My neighbor has a Dixie Gun Works .58 Enfield rifle. A couple of weeks ago I was with him at the local range and he shot it with Minnie Balls very successfully with 60 gr Pyrodex 2F and CCI musket caps. Perfect operation, firing every time, nice and accurate. Today we were at the range and every thing was the same except that he was using TrippleSeven 3F powder. It performed poorly with delayed fires or misfires taking two or three caps to fire.

I use TrippleSeven 3F powder with my Pietta 1858 44 cal Remington and it performs perfectly with none of the problems that my neighbor experienced with his .58 Enfield rifle. Granted, the 58's path from nipple to powder is longer and with a bend at the end while the Pietta Remington's path is short and straight, but I was most surprised to see TrippleSeven's apparent difficulty to ignite. Has anyone else got any experience comparing the two powders.

P.S.: Afterwards my neighbor called to says that he that he just cleaned the rifle and was quite surprised at how much cleaner TrippleSeven was versus Pyrodex - 70% cleaner was his statement. I purchased his leftover TrippleSeven to use in my Pietta 1858.

 

[rodwha]

I've only used T7 through my pistol (3F), and it's worked great.

Once I'm through with my Pyrodex I'll find out how it works through my .50 cal Deerstalker. I wouldn't think that it would be any harder to set off than Pyrodex.

 

[351 WINCHESTER]

I use 777 2 f in my older side cap front loader and have never had a misfire. Just keep the nipple clear. Be sure to lower your charge of 3f 777 as it's for pistols and is some hot stuff.

 

[celem]

T7 Versus Pyrodex

Re: "Be sure to lower your charge of 3f 777 as it's for pistols and is some hot stuff." - Used the same 60 grain, by volume, for both Pyrodex and T7 because the max load for a 58 is 120gr, leaving room to spare - 60gr +15% is 69gr and if we pick 20% due to being 3F, it equals 72gr - both within safe levels.

 

[BowerR64]

Ive read that the T7 doesnt like to be packed very tight but ive never had an issues with that in my pistols. Maybe in a rifle you cna pack it ALOT tighter?

I really like the T7

 

[EljaySL]

I use 45gr 2F 777 in my zouave with .578 minie balls and it works great. Only thing I can think of is that I have the musket cap nipple on mine - on some rifles and 777 I've found that some caps don't work that well. My Hawken, as an example, isn't that reliable or fast with CCI regular #11s but switch to Remington or CCI Magnum caps and it's 100%.

From my reading Pyrodex is a little easier to ignite. 777 was originally intended for inlines and it works great in other things but if your ignition isn't fairly direct you'll want to make sure it's a hot cap - magnum, Remington, or musket.

 

[celem]

After the first hangfire we packed really tight, tamping the minnie ball down hard - it made no difference.

We did use Musket Caps - I don't recall the brand. They are not marked "magnum" so I guess that they are standard. Remember - same gun, same caps, same people and same loading technique worked flawlessly with Pyrodex.

I hope the TrippleSeven powder is simply bad, such as due to age, because I purchased the nearly full canister from my neighbor as he was going back to Pyrodex and NEVER wanted to see TrippleSeven again. Since it works fine in my 1858 Remington, I purchased his remainder.

 

[Patocazador]

Did he swab and clean the nipple hole out every shot? 777 leaves a crud ring and it builds up if you don't swab frequently.

 

[celem]

Re "Did he swab and clean the nipple hole out every shot? 777 leaves a crud ring and it builds up if you don't swab frequently. " No, but it was problem from the very first shot. Also, I use nothing but TrippleSeven and get no crud with my 1858 Remington. TrippleSeven shoots pretty clean for my pistol use.

 

[EljaySL]

With musket caps some people have been having trouble with the newer CCI "reenactor" caps. The RWS caps are much nicer. Other than that, no theories.