The Tactical 30-30 Lever Action Rifle

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David,

As Cosmoline hinted, upping the velocity on a hollow point will typically reduce penetration. This is because the HP will expand more dramatically, and/or fragment.

This is also one of the reasons why pistol caliber carbines or SMGs actually have more penetration in drywall than light, high velocity rifle rounds- the lightweight, high speed .223, for instance, will tend to come apart much more rapidly than a much slower and heavier 9mm round.

John
 
How do you guys feel about Buffalo Bore .44 special loads for HD in a lever gun? Buys you another round or two in the mag as well.

_________________________________________________________

"A message from Mike Fletcher, Owner, The Gun Room

I don't reload due to time constraints. I like the .44 Special, but factory ammo does not address the true potential of the cartridge. Tim Sundles of Buffalo Bore Ammunition was willing to work with the following specs:

255 grain WFN @ 1000 fps in a 4†revolver,
with pressures suitable for older S&W's or Colt SAA's

I now offer the best factory .44 Special ammo currently made. This ammo is suitable for hunting or defense. It is not plinking ammo.

Buy a box – if you are unsatisfied, I will buy back any remaining rounds.

Price: $58.00 per box of 50. Free shipping on orders of 2 or more boxes.

Heavy .44 Specials, 255 gr. WFN, 1000 fps"
 
On the contrary- in its original, and correct usage, tactical is used to differentiate from strategic, ie:

Tactical nuclear device would be a much smaller, limited yield weapon...

John
 
How do you guys feel about Buffalo Bore .44 special loads for HD in a lever gun? Buys you another round or two in the mag as well.

BB's are made for DEEP penetration, & I don't think they're offering hollowpoints yet. I don' t think they'd be a good choice.

However, the .44SPL's from Speer or Cor-Bon would be a great idea--esp. with the velocity boost from a rifle. Maybe load the mag w/ them & keep the Magnum loads on the butt cuff (for those times that you have to punch a hole THROUGH something to punch a hole IN something... :evil: )
 
Well I might just have to go ahead with my 110 gr JHP idea, because today I aquired a second Winchester Model 94, in .30-30. Ya, I already had one, but this one was the right price. I got it from my Dad, and he said I could pay him for it latter :D

Now my nice, Pre-64 rifle can stay in the safe most of the time, and I can use this new one as a "beater". I can think it will work well in that role, since I can tell it's previous owner (not my Dad, he got it from a friend and had the thing for less than 24 hours before I took it off his hands) didn't take care of it. It's got some rust and pitting all over the outside, but the barrel looks nice and clean, so it should shoot well.
 
David4516,

Federal makes a 30/30 load with 125 grain JHP, might be a good factory alternative to 110 grain handload.

David
 
How about the Remington 30-30 Accelerators? Wouldn't they act just like a 55 grain .223 out of an AR15?
 
Well I've made up a small batch of 110 gr JHPs using IMR 4350 powder. I'm going to test them out along with the new (well, new to me anyway) rifle tommarow. I'll report back here when I return...
 
Figure you just got to have them quick box magazine taktikewl (which is the correct spelling) reloads? May I recommend to you the Winchester Model 88, the Sako Finnwolf, the BLR, and some variants of the Savage Model 99? Afraid that the .30-30 or the pistol calibers just don't have the range and "knockdown" you need for the two or three gunfights you get into on a daily basis? Please check out all those same rifles. They are available new and used in all manner of real, true rifle cartridges.
Give it up chairborne rangers and mall-ninjas. For anything a civilian or 99.999% of LE is going to do, a lever gun will handle it.
p.s. the Savage 99 is the greatest rifle of all time.
 
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p.s. the Savage 99 is the greatest rifle of all time

For shame. Everyone knows the Lee Navy '95 is the actual greatest rifle of all time. :scrutiny:

John
 
Attention reloaders:

If you load for .30-30 you might want to give this a try! These 110 gr Speer JHPs worked great! They were accurate, reliable, and best of all, the recoil was very mild. The load I used was 37.5 gr IMR 4350. I'm not sure if I'll ever use this load for "tatical" stuff, but it sure is fun to shoot! I think it would be a good one to use for situations where you want to teach someone to shoot and don't want to hurt their sholder.

I did have a small problem with my rifle. The rear sight was a bit bent, and it caused me to shoot about a foot to the right at 50 yards. I've got a different sight on there now, so next time I take this rifle to the range I'll have to see if that solves the problem...
 
Give it up chairborne rangers and mall-ninjas. For anything a civilian or 99.999% of LE is going to do, a lever gun will handle it.

YESSS!!! A BIG high five for you, Golgo-13! Thanks!
DAL
 
I know I'm pulling this thread out of the grave, but in regard to civilian self-defense and overpenetration- I've heard that any damages that happen to an innocent bystander or someones property in the process of shooting someone in self-defense is considered to be the fault of the criminal, since they initiated the encounter.
 
I don't think that is correct. I think you are going to be responsible for every bullet you fire!
 
I've got a box've 20 170 grain Hollowpoints next to my bed, my Marlin lives in a rifle case between the stand and my bed. In it's buttcuff is 9 rounds of 170 grain hollowpoints. In it's magazine at all times are, 6 170 grain hollowpoints and I have a 7nth sitting loose on the nightstand in the case I would need to chamber and top up in the middle of the night.

I may not be any Carlos Hathcock at the range but if I cant pop a badguy, in the dark...in the most familar territory in my LIFE then I've got some issues that an AR isnt going to solve. I -know- I can ratchet off 170 grains into the black at 15-20 yards faster than I can hit the black with my pop's uber tactical AR carbine he's so fond of. I also know that if I hit some goblin in the middle of the night, in central body mass there is -NO- way he will leave my house alive. I like big bore, I like Lever actions. If I had my way I'd have a 12 guage lever next to me, but all I have is my thuddy thuddy. I dunno bout you guys but I -can- work my lever with one arm. As quick or as accurate? No but I doubt your going to be a whole lot faster or accurate firing your black rifle with one arm. I think at that point adrenaline is going to negate if you've got a .223 or a .20mm.

I'm 100% confident in my beloved "Mr. Thuddy" to ensure that if I find any goblins in my house at night, Johnny long arm is going to find them in peices soon after. Break into my place and you -will- get popped with a .30-30, and you -WILL- go down on the first round that hits. Slower reload? If you cant pop the dude in your own house within 7 rounds then you dont need a new rifle you need a hell of alot more ammunition, as in to practice with.

I know I, nor anyone else can always be a perfect shot, but seriously people your in your own ulta familar house. The badguy is in an alien enviroment, at night versus an opponent who is committed (in mycase anyway) to fighting back or to die trying. I will -not- retreat from my own home be they zombies or the entire army of Ceasar. If your a goblin and you take fire, realistically are you going to either A. Stay and attempt a flank whilst laying down heavy supressive fire with your deadly black rifle so you can snag somones TV, Puter and maybe wallet whilst dodging fire from a determined defender with a .30-30 loaded with....170 GRAIN HOLLOWPOINTS!...or B. Run away and knock over some middle aged single woman with a bumper full've anti gun stickers?

We're fighting addicts in need of a fix, rapists and the occasional zombie. These arent typically people who are going to be terribly well armed, TYPICALLY. Even then if they are, are they gonna pick a house where its a fair fight or what?

Really...now zombies...those require black rifles..
 
I am not sure if I have posted this or not, but..

I have a Marlin 336 with a scout mount. I have a Tasco red dot mounted on it and sighted in for the Federal 125 grainers. I keep this as my house set up. I also have ghost ring sights that are set for the 150 silvertips I shoot when I am out in the hills. I have not shot the 125 at any sort of test medium that would be considered scientific, but when in the desert I have shot them at old cars, abondoned buildings, etc. They come apart very quickly and are not overpenatrative in the least. I would consider these much safer rounds to shoot in a urban situation that .233 fmj's. I also lived through the 92 LA riots which made me think hard about a rifle for SD. In the end I settled on my Marlin. I was never attacked by mobs of poeple, but did have individuals throw things at my vehicle on the way out of USC. I do not think an AR, AK, or SKS would have made any significant difference. One shot would have solved any problem that I encountered. I have shot alot of animals with the .30/30 and am confident in both its' use and power. I also tried some of the pistol caliber lverguns, but did have some jamming from the striaght walled cases. I guess I do not care if it is not considered tactical because I am confident that my choice will serve me well. That is my rant.

Matt
 
One who makes a 30-30 lever gun his self defense ready weapon trades away quite a bit in the way of fight stopping features.

The only FEATURE of a weapon that stops a fight is the projectile that enters the target nearest to Center Mass. I really don't think a goblin is going to be all that impressed by your extended safety lever or beveled magazine well.

30 rounds ready to go with one stroke, each round designed to stop men instantly.
The 5.56MM was a development that stemmed from the Army playing around with .22 Hornets... And it was not designed to stop a man instantly. It was designed to shoot squirrles. Shooting men with it only came about as an option after years of tingering with it. At best it remains a rodent cartridge... maybe for larger rodents thanks to the large case volume... such as Rabbits or Chucks... But I wouldnt use one on an ROUS.

.30-30 on the other hand remains a fine tactical cartridge. It was designed to shoot bigger things like Deer and Black Bear and pissed off Cowboys. You have a lot fatter of a projectile that weighs in 100 grains or more than the 5.56MM... How can that be a bad thing? You .223 guys must be compensating for something.

I'm tickled with my .30-30 336. I'd rather have a shorter barrel on it, but it's really just fine as it is. I might only have 6 rounds in my gun... but in all reality I will only need one or maybe 2 shots. It's not like I'm hunting Xenomorphs.
 
tactical 30/30

Greetings,
I enjoy the information that everyone has added. But I know for a fact that a 30/30 lever action rifle like a marlin, has more authority at 100yrds than a .223, 44mag, or a 357 mag. I believe that it may even win over the 7.62 x 39. Fadalia has a book on the model 94 and the 30/30 round, it is pretty interesting on the diffrent types of bullet velocities. Also the 30/30 round can be found in the most remote and unusual places. They have them at feed stores where I come from. In states that dont allow assult weapons (not) a lever action rifle would make a good choice. I remember a while back. I read an article in a gun magazine that showed a person that works on 30/30 marlins. He would thin the stocks, make a compartment in the stock to hold more rounds and treat the barrel to make it shoot better, and refinish the stocks with a flat black epoxy. I dont know if there is a web site that will help make modifications or imporvements. Maybe give instructions on how to impove a marlin 30/30. Any information will be appreciated. Best regards to everyone.
Saki :D
 
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