Thug Culture and the idiots who tried to rob the Marine who had a knife

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hillbilly

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I want to be completely clear here.

I am not posting this article as some sort of "pick on the young" thread.

But this is something I think I see developing more and more in the US.

Statistically, the most dangerous critter on the face of planet earth is a human male, aged 15-30.

The second most dangerous critter on earth is a human female, aged 15-30.

Combine those with worship of "thug culture" and you've got a recipe for disaster.

I think this is something that crosses all segments of society.

In Northwest Arkansas, the latest spate of violent home invasions were perpetrated by a pair of middle-class white kids who wanted a chance to prove what bad@$$es they were.

Young idiots with a desire to emulate thug culture is a recipe for bad things to happen.



http://www.ajc.com/sunday/content/epaper/editions/sunday/metro_442897aa235fc14500e1.html

Rap culture cited in alleged attack by teens
Andrea Jones, Paul Donsky - Staff
Sunday, June 4, 2006

Amy Martin had three answers when asked whom she admired most for a school project: her grandfather, Martin Luther King Jr. and Tupac Shakur.

Like thousands of teens, Martin idolized Shakur, a rap star whose violent death a decade ago epitomized the thug culture he helped shape.

Friday, it was Martin in the coffin --- the victim, her friends say, of trying too hard to live the kind of life she saw in rap videos.

Stabbed to death by a former Marine as she and four other teens allegedly held him up at gunpoint on a dark Midtown street, Martin died less than a month after her 17th birthday.

"It wasn't like her to do something like that," said her friend, Tiffany Lowery, 16. "She was influenced by people around her."

The four boys who were with Martin on Memorial Day face felony charges of armed robbery and assault. One of the teens, 18-year-old Christopher Daniel, remains at Atlanta Medical Center in serious condition with stab wounds to the chest.

After Martin's funeral, where teens, some clad in bandanas and drooping pants, remembered their friend, Atlanta police investigator R.C. Huffman stood outside, shaking his head. Huffman serves as the school resource officer at Grady High School, where Martin and some of the teenagers involved had attended.

"These kids went to the right schools. They had all the chances," Huffman said. "They just wanted to portray this image that they're bad, they're tough."

The teens all came from middle-class families, he said. At least two had mothers who were teachers. Most lived in well-kept subdivisions with tidy lawns.

"They all had money. They all could have gone the other way," said Lasasha Matthews, 17, a rising senior at Grady. "It doesn't make any sense."

Martin's friends described her as a goofy girl who loved dancing, clubbing and writing poetry. She had been working at Six Flags over Georgia for about three months and had started dating Keyunta Dowell, who was also running the rides at the popular theme park.

Atlanta police say Dowell, 16, was another one of the teenagers in the car the night they tried to rob a terrified Thomas Autry, a Desert Storm veteran on his way home from work as a waiter. Cornered by his pursuers, he fought back with a pocketknife.

Police say it wasn't the first time the teenage robbery crew had attacked a victim on the streets.

The five carried three guns --- two shotguns and a pistol --- and rode in a dark blue Cadillac that belonged to the mother of Christopher Hayes, 18, according to incident reports.

Also in the car, the reports said, was Kendall Barksdale, 17, an athletic and popular high school senior set to graduate from Grady last Wednesday. He had planned to head for college in the fall, friends and family said.

Anticipating his graduation day, Kendall's family hung a banner from the staircase overlooking the living room of his home. "Congratulations Kendall & Robert," the sign read, also noting the graduation of Kendall's younger brother from middle school.

Kendall's grandfather, Rubin Lowery, said he still can't believe what happened.

"It definitely was a shock," said Lowery, doing yard work in the front yard of the large brick home he shares with Kendall and his family. "What was he thinking about?"

The anguish in Lowery's voice was palpable. Kendall had always been a good kid, he said, getting good grades and minding his parents.

Kendall had at least nine tattoos, according to a 2005 article in the Grady High School newspaper, with plans to cover even more of his body in artwork.

Lowery blames Kendall's friends for leading him astray.

"We tried to tell him to choose his friends better," Lowery said.

"Kids are kids," he said. "No matter who their father is, where they are from, kids have a mind of their own."

Lowery said Kendall must be held accountable for his actions.

"I told his mother, 'If he has done something wrong, the law applies to everybody.' "

Last Thursday, the "congratulations" sign remained in place. A high school yearbook on the coffee table was turned to Kendall's picture.

"It's awful. It really hurts," his grandfather said. "To see a kid as smart as that . . . do some dumb [stuff] like that --- I don't really understand."

Hayes, the driver of the Cadillac, lives in a sprawling new subdivision in Douglas County, with tidy brick homes on winding streets surrounding a swim and tennis center.

Neighborhood children have drawn a hop-scotch court in the street.

A soccer goal sits in a neighbor's backyard. The family did not return messages left on an answering machine last week, but Hayes' defense attorney Bruce Harvey said Hayes "has never been in trouble before and is in no sense a thug." Hayes previously worked at American Express at the Atlanta airport, Harvey said.

"He's clearly upset," Harvey said. "He's the one that drove immediately to the hospital. It's sad. It's a tragedy for young people."

At Martin's funeral Friday in Southwest Atlanta, Pastor Craig Oliver challenged teens to give up their fascination with the hip hop lifestyle and turn their lives around. With his deep voice echoing though the pews at Elizabeth Baptist Church, Oliver told teens to "get yourself together, get a GED, get a diploma, get a meaningful job."

"Stop thinking it's cool to be a thug," he said. Oliver also asked teens to unload their guns and drop them off at the church.

Dozens came forward, many weeping, promising to give up their weapons. By Saturday afternoon, the church had collected at least three guns.

--- Staff writers Beth Warren and Bill Montgomery contributed to this article.
 
Statistically, the most dangerous critter on the face of planet earth is a human male, aged 15-30.

I agree, and current events demonstrates it. There was a similar incident being discussed in another thread here (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=203875), except that in that one the selected victim had a handgun rather than a knife with which to defend himself. I sent that link to a friend in PA to ask if he knew of the event. He did -- he's a former LEO so I thought he might. He told me there was another very similar assault just a couple of miles from the one in the link. Three "good kid" high school football stars attacked a guy as he came out of a pizza parlor. The guy's wife and kids were sitting in the car when the three "good kids" jumped the guy and began to stomp him.

He shot two of them. All three were drunk, even though they were too young to buy alcohol.

If those are the "good" kids, God save us all from the bad ones.
 
Yep.

I've had to work with many youngsters like that. They carry on with the "thug culture" bit as youths, and the day after they turn 18, they do the same thing - only now, instead of being let off with a juvenile slap on the wrist, they're adults, and they find themselves doing hard time. When they're in the pen with 1,500 other hard-core nasties, they find out really, really fast that they're not nearly as tough as they thought they were . . . but by then, it's too late.

:rolleyes:
 
I don't know if I'd agree with the 15-30 year old females being the second most dangerous (although they are getting worse and worse). I see a lot more crimes around here committed by 30+ year old males that are, no doubt, those same dangerous 15-30 year olds, just grown up and still vertical.
It's frightning how bad kids are getting these days.
I think it's a combination of the invincible mentality when you are that age, peer pressure, the lack of responsibility we are teaching kids (it's someone elses fault, no matter what you did), lack of parenting, and the whole entertainment industry.
I'm 29 so I'd fall in the category. Luckily I was raised right.
 
"Statistically, the most dangerous critter on the face of planet earth is a human male, aged 15-30."

I'm happy that you think this overweight, skinny armed, 18 year old without a CCW & gets tired just watching sports, is tougher than a grizzly or cougar:D :D . But seriously, I'm a good guy. I may be a cynic who believes that we live in Orwell's "1984" world already, but I still try to be cheerful:D . That's why my most used emoticon is:D .

I despise rap. Give me tickets to Andy Williams instead.

I despise people who wear pants around their ankles all the time. Get a belt already!

I despise people with piercings in 3/4's of their body:uhoh: :barf: . I don't even have a clip-on earing.

We aren't all bad. Just rare.
 
I just wanna say "Bravo Zulu" to the Marine.

One man with a pocketknife vs four attackers with at least two guns...he Marine survives relatively unscathed and one of the attackers ends up dead. He didn't want the fight, but it was brought to him...and he prevailed.

Crappy situation, but Semper Fi.

"Don't bring a gun to a knife fight" :)
 
Cultures can go wrong. So can subcultures. Right now the "hip hop culture" is by far the sickest subculture in America.

It's not the first time a subculture has gone sick. There was a really bad subculture formed along the Mississippi river valley circa 1818 - 1850ish, Clayton Cramer wrote of it...more violence within the culture than within the hip-hop culture today. It was almost exclusively white on white BTW.

Per Clayton the cure was the rise of the "Bible Belt" culture in the South, it got to a point where the best way to get out of a duel was to say you were too God-fearing to kick somebody's @$$.

Another culture that went ill was the frontier culture, esp. in the west where it got to a point where "the only good Indian was a dead Indian". That subculture was more externally violent than internally violent.

The hip-hop culture is both internally and externally violent, moreso internally judging by raw numbers.

The "old west culture" reformed in the 1920s, and eventually got to a point where the previous violence against the First Nations became a source of embarassment. But once stripped of it's racist/genocidal elements, the rural western culture had (and still has) a lot to offer and a good percentage of the folk around here identify with it, esp. the elements of self reliance, honesty, competence when off the beaten track, etc. The racist and genocidal elements were removed in part via pop cultural influences (ie: "Lone Ranger and Tanto" and innumerable clones) and as part of the general shedding of overt racism in America's white society in the mid-late 20th century.

Likewise, the hip-hop culture isn't all bad. There are elements of "tell it like it is" that have merit, plenty more...just gotta get the violence levels down :rolleyes:.

There is an organized effort underway to do exactly that, via pop cultural influences. The band "Black Eyed Peas" have been very explicit about it, many more. But it's going to take a while.

Sigh.
 
Statistically, the most dangerous critter on the face of planet earth is a human male, aged 15-30.

Used to teach high school and know first hand this is sad, but true. How many people are killed or injured by bears or cougars in this country? (I think I detect sarcasm?). How many by the "thugs"?
Yeah they are dangerous, that's why I walk around my own place with a pistol in my pocket. I always carry, where legal, and generally avoid the places it is not. Hope I never have to use it, but I know how idiotic this age group is. Rap music, video games, Raves, Meth, criminals honored, how could they help but be? All you can do is to try and protect yourself and your fellow humans. I don't really consider the type of thugs that you describe, and we all know, to be human. You must have empathy to be human.:fire:
 
"How many people are killed or injured by bears or cougars in this country? (I think I detect sarcasm?). How many by the "thugs"? "


I don't know:confused: . I was being funny.:D
 
Age 15-30 is the most dangerous? Pleeeeeeeeease. I'm going to be 17 in October and I see little kids half my age doing things more dangerous than anything i've ever done. I love how people try to blame everything on "rap" music or "thug culture". Nothing more than an easy answer. It's all the parents faults. Raise kids good and they grow up good. Raise them bad and they grow up bad. Don't spend time with kids then they hang around the wrong crowd and get in trouble.

I was brought up great by my parents and am disciplined whenever I get out of line. I love rap music (as long as it's not Eminem) and love to wear baggy clothes. In fact I been dressing that way since I was like 4.
 
So if they were all good kids led astray by their "bad" friends which one of the four who was described as a "good kid" was the "bad friend" that led them astray.
 
Thug Culture

I agree with the poster about "thug culture". I went to school surrounded by these half-wit Cro-Mags (I'm 24). I was raised well by my parents however, and am a good man. I don't fall into the tough guy routine and generally adopt a live and let live policy with other people. I respect those that earn my respect and don't bite unless pushed.
 
What kind of parent lets their 17 year old kid get at "least 9 tattoos"? I think there *just might* be a parenting problem here.

The "thug culture" think isnt exactly new. Look at all the rebels that were created by James Dean movies and "The Wild One". People have a certain urge to be criminals because its the easiest way to achieve a public "uniqueness".
 
You're right. Kids today are TOTALLY out of control. Why they're attacking teachers and I even heard they destroyed Hollister!!

I think it's a mistake to assume this is a new trend. Young males in particular have always been dangerous and unstable. Most are OK, but you have to keep an eye on them and a grip on your handgun when they're looking for trouble. Groups of them, esp. when drunk or on drugs, can get out of control.
 
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the "kids" need a murder charge too

Amy is in the ground because of her and her friends decisions.
I thought that if someone dies in the commission of a felony
that all the criminals were charged with murder, even if it's
the perpetrator who dies.
 
A couple of clarifications:

I think trying to write these situations off as "kids not raised right" is trying to take the easy way out and lay blame where it shouldn't always logically be placed. The decision to be a "thug" is made by one person and one person only. Sometimes things could have been made better by the parents...sometimes it doesn't make any difference. There are more than enough cases where one kid out of several in a household decides to be a "thug." All the kids in the household were raised the same so you can hardly blame it on the parents. There aren't a whole lot of programs or laws that parents can turn to that have a teen in trouble that refuses to abide by the rules of the house. And in many cases the laws protect those youngsters more than they protect the parents who are supposedly in charge.
 
It's all the parents faults. Raise kids good and they grow up good. Raise them bad and they grow up bad. Don't spend time with kids then they hang around the wrong crowd and get in trouble.

Only partially true there guy, and more than a bit of a copout. Kids, particularly at these ages, begin to make heavy decisions for themselves. Some are good, some are bad, but one can hope the bad ones they make aren't that bad, and that they learn from them so they don't make worse decisions later...sometimes this works, sometimes it doesn't.

As a former kid myself :))) who made my share of good and bad decisions during those ages and now much later as a parent, I agree it's true that (good) parental involvement is the basis to which a child's character is formed, and hopefully is the basis of character that is relied on decisions are presented to them (would mom/dad think this is a good idea?) But have no doubt: many decisions are ultimately chosen by the kids themselves regardless, sometimes with ugly outcomes like here.

The wisdom of (most) parents is that they understand there are consequences to actions and just how bad (or good) they can be. Kids on the other hand still make decisions, and don't understand those far-reaching consequences.

Come back to this thread say...10-15 years from now and see if you don't agree:p

Chris
 
What kind of parent lets their 17 year old kid get at "least 9 tattoos"? I think there *just might* be a parenting problem here.
That was my first thought, interestingly enough.

I think it's a mistake to assume this is a new trend. Young males in particular have always been dangerous and unstable.
That's a fact.

When I was in high school back in the late seventies/early eighties, my high school's football team (and their inevitable pack of wannabe groupies) would amuse themselves on Saturday nights by going to random public establishments and beating the snot outta any rent-a-cops they would find there. Everybody in school knew this, and it wasn't uncommon practice in the region. Most of us just tried to stay out of the way of this kind of stuff and simply focus on getting thru high school.

But certainly cultural influences can go a long way to dragging kids into a given subculture. Hip-hop seems to be a more prevelant and easier to identify with than, say, being a football jock groupie, and that probably makes it a bit more worrisome in general.
 
It's frightning how bad kids are getting these days.
What kind of parent lets their 17 year old kid get at "least 9 tattoos"? I think there *just might* be a parenting problem here.
The parents of today's children are yesterday's gang members . . . do you really think a 70's/80's -era Black Panther, Latin King, Skinhead, whatever, is going to provide a good role model for his offspring?

What we're starting to see more and more of is feral youth - not immoral, but thoroughly amoral, unable to relate to or feel any empathy with another human being.

These are the kind who wouldn't turn away and draw the drapes, but who would probably laugh at and be amused by the plight of Kitty Genovese.

I remember reading about this in predictions made decades ago . . . and it makes me sad to see those predictions borne out.
 
After the parents quit crying long enough to catch their breath, what do you want to bet the victim (marine) ends up in civil court ?

Unless Georgia has the right laws ?
 
Wow.. a MARINE kicked the hell out of those MTV wanna be's.

You would think that they would get the picture.. a MARINE with a pocket knife, the training and the will to live is a BIGGER BAD ASS than anything that MTV can come up with.

I don't call them thugs... driving around in your MOM's car is not the path to true thug-dome.... 'MOM.... can I borrow the car!' hahahahahahaha losers.

I say that the kids low self esteem (they don't have thier own self image.. they need to borrow it rappers) and the fact that mommy and daddy probibly never said NO (9 tatoos?) would be the combo that turned these retards into losers.

Plus the juvinile laws (clean slate at 18.. NO WAY!) is MUCH to lenient on kids.
 
It seems that the vast majority of thugs have lots of violence in them but no tactics or training whereas we at THR have a good bit of training and tactics(and gun skills) but no violence for no reason.

It seems that thugs are a danger to themselves as much as anything - they bluff and bluff and kill people but then they get scared and do stupid(er) things and get caught. - And its all over less then 1000$ mostly!!!:confused:

So it's clear - thug culture has bad music and stupid criminals with bad gun taste.
 
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