Which is exactly what I'd be doing. Our hallways aren't that long and of course I wouldn't be charging through the hall at someone with a gun that is a bad plan. Tho hiding in the dark after recognizing someone broke in and isn't my family member as they would have a key or would call me. Stabbing them with a giant blade stuck to the end of a 4 foot rifle seems intelligent to me. If they have a knife they wont be able to reach me save if they have a sword. If they have a gun well damn i tried.
Look, go get a 12 inch stick and tape it to a military rifle, assuming you have one, and try slashing and thrusting around the house. Once you've wrecked the place ask if it wouldn't have been easier to have just pulled the trigger.
WE discuss ways to defend ourselves without firearms all the time and no one takes this idea of your's seriously. A bayonet on the end of a rifle is too clumsy a weapon for home defense. You can keep saying I don't understand or that you watched some show or that you just can't accept it, but that's the fact. Almost everyone here would feel more prepared with a chief's knife than a clumsy rifle with a bayonet on it (if there weren't any bullets in the stupid thing). You can slash and thrust and move fluidly with a big knife while that silly piece of firewood with the pokey thing on the end doesn't even thrust well unless you've been well trained in bayonet drills. As far as slashing and movement are concerned it is a hindrance.
Long guns have disadvantages because of weight and maneuverability in houses. The longer the gun the worse it gets. Add a bayonet on the end of that nice long rifle and you're even clumsier than with the rifle alone. The point of HD is to use your knowledge of your terrain to your advantage and to fort up forcing the BG in your home to come to you, preferably down a "fatal funnel" like stairwell or hallway. You don't go flailing around the house hunting for trouble so you can get jumped by some hopped up criminal because you've got 4 ft. of clumsy hardwood and steel poking around in the dark.
Would you ever use your bayonet for home defense/hunting?
- Thread starter Sobel
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The only rifle I'd even consider keeping a toadstabber on for h/d use would be an M1 carbine. The whole package isn't too long or unmanagable IMO. But I'm still not gonna do it, it has a 15 rd. mag and two more on the stock, that oughta be enough.
I've a deep hatred for shotguns so I choose the bayonet+rifle . Can someone explain to me i must not have read why a bayonet on the end of a rifle isn't equivalent of a short spear that can also fire a projectile? Does the bayonet turn to rubber as soon as its attatched to the rifle? Does the rifle lose all its rigidity when a bayonet is attached? If not blade on the end of a stick = spear? Spears are valid weapons right, and rifle+bayonet are what5-5 1/2 feet tops is a relatively short spear. So small spear more manueverable and give different modes of attack. Either way I'll not shift your opinions, for my situation it works for yours perhaps it doesn't .
You have never been to basic training have you? Practice any bayonet drills?
I can't even hold that Turk with bayonet at port arms without poking a hole in my ceiling. Forget low ready as well, gets hung up in the carpet.
Turning a corner...not gonna happen.
You need room to make fluid series of moves to fight with a bayonet. If you live in a mansion with no furniture. Maybe it would be possible.
Look at it this way. You lunge, the BG parries with his crowbar. He is now inside your 5' pigsticker with a shorter easier to wield weapon.
You will not be able to swing that 5' rifle around for a but-stroke to regain control of the situation,then step back to stick him to finish him off.
You will not be able to swing that 5' rifle around for a but-stroke to regain control of the situation,then step back to stick him to finish him off.
i have high ceilings with plenty of places to spring out and thrust , if i get them from the side thats taking the force of an entire human being vs what the ribs maybe an arm if its in the way which if somehow doesn't kill him his lungs will be punctured. my tiny bathroom gives me enough room to weild anything 6 feet and under effectively. So is it now a bad idea i know you will all stick to your guns ( get it yea puns how wonderful ).You have never been to basic training have you? Practice any bayonet drills?
I can't even hold that Turk with bayonet at port arms without poking a hole in my ceiling. Forget low ready as well, gets hung up in the carpet.
Turning a corner...not gonna happen.
You need room to make fluid series of moves to fight with a bayonet. If you live in a mansion with no furniture. Maybe it would be possible.
I guess nobody is truly wrong. Both are manners in which to dispatch foes and no I don't have formal training but with a mosin nagant spike bayonet you don't get too much slashing. Thrust with a thrusting weapon. If its good enough for Suvorov its good enough for anyone.
Then it becomes a fight and tho he has a weapon , I have the element of surprise. Perhaps it is because many of you are older by many years where you wouldn't risk such a situation. Due to my experiences I would.
BullfrogKen
Moderator Emeritus
Without any training it seems like a good way to give your perfectly functional, loaded rifle to someone. Or have it knocked out of your hands.
Ever see someone drop his rifle swinging it at a target on the bayonet course? I have. Ever see someone stick in into something on the bayonet course, and have it stay stuck? I have. Ever see someone have a thrust fouled by clothing on the bayonet course? I have.
Ever been on a bayonet course in basic training at all? I have.
I have a few here, but they're most certainly not in my plan, at all. They're novelty items.
When you're out of ammo it's better than nothing at all. But really, how much ammo are you looking to burn through inside your house and still have people standing around just waiting for you to run them through?
Ever see someone drop his rifle swinging it at a target on the bayonet course? I have. Ever see someone stick in into something on the bayonet course, and have it stay stuck? I have. Ever see someone have a thrust fouled by clothing on the bayonet course? I have.
Ever been on a bayonet course in basic training at all? I have.
I have a few here, but they're most certainly not in my plan, at all. They're novelty items.
When you're out of ammo it's better than nothing at all. But really, how much ammo are you looking to burn through inside your house and still have people standing around just waiting for you to run them through?
ArfinGreebly
Moderator Emeritus
Fencing With Pointy Firewood
I used to fence, way back when I was cute and skinny and young and agile and brash and invulnerable.
Your typical saber -- an honest-to-gawd fightin' sharps -- has a blade in the 25-to-30 inch range which, with the grip, guard, and pommel gives you approximately three feet of sharp, pointy, edged weapon.
A weapon moreover designed for agile, active, confrontational, head-on, fast-paced fighting. Light, responsive, well balanced, steel-as-art.
It's what a bayonet would want to be when it grows up.
If you met me in a hallway or a reasonably uncluttered room with the swingin' or stabbin' weapon of your choice, and I got to have a saber, there's a real good chance -- even as rusty and old and slow and fat as I am -- that I would ruin your day, or at least convince you that you'd been in a real fight.
That's a purpose-made, field-tested, time-refined personal one-on-one combat weapon.
A joy to hold, a song to wield.
Do I paint an adequate picture of this delightful and deadly mistress of civilized savagery?
Just in case the point escapes: it's not a compromise weapon, it's not an add-on weapon, it's not an "expedient" anything; it's exactly what it was designed for: an instrument of close quarters mayhem. Civilized mayhem.
Now, here I am at home, and I hear someone breaking into the house. A scant few feet from me, on the wall, is my beloved saber. In the next room is my firearm of choice. Which one do I grab?
Well, having spent enough time on the piste with the tools of fencing to know the space requirements of the swirling, silky, slashing saber of doom, and knowing the engagement distance of it, I step lively past it into the chamber wherein my trusty carbine stands, and stand to in preparation for my appointment with the intruder.
The sword stays on the wall, its sculpted lines untouched by any of the spilt haemoglobin in the ensuing event.
Why?
Because as graceful and perfect as it is, it will be altogether too clumsy, limited and confining to be effective in an free-form engagement with as-yet unknown numbers of dastards of undiscovered equipage.
Yes, it makes for great romance, but awful tactics.
I'm grabbin' the gun.
Now, having said all that, what if I had as an option, a poor quality sword substitute stuck on the end of some kind of modern musket weighing several pounds instead of my perfectly balanced sword -- which I've already eliminated as a choice -- and I could grab that to confront the intruder(s)?
Come on. Really. Do I honestly look that clueless? Is it the hat? It must be the hat.
So, no. No bayonet.
Basically, if I'm grabbing a bayonet, it's because I have run out of all my other options.
It is entirely and only a weapon of last resort. I have knives in my kitchen that I would take in preference to a bayonet.
And if you write a video game where that scenario is required, I'm not playing it. I have no urge to inflict that kind of anguish on myself.
I used to fence, way back when I was cute and skinny and young and agile and brash and invulnerable.
Your typical saber -- an honest-to-gawd fightin' sharps -- has a blade in the 25-to-30 inch range which, with the grip, guard, and pommel gives you approximately three feet of sharp, pointy, edged weapon.
A weapon moreover designed for agile, active, confrontational, head-on, fast-paced fighting. Light, responsive, well balanced, steel-as-art.
It's what a bayonet would want to be when it grows up.
If you met me in a hallway or a reasonably uncluttered room with the swingin' or stabbin' weapon of your choice, and I got to have a saber, there's a real good chance -- even as rusty and old and slow and fat as I am -- that I would ruin your day, or at least convince you that you'd been in a real fight.
That's a purpose-made, field-tested, time-refined personal one-on-one combat weapon.
A joy to hold, a song to wield.
Do I paint an adequate picture of this delightful and deadly mistress of civilized savagery?
Just in case the point escapes: it's not a compromise weapon, it's not an add-on weapon, it's not an "expedient" anything; it's exactly what it was designed for: an instrument of close quarters mayhem. Civilized mayhem.
Now, here I am at home, and I hear someone breaking into the house. A scant few feet from me, on the wall, is my beloved saber. In the next room is my firearm of choice. Which one do I grab?
Well, having spent enough time on the piste with the tools of fencing to know the space requirements of the swirling, silky, slashing saber of doom, and knowing the engagement distance of it, I step lively past it into the chamber wherein my trusty carbine stands, and stand to in preparation for my appointment with the intruder.
The sword stays on the wall, its sculpted lines untouched by any of the spilt haemoglobin in the ensuing event.
Why?
Because as graceful and perfect as it is, it will be altogether too clumsy, limited and confining to be effective in an free-form engagement with as-yet unknown numbers of dastards of undiscovered equipage.
Yes, it makes for great romance, but awful tactics.
I'm grabbin' the gun.
Now, having said all that, what if I had as an option, a poor quality sword substitute stuck on the end of some kind of modern musket weighing several pounds instead of my perfectly balanced sword -- which I've already eliminated as a choice -- and I could grab that to confront the intruder(s)?
Come on. Really. Do I honestly look that clueless? Is it the hat? It must be the hat.
So, no. No bayonet.
Basically, if I'm grabbing a bayonet, it's because I have run out of all my other options.
It is entirely and only a weapon of last resort. I have knives in my kitchen that I would take in preference to a bayonet.
And if you write a video game where that scenario is required, I'm not playing it. I have no urge to inflict that kind of anguish on myself.
Black Butte
Member
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I would never use a bayonet for self defense or hunting, but the fact that the lugs piss off the antis is reason enough for me to get one.
Idk one could do alot of damage with a sabre but i spose it depends on your abode if its impossible to use. Also if someone were to make a rifle that had a blade that was ment to be on it as in made connected and balanced would you not use it? Also is this not the coolest looking thing in the world?
http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2010/11/24/axe-guns/
Rail Driver
Member
That axe gun would be awesome stretched out into a full size axe/carbine size rifle, with a percussion lock instead of flintlock.
One buddy of mine took one with his bayonet last year, I'll see if he has pictures. To hear him tell it now, it was a 450 lb beast with tusks as long as your hand... I seem to remember him telling the story differently while we were cutting up the chops.
One buddy of mine took one with his bayonet last year, I'll see if he has pictures. To hear him tell it now, it was a 450 lb beast with tusks as long as your hand... I seem to remember him telling the story differently while we were cutting up the chops.
I'd just like to thank you for that glorious, poetic, and hilarious bit of rhetoric.
Applause smiley???
And just so I am somewhat on topic:
I can scarcely imagine a situation where I would have any practical use for a bayonet while hunting or for SD. OTOH, I wouldn't go so far as to say there would never be a reason to use a bayonet.
I think they are just the coolest, would be cool to see them make a francisca pistol . fire it throw it just take 4 if someone starts to complain about giving up your weapon.
JVoutilainen
Member
This discussion is not about what would be effective in a self defense situation, this is about what would look cool. This is about posing. And you only want to make the next best choice and pose ONE time, when it comes to dealing with a potentially life threatening situation.
I'm sure this topic would be well received were this a forum of the Society for Creative Anachronism... but, this is not.
ArfinGreebly,
Bravo!
I'm sure this topic would be well received were this a forum of the Society for Creative Anachronism... but, this is not.
ArfinGreebly,
Bravo!
naw it became ax gun combo is cool , all these fellows basically explained how bayonets suck for hd and hunting I still believe a bayonet can be used effectively in both situations regardless of how it changes the aim or unwieldy it is. pkm machine gun is large and unwieldy tho not the most practical of tools it would get the job done. Yes there is a difference between bayonet and uber machinegewehr still same idea.
JVoutilainen
Member
Yes, you think you can choose/create your own reality. Well, good luck on that.
Sure, whatever you say
In all honesty i expected at least someone to say that bayonets aren't garbage that somebody might have used a bayonet to thwart a burglary attempt or maybe protected themselves from an angry buck. At the very least people would show their rifles with their bayos on them, see some cool unique ones.
BigN
Member
If someone is in my house uninvited I'll use whatever means is at hand to relieve myself of the problem. If a bayonet or any type of knife is close enough to grab, well, they better be quicker than I am.
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