jell-dog
Member.
38SPL Roll VS Taper Crimp
CAUTION: The following thread includes posts of loading data tested in my guns chambered for this cartridge.
USE AT YOUR OWN RISK.
Neither the writer, The High Road, nor the staff of THR assume any liability for any damage or injury resulting from use of this information.
This being said, NONE of these loads are compressed.![Big Grin :D :D](data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7)
All loads at their respective COL's had (to me) a mild/moderate felt recoil. YMMV
Here are the guidelines I will be using: 10 yards, sitting, open sights, MTM pistol rest, target has 1/2" grid lines and 1" bullseye, 7 rounds for each bullet data.
I will be shooting with a S&W Model 686-5+, 4" barrel for all range work.
ALSO, as suggested by THR member ljnowell, I decided to run data comparing Roll Crimp and Taper Crimp:
Please note that I decided to try Taper crimp on all the differnt bullets (not just the DEWC or L-SWC) I am using, some with good results, some not so good.
The bullets I will be using are:
X-TREME 158gr PLATED SWC (I will abbreviate to X-T P-SWC)
BERRYS 148gr PLATED HBWC (I will abbreviate Berry P-HBWC)
BERRYS 148gr PLATED DEWC (I will abbreviate Berry P-DEWC)
FRONTIER 125gr PLATED FLAT POINT (I will abbreviate to Front P-FP)
MBC 148gr COATED DEWC (I will abbreviate to MBC C-DEWC) (THANK YOU vaalpens!!)
MBC 158gr COATED SWC (I will abbreviate to MBC C-SWC) (THANK YOU Dudedog!!)
MBC 140gr COATED ZINGER (I will abbreviate to MBC ZINGER) (THANK YOU Dudedog!!)
MBC 158gr LEAD SWC (I will abbreviate to MBC L-SWC) (THANK YOU Dudedog!!)
OREGON TRAIL 158gr LEAD SWC (I will abbreviate to O-T L-SWC) (THANK YOU edleit!!)
So, here are my results:
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-001D, X-TREME 158gr PLATED SWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.5gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, COL= Lite Roll Crimp @ Cannalure
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-001E, X-TREME 158gr PLATED SWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.5gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, COL= Taper Crimp SLIGHTLY above Cannalure
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-002C, BERRYS 148gr PLATED HBWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.4gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, COL= Lite Roll Crimp with bullet 0.125" above case mouth
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-002E, BERRYS 148gr PLATED HBWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.4gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, COL= Taper Crimp with bullet 0.125" above case mouth
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-003D, BERRYS 148gr PLATED DEWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.6gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, COL= Lite Roll Crimp with bullet 0.125" above case mouth
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-003E, BERRYS 148gr PLATED DEWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.6gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, COL= Taper Crimp with bullet 0.125" above case mouth
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-004D, FRONTIER 125gr PLATED FLAT POINT, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.7gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, COL= 1.240", Lite Roll Crimp
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-004E, FRONTIER 125gr PLATED FLAT POINT, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.7gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, COL= 1.240", Taper Crimp
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-005C, MBC 148gr COATED DEWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.4gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Lite Roll Crimp @ Crimp Groove
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-005E, MBC 148gr COATED DEWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.4gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Taper Crimp SLIGHTLY above Crimp Groove
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-006D, MBC 158gr COATED SWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.7gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Lite Roll Crimp @ Crimp Groove
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-006E, MBC 158gr COATED SWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.7gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Taper Crimp SLIGHTLY above Crimp Groove
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-007C, MBC 140gr COATED ZINGER, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.6gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Lite Roll Crimp @ Crimp Groove
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-007E, MBC 140gr COATED ZINGER, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.6gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Taper Crimp SLIGHTLY above Crimp Groove
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-008C, MBC 158gr LEAD SWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.3gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Lite Roll Crimp @ Crimp Groove
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-008E, MBC 158gr LEAD SWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.3gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Taper Crimp SLIGHTLY above Crimp Groove
View attachment 745520
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-009C, ORIGON TRAIL 158gr LEAD SWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.3gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Lite Roll Crimp @ Crimp Groove
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-009E, ORIGON TRAIL 158gr LEAD SWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.3gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Taper Crimp SLIGHTLY above Crimp Groove
View attachment 745521
A big THANK YOU to the THR members Dudedog, ljnowell and vaalpens for suppling data or bullets for this test![Big Grin :D :D](data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7)
Hope you enjoy this thread as much as I enjoy putting it together!
As you can see, I need to develop some of these loads more while a few show VERY good accuracy.
I feel the MBC 148gr COATED DEWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.4gr, WSP Primers load would perform better at 2.9gr to 3.1gr BULLSEYE.
The MBC 158gr LEAD SWC and OREGON TRAIL LASER CAST 158gr LEAD SWC showed no leading at 3.3gr BULLSEYE in my revolver.
As always, all comments are greatly appreciated![Big Grin :D :D](data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7)
JD
CAUTION: The following thread includes posts of loading data tested in my guns chambered for this cartridge.
USE AT YOUR OWN RISK.
Neither the writer, The High Road, nor the staff of THR assume any liability for any damage or injury resulting from use of this information.
This being said, NONE of these loads are compressed.
All loads at their respective COL's had (to me) a mild/moderate felt recoil. YMMV
Here are the guidelines I will be using: 10 yards, sitting, open sights, MTM pistol rest, target has 1/2" grid lines and 1" bullseye, 7 rounds for each bullet data.
I will be shooting with a S&W Model 686-5+, 4" barrel for all range work.
ALSO, as suggested by THR member ljnowell, I decided to run data comparing Roll Crimp and Taper Crimp:
If I could make a suggestion it would be to try loading some with no crimp. Seat the bullet to the point of the crimp groove just slightly below the case mouth and just straighten out the case flare. Almost like you would taper crimp a 45 acp.
In my quest for the ultimate bullseye load in 38 special I found this to provide the best accuracy with both DEWC and LSWC.
I've also noticed that many other precision pistol shooters are doing the same thing. The load levels are such that a roll crimp simply isn't necessary.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Please note that I decided to try Taper crimp on all the differnt bullets (not just the DEWC or L-SWC) I am using, some with good results, some not so good.
The bullets I will be using are:
X-TREME 158gr PLATED SWC (I will abbreviate to X-T P-SWC)
BERRYS 148gr PLATED HBWC (I will abbreviate Berry P-HBWC)
BERRYS 148gr PLATED DEWC (I will abbreviate Berry P-DEWC)
FRONTIER 125gr PLATED FLAT POINT (I will abbreviate to Front P-FP)
MBC 148gr COATED DEWC (I will abbreviate to MBC C-DEWC) (THANK YOU vaalpens!!)
MBC 158gr COATED SWC (I will abbreviate to MBC C-SWC) (THANK YOU Dudedog!!)
MBC 140gr COATED ZINGER (I will abbreviate to MBC ZINGER) (THANK YOU Dudedog!!)
MBC 158gr LEAD SWC (I will abbreviate to MBC L-SWC) (THANK YOU Dudedog!!)
OREGON TRAIL 158gr LEAD SWC (I will abbreviate to O-T L-SWC) (THANK YOU edleit!!)
So, here are my results:
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-001D, X-TREME 158gr PLATED SWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.5gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, COL= Lite Roll Crimp @ Cannalure
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-001E, X-TREME 158gr PLATED SWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.5gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, COL= Taper Crimp SLIGHTLY above Cannalure
![001-16-04-001post_zps2c3ublkn.gif 001-16-04-001post_zps2c3ublkn.gif](https://www.thehighroad.org/data/attachments/687/687580-76f9d58b976393b6f51a800cdd6085cc.jpg)
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-002C, BERRYS 148gr PLATED HBWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.4gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, COL= Lite Roll Crimp with bullet 0.125" above case mouth
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-002E, BERRYS 148gr PLATED HBWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.4gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, COL= Taper Crimp with bullet 0.125" above case mouth
![002-16-04-002post_zpswbcwrkzc.gif 002-16-04-002post_zpswbcwrkzc.gif](https://www.thehighroad.org/data/attachments/687/687581-76f9d58b976393b6f51a800cdd6085cc.jpg)
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-003D, BERRYS 148gr PLATED DEWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.6gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, COL= Lite Roll Crimp with bullet 0.125" above case mouth
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-003E, BERRYS 148gr PLATED DEWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.6gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, COL= Taper Crimp with bullet 0.125" above case mouth
![003-16-04-003post_zpso3xennio.gif 003-16-04-003post_zpso3xennio.gif](https://www.thehighroad.org/data/attachments/687/687582-76f9d58b976393b6f51a800cdd6085cc.jpg)
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-004D, FRONTIER 125gr PLATED FLAT POINT, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.7gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, COL= 1.240", Lite Roll Crimp
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-004E, FRONTIER 125gr PLATED FLAT POINT, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.7gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, COL= 1.240", Taper Crimp
![004-16-04-004post_zpspmlgja1f.gif 004-16-04-004post_zpspmlgja1f.gif](https://www.thehighroad.org/data/attachments/687/687583-76f9d58b976393b6f51a800cdd6085cc.jpg)
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-005C, MBC 148gr COATED DEWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.4gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Lite Roll Crimp @ Crimp Groove
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-005E, MBC 148gr COATED DEWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.4gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Taper Crimp SLIGHTLY above Crimp Groove
![005-16-04-005post_zps1bf3odb8.gif 005-16-04-005post_zps1bf3odb8.gif](https://www.thehighroad.org/data/attachments/687/687584-76f9d58b976393b6f51a800cdd6085cc.jpg)
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-006D, MBC 158gr COATED SWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.7gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Lite Roll Crimp @ Crimp Groove
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-006E, MBC 158gr COATED SWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.7gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Taper Crimp SLIGHTLY above Crimp Groove
![006-16-04-006post_zps5099vthr.gif 006-16-04-006post_zps5099vthr.gif](https://www.thehighroad.org/data/attachments/687/687585-76f9d58b976393b6f51a800cdd6085cc.jpg)
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-007C, MBC 140gr COATED ZINGER, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.6gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Lite Roll Crimp @ Crimp Groove
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-007E, MBC 140gr COATED ZINGER, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.6gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Taper Crimp SLIGHTLY above Crimp Groove
![007-16-04-007post_zpsdvpijyvz.gif 007-16-04-007post_zpsdvpijyvz.gif](https://www.thehighroad.org/data/attachments/687/687586-76f9d58b976393b6f51a800cdd6085cc.jpg)
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-008C, MBC 158gr LEAD SWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.3gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Lite Roll Crimp @ Crimp Groove
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-008E, MBC 158gr LEAD SWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.3gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Taper Crimp SLIGHTLY above Crimp Groove
View attachment 745520
(LEFT)Load# 16-04-009C, ORIGON TRAIL 158gr LEAD SWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.3gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Lite Roll Crimp @ Crimp Groove
(RIGHT)Load# 16-04-009E, ORIGON TRAIL 158gr LEAD SWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.3gr, WSP Primers, Federal Brass, Taper Crimp SLIGHTLY above Crimp Groove
View attachment 745521
A big THANK YOU to the THR members Dudedog, ljnowell and vaalpens for suppling data or bullets for this test
Hope you enjoy this thread as much as I enjoy putting it together!
As you can see, I need to develop some of these loads more while a few show VERY good accuracy.
I feel the MBC 148gr COATED DEWC, BULLSEYE POWDER @ 3.4gr, WSP Primers load would perform better at 2.9gr to 3.1gr BULLSEYE.
The MBC 158gr LEAD SWC and OREGON TRAIL LASER CAST 158gr LEAD SWC showed no leading at 3.3gr BULLSEYE in my revolver.
As always, all comments are greatly appreciated
JD