6 vs 8 shots, Mossberg HD

It was worth taking into consideration, for me.

I also took into consideration that besides the extra weight and length, there seems to be less barrel options for the 8 shot. I wanted the extra barrel options available.


Others will consider it a straight upgrade (as you said) and not care about barrel options.

If you want the gun to double as a hunting gun, go 5+1. Far more barrels are available for that configuration. Personally, my HD gun is dedicated exclusively to HD, so I picked a 7+1. The two extra shells alone are a quarter of a pound, all of it out by the muzzle, but IMO the additional two shots are worth it, especially since I store it "cruiser ready", i.e. mag full, chamber empty. The barrel is only 1 1/2 inches longer and I can easily live with that.

oh, be real naughty and consider the ghost ring sight and maybe a heat shield!!



I have a 5+1 now as primary home defense. I'll likely get a 7+1 if I get another.

The Exile said:

In general on a Mossberg 500 is 2 extra shots a straight upgrade or is the extra length and weight worth taking into consideration?

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I don't think it matters either way though mossberg might think other wise. There is a thread on 'fighting shotguns' here on THR you might want to read before You decide if it's an upgrade. This is a Highly recommended must read thread. Took me about 2 days to get through but it's time well spent.

If you need more than 5 in the tube, I feel like you would be better off with a sidearm and a bayonet. Shotguns are pretty unwieldy with an 18.5 and 5 round tube.

natman said:

If you want the gun to double as a hunting gun, go 5+1. Far more barrels are available for that configuration. Personally, my HD gun is dedicated exclusively to HD, so I picked a 7+1. The two extra shells alone are a quarter of a pound, all of it out by the muzzle, but IMO the additional two shots are worth it, especially since I store it "cruiser ready", i.e. mag full, chamber empty. The barrel is only 1 1/2 inches longer and I can easily live with that.

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Good advice here. I wanted to use mine for hunting as well and made the opposite choice as natman, but I think they're equally valid choices depending on what you plan to do.

Personal preference.

I own a 2 shot extension for my 870 making it 6+1. I took it off and much prefer leaving the gun as 4+1. Fully loaded the extra weight and unwieldy balance were more of a negative than the extra 2 rounds were worth to me. But obviously not for everyone.

The Exile

I have had the extended mag tube on a Remington 870 and didn't care for the added weight out front of the shotgun. I like the feel, balance, and handling of a 18.5" barrel and a 5 shot mag tube in a home defense setting.

I think I agree, the 7+1 just isn't the best with the weight, length, and balance difference. Buying the 5+1 learning to load it and keep it topped off will do you just as good.

The Exile said:

In general on a Mossberg 500 is 2 extra shots a straight upgrade or is the extra length and weight worth taking into consideration?

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I think that that's something only YOU can decide. I have a 590a1 high cap 18.5" that I absolutely love, it's been used for pigeons, clays, rabbits, hd, yard varmints, clearing out multiple raccoons in abandoned barns (8 rounds almost wasn't enough) and never had any problems with it. I wouldn't take it as a primary field gun for upland birds, but that's not my game anyway. Flashlight mounts are not common but not unheard of, and the bayonet lung is just for show as the bayonets come off of their own volition with heavy buck or slug loads. I'm not a little guy in height nor weight and move with that baby just fine, however, it is definitely more bulky than many people prefer if they absolutely cannot justify the extra ammo. Pistol carbines excel in the same HD areas my shotgun does, but I prefer the versatility of my 12 GA so traded off my carbine a few weeks ago and still run that slide often enough not to miss it. I think if you can maybe borrow a high cap shotgun to try for a couple of days, you could decide for yourself better than our mixed feedback.

I personally don't like too much extra weight up front.

Its also worth considering that in every 12 gauge shotgun chronograph test I've seen, 20" barrels, as on the 8 shot Mossbergs, seem to experience a substantial inexplicable velocity loss for some reason.

Hard to beat a standard riot configured (simple 18-20" barrel, bead sight, four in the tube , one in the chamber, 12ga.). That's what I carried and used on the street for close quarters work for many years... It's quick pointing, maneuverable, and with ordinary 2 3/4" 00buck rounds is an absolute fight ender (and you won't need more than one round per target if you reasonably accurate at ranges under 15 meters, period).

I had the 20" 7+1 and hated the extra 1.5" on the barrel. I now have an 18.5" 590 with a 4.25" tube extension and fit 7+1 with the mag tube flush with the barrel. Best of both worlds.

I agree with those that say the full 8 shot mag is best as a dedicated home defense gun while the 5 shot is best for a multi purpose shotgun. For most of my life my Winchester model 12 with modified choke in a 28" barrel served as home defense as well as hunting shotgun. Just take out the plug for 6 rounds in the magazine tube of buckshot. When I bought a Mossberg for home defense I got the security shotgun with 8 round mag tube. Have other shotguns for hunting and shooting clay games.

Considering the terminal effects of a good SG load, the likely HD threat profile (probably won't need more than a few shots) and how unwieldy an 18.5" can be, I'd stick with whatever capacity you get with the 18.5" model, not go 20" for 2 more shells, IMHO.

Youngster said:

Its also worth considering that in every 12 gauge shotgun chronograph test I've seen, 20" barrels, as on the 8 shot Mossbergs, seem to experience a substantial inexplicable velocity loss for some reason.

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Citations, please.

natman said:

Citations, please.

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My laptop recent died, and I lost most of my saved links, but here's what I could find with a quick dig;

http://www.smallarmsreview.com/display.article.cfm?idarticles=111

"...Shotguns are pretty unwieldy with an 18.5 and 5 round tube..." Practice grasshopper. 20" and 7 is quite handy in an 870. So was the 20", 8 rounder that took an M16 bayonet Mossberg made years ago.
Just putting on a rifle sighted, smooth, slug increased the weight considerably.
However, it depends on where you are and what you're doing. You cannot hunt migratory birds with any shotgun that holds more than 3 in the gun anywhere in North America. Up here, at least, you can't hunt anything without the mag tube plug. (Arbitrary decision by our MNR. S'ok they think a shotgun with a rifled barrel is still a shotgun and they answer e-mails quickly.) There may be other jurisdictions that have the same rule.
"...substantial inexplicable velocity loss..." Isn't about the brand or barrel length. Barrel length isn't even listed on shotgun ballistics tables.

Youngster said:

My laptop recent died, and I lost most of my saved links, but here's what I could find with a quick dig;

http://www.smallarmsreview.com/display.article.cfm?idarticles=111

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I can't explain why the velocity for the 20 inch barrel was so much less. Neither can you nor can the original testers.

I do note that the velocities were taken using slugs and that at one point the barrel was cut with a pipe cutter rather than with the clean cut of a band saw. From the cited article:

A Brief Side Experiment

The shotgun barrel was marked only "choke," and the initial bore measurement we took was .695. After the first chop, and all the way to the last, the inside diameter remained exactly .725. The only time there was a fluctuation in the inside diameter of the barrel was when we tried a little experiment and created a "deformity" intentionally. At one point in between the regular cuts, we used a pipe cutter to shorten the barrel to see if our displacing some of the material (as opposed to the clean cut using the chop saw) could create a field improvised "choke" and have an effect on the pattern while testing the buckshot

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Perhaps the 20" results were accidentally made using the barrel immediately after the pipe cut. Shooting a slug through a barrel with an inward lip at the muzzle would certainly reduce velocity and once a clean cut was made for 19" the problem would go away.

Obviously, I don't know for sure that's what happened, but it does explain the observed results. At any rate, one aberration does not make a trend. I certainly wouldn't base a decision about 20" barrels based on such flimsy evidence.

natman said:

I can't explain why the velocity for the 20 inch barrel was so much less. Neither can you nor can the original testers.

I do note that the velocities were taken using slugs and that at one point the barrel was cut with a pipe cutter rather than with the clean cut of a band saw. From the cited article:



Perhaps the 20" results were accidentally made using the barrel immediately after the pipe cut. Shooting a slug through a barrel with an inward lip at the muzzle would certainly reduce velocity and once a clean cut was made for 19" the problem would go away.

Obviously, I don't know for sure that's what happened, but it does explain the observed results. At any rate, one aberration does not make a trend. I certainly wouldn't base a decision about 20" barrels based on such flimsy evidence.

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I keep seeing surprisingly low velocities at 20" over and over though, here's another example, though not so extreme.

http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?/topic/19103-barrel-length-vs-velocity/

Youngster said:

I keep seeing surprisingly low velocities at 20" over and over though, here's another example, though not so extreme.

http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?/topic/19103-barrel-length-vs-velocity/

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In one case the difference between 20 and the next shortest barrel is 6 fps. That's 0.6%, well within experimental error.
In the other it's a whopping 22 fps.

Unless and until someone can come up with a rational explanation why velocity should dip at 20 inches - which nobody, myself included, has - I don't think it's true across the board and certainly not worth worrying about.

natman said:

In one case the difference between 20 and the next shortest barrel is 6 fps. That's 0.6%, well within experimental error.
In the other it's a whopping 22 fps.

Unless and until someone can come up with a rational explanation why velocity should dip at 20 inches - which nobody, myself included, has - I don't think it's true across the board and certainly not worth worrying about.

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The Saiga's rather voluminous gas system could be effecting results compared to more typical platform?

Anyway, until somebody really puts some research into it, its all conjecture, but I've seen enough of a trend to be leery of that barrel length. We could be waiting a while however considering that there isn't a whole lot of shotgun chronograph info out there period, particularly with buckshot.

I've got the 20" 590a1. Ghost rings. The added weight does help me with the slugs and mag buck I shoot out of it. I like it and don't find it too heavy for me. It's solid. However if it's for in home defense, a 18 1/2" with beed sight and #4 buck makes sense. I use a handgun for home defense. The shotgun is for shtf.