Self defense rifle concepts

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As you stated... Maybe not in this "society" (as in to walk around with every day) but when you feel threatened, yes, the rifle is the better (as in more effective at stopping the threat) defensive tool.

I understand all of what you said, but this is the important part in my eyes. Daily life for most of us is not in the military, no is it in a combat zone. If either were true, I wouldn't have made that statement.

But in normal every day life in the US, I think other firearms are more appropriate to self defense than a rifle. We can certainly come up with some scenarios, and some of those may be the same reasons I've started carrying rifles when I wander off into national forest and wilderness. But I'm keenly aware than in my everyday life, I won't have access to a rifle in a SD situation. To retrieve one and return could be considered less than "defensive".

Just my two cents of course.
 
There is no way in hell I, or any sane person would want a frangible round as a 1st choice in a defensive round... Why would you do that? These rounds are designed NOT to penetrate. A bullet has to penetrate to reach the vitals and stop the threat.

Perhaps you are thinking of a different kind of frangible than I am. You may find the ballistic gel results in this video eye-opening (the ballistic gel test is around 7 minutes in):

 
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I understand all of what you said, but this is the important part in my eyes. Daily life for most of us is not in the military, no is it in a combat zone. If either were true, I wouldn't have made that statement.

But in normal every day life in the US, I think other firearms are more appropriate to self defense than a rifle. We can certainly come up with some scenarios, and some of those may be the same reasons I've started carrying rifles when I wander off into national forest and wilderness. But I'm keenly aware than in my everyday life, I won't have access to a rifle in a SD situation. To retrieve one and return could be considered less than "defensive".

Just my two cents of course.
Unless you live in Seattle or Portland. :)
 
Of the many rifles I have, three seem to me to be the most logical candidates for self-defense use (powerful enough, reliable, durable, relatively compact, "adequately" accurate and having an "adequate" magazine capacity): a Winchester Model 94 carbine, chambered in .30-30; a Ruger Mini-14 carbine, chambered in .223/5.56 and a Rock River AR-15 rifle, also chambered in .223/5.56. Of the three, I'd pick the Mini-14.
 
The M14, and similar, was a short lived failed experiment.

Disagree with both short lived and failed. It was an improvement of the service rifle in general issue at the time, the M1. The short comings of the M1 were well known, the M14 did a decent job of addressing them.

Not that the rifles and 308/7.62X51 cartridge are bad, it's just that the whole concept didn't meet the requirements the worlds militaries needed. At least not as a general purpose rifle to be issues to every soldier. For limited specific purposes they fill a role.

The M14, FAL/G1, and CETME/G3, AR10 rifles were all adopted at a time when the type of wars being fought were changing. It is not that they were failures, it was the mission changed requiring a different tool. Battle rifles were put in storage, assault rifles became general issue to the dismay of many in the chain of command. It has been found that in some current areas of operation that the range of Assault Rifles, in deserts of the middle east and mountainous areas of SWA in particular, limited the effectiveness of the troops operating there. Battle rifles have been removed from storage, refurbished, and put back into service in those areas.

The M16/M4/AR15 family of rifles and the 5.56 cartridge aren't perfect, but for 90% of military, LE, and personal defense needs work just fine.

I can agree with that statement. The biggest shortcoming being barrier penetration. With the right ammunition in the 5.56 you can get through a automobile windshield to the occupants. A 308 doesn't even have to breath hard to accomplish that task. The mission dictates the needed tools.
 
The AR sure has a lot going for it, in nearly any role.
But I’m a weirdo and keep the 30 carbine closer to hand than my AR.

now if “they” are firing from behind a tree, the FAL is what I’m grabbing (or the garand)
 
I love my 45/70 but it would fall far down on the list for sd/home defense in an urban setting. Lots of good hunting guns will work but recoil matters and a lever in 45 colt would be waaaaay better
Except for the fact that almost every caliber is out of stock or doubled or tripled in price including .45 Colt and other calibers you would think were more immune to panic buying. Since this is about rifles I mentioned 30-30 as available mostly at local stores or online you can probably find a new 30-30 or nice used for $500 or less. But for true home defense a shotgun or handgun beats a rifle. We all see the news reports of mass groups of agitators marching and destroying, sometimes dragging people out of cars and beating them. Is it likely to happen to you or me?, no especially as long as we don't go looking for trouble. But right now a "truck rifle" might not be a bad idea.

Most of us already have a good gun and ammo on hand, but for the sake of those looking now for one, well either pay a lot for ammo and a gun or pick something like a lever or pump that may be easier to find for now. Even 44-40 is limited in availability right now, but a 16" or 20" 30-30 is not too hard to find.

For me though I'd direct someone toward a double barrel or pump 12 gauge before a rifle for the home. Walmart , Rural King and other stores have plenty of shotgun shells. Only shotgun hard to find or is high priced are riot short barrel high capacity shotguns like Mossberg 590 and such....see them on gunbroker being bid at over $1000 lol!
 
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Give me the lighter rifle I can carry more ammo one and two I want an optic
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As earlier stated, a 30-30 or 45 Colt levergun would work quite well. 30-30 having maybe more pieer than needed, but also cheap to feed. And,.not that I care that my neighbors think, but a lever gun would not draw as much attention from nosey neighbors, especially in an urban setting. I would grab either my Rossi92 in 45 Colt or my M1 carbine, which would also make a great defensive rifle. Inside the house, my 1st choice would be a handgun or shotgun over any kind of rifle. And I do own both AR and AK.
 
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Hey
How come big strong tough guy’s need to carry an Arsenal but the little old lady ain’t scared of nothing?
My wife as an example says- I’m not worried about it, just don’t be there.
J
 
I'm not expecting anyone to go about their lives packing a long gun on a sling across their back.

Well, at least not yet... but I still think they are the better defensive choice. In this role, I'm talking about when one is available. Home defense, or having one in your vehicle when traveling.

If you're at Kroger, and some idiot comes in to rob the place, or is a mass shooter... you're not gonna have anything but your carry gun. You go with what you have.

However, if you're in bed at 2am, and a couple of miscreants, break into your home... you'd be much better served reaching for that AR leaning up beside the nightstand, than the handgun laying on it. .
 
However, if you're in bed at 2am, and a couple of miscreants, break into your home... you'd be much better served reaching for that AR leaning up beside the nightstand, than the handgun laying on it. .

Possibly true, but depending on a number of factors. If you need to leave your bedroom to gather family members and bring them to your location, you may need a hand free. Using a weapons light on an unidentified individual if you do have other "friendlies" in your home is not a great idea. So you may want that extra hand for a separate flashlight. You may also need a free hand to call 911. This can be done on speaker phone or a Bluetooth headset (if readily accessible), but the extra hand is nice to have for all these things. So a pistol may make more sense to some people.

I'm not discounting the possibility that a rifle can be used defensively. But in a vehicle for example, most would find a pistol easier to shoot effectively whilst still inside. And the vehicle is, in most cases, more likely to be the best way to get yourself safely out of there. I can certainly imagine cases where a rifle might be the best option. But in most cases, I don't think it would be.

My solution is simple. I have a .357 mag lever action. If I want to travel with a "just-in-case" rifle, that will probably just sit in the vehicle, that's the one. For home, I have a shotgun with a weapon mounted light to use as a barricade gun. Otherwise, for EDC defensive use, it's pistols for me.

If you think an AR is the best solution for you, go with it. I think particular circumstances, lifestyle, habits, home layout, etc. have much more to do with what an individual chooses.
 
If I'm inside my house I'd rather have a shotgun over anything. For a rifle though I think I would take an AR15 300 blackout SBR with a 8-10 inch barrel over anything else. I think that would be superb inside a building and still offer well over 100 yard effective range for other situations. I better put one together.
 
Yo’ that’s what y’all need right there:D
Add a Bayonet a can opener and a phase plasma attachment to that Zombie Gun.......
That’s not a Zombie Gun, that’s my Home Defense Gun a 7.5” 300blk AR with a Streamlight for low light target identification and a red dot for quick target Acquisition without the worry of sight alignment topped with a 30 rounds mag.
 
The best self defense rifle is a 12 gauge shotgun loaded with 9 pellet 00 buckshot.:evil:
 
Possibly true, but depending on a number of factors. If you need to leave your bedroom to gather family members and bring them to your location, you may need a hand free.

This is what a sling is for. Also training. An AR can easily be fired one handed. Keep in mind just because you're gathering family doesn't mean you have to carry them... (unless they are infants, or very small children) so, pre planing with your family what to do in an emergency. Of course if you're a single parent, and don't have back up... yeah, maybe a hand gun is the way to go.

Using a weapons light on an unidentified individual if you do have other "friendlies" in your home is not a great idea. So you may want that extra hand for a separate flashlight.

This would be the incorrect use of the weapon light. See above where I mentioned training. First off, a weapon light (hand gun or long gun) never negates the need for a hand held light. You need both. Always. Secondly, the spill of a weapon light when shined at a floor surface (low ready) should be sufficient to illuminate any room you enter, and identify friend or foe. You need not orient the weapon at any friendly when not needed. If you see that it is indeed a threat, you're there at the low ready. You can engage in a hot second.

In fact, that's the main reason for the light, to avoid the targeting of the wrong persons. The silhouette of a bad guy can easily be engaged in the dark in most cases. However, you need the light to ensure that it is, in fact, a bad guy, and not your son coming home from college for the weekend at 2am unannounced...



You may also need a free hand to call 911. This can be done on speaker phone or a Bluetooth headset (if readily accessible), but the extra hand is nice to have for all these things. So a pistol may make more sense to some people.

Yes, by all means call for back up... However, if you're going to do this, do it before you take off to clear the house. Hand gun or long gun matters not here. You call, put it on speaker, (or ear phones) and pick up your weapon. No hands needed. Better yet, if you have a spouse, they call while you arm yourself and gather the kids. She informs them of what you are doing so they are aware. Once you know they're on scene, you drop your piece.
 
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This is what a sling is for. Also training. An AR can easily be fired one handed. Keep in mind just because you're gathering family doesn't mean you have to carry them... (unless they are infants, or very small children) so, pre planing with your family what to do in an emergency. Of course if you're a single parent, and don't have back up... yeah, maybe a hand gun is the way to go.



This would be the incorrect use of the weapon light. See above where I mentioned training. First off, a weapon light (hand gun or long gun) never negates the need for a hand held light. You need both. Always. Secondly, the spill of a weapon light when shined at a floor surface (low ready) should be sufficient to illuminate any room you enter, and identify friend or foe. You need not orient the weapon at any friendly when not needed. If you see that it is indeed a threat, you're there at the low ready. You can engage in a hot second.

In fact, that's the main reason for the light, to avoid the targeting of the wrong persons. The silhouette of a bad guy can easily be engaged in the dark in most cases. However, you need the light to ensure that it is, in fact, a bad guy, and not your son coming home from college for the weekend at 2am unannounced...





Yes, by all means call for back up... However, if you're going to do this, do it before you take off to clear the house. Hand gun or long gun matters not here. You call, put it on speaker, (or ear phones) and pick up your weapon. No hands needed. Better yet, if you have a spouse, they call while you arm yourself and gather the kids. She informs them of what you are doing so they are aware. Once you know they're on scene, you drop your piece.

If that's how you want to go about it, you have at it.

For myself, I'd rather use a pistol one-handed indoors than one-hand a rifle. Retaining a rifle (even with a sling) might mean a grappling match, a pistol is easier to keep in the fight IMO. I'm not about to go clear a house by myself if I don't have to. Once everything irreplaceable is in one room, it's time to barricade. And I certainly wouldn't be trying to clear my house if the police were inbound; too easy for them to mistake the guy stalking around with a gun, as the intruder.

I see where you're coming from, but for me it's the wrong approach.
 
If that's how you want to go about it, you have at it.

For myself, I'd rather use a pistol one-handed indoors than one-hand a rifle. Retaining a rifle (even with a sling) might mean a grappling match, a pistol is easier to keep in the fight IMO. I'm not about to go clear a house by myself if I don't have to. Once everything irreplaceable is in one room, it's time to barricade. And I certainly wouldn't be trying to clear my house if the police were inbound; too easy for them to mistake the guy stalking around with a gun, as the intruder.

I see where you're coming from, but for me it's the wrong approach.

This is the correct thing to do. I never advised clearing your house on your own. That was in answer to someone who stated they had to go after family members.

Sometimes, you have no choice. If you are in the master bedroom on the ground floor, and the kids upstairs, and think the villain may be somewhere in between... as a parent, you know you're gonna be going to ensure the safety of the kiddies. Otherwise, sure, you stay put, call the cops, and wait for the ******* to come through that fatal funnel of your bedroom door.

Well, most people would. My wife would say "What was that?" the dog would bark, and my dumb ass would go for a look-see.

Works sometimes too. Happened to us. I actually chased away a couple potential invaders coming in out basement window several years back. What kind of idiot burglars come in the basement window? Saw a pair of legs going back out. By the time I got back upstairs, just heard leaves crunching as they ran through the back 40... because I got complacent... didn't grab the SBR with the light... (my daily was a 1911) Got lucky, and didn't need it. THEN, I grabbed it, went upstairs to check on the kids. All was fine. They never got in. There was 2 offenders. Dog got a piece of one, lol, (she came back bloody) but police never did. Big excitement for a small town. Ideas of who, but no proof. Now even my daily has a light. (Glock 45 with a TLR 7)
 
The AR sure has a lot going for it, in nearly any role.
But I’m a weirdo and keep the 30 carbine closer to hand than my AR.

now if “they” are firing from behind a tree, the FAL is what I’m grabbing (or the garand)

I own three AR's, but I've really never cared for them. They're just too cumbersome and akin to handling a crucifix, and as a hunter with 40+ years of experience have little to no faith in .22 caliber projectiles for something that wants me dead. I know some AR's are chambered in larger cartridges, but they're not easily found.

Like @Ironicaintit , I've recently fallen into the M1 Carbine hole and can't seem to climb out. At a smidge over 5 lbs. unloaded, they're trim and easy to handle and carry. For purely self-defense 150 yds. and less, soft point ammunition ought to be just about right, and has given some pretty impressive results in gel tests. Good ammunition is still in stock and can be had for 40¢ per round and in some cases less. The 15 round magazines are small and one can easily fit a couple in the rear pocket of their jeans. In his memoir To Hell and Back, Audie Murphy, who took out almost 250 enemy combatants in WW2, preferred the carbine to the Garand.

That said, theses rifles have reached rockstar collector status and are quite expensive with quality wartime examples commanding about twice what a basic AR would cost to build.

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35W
 
Except for the fact that almost every caliber is out of stock or doubled or tripled in price including .45 Colt and other calibers you would think were more immune to panic buying. Since this is about rifles I mentioned 30-30 as available mostly at local stores or online you can probably find a new 30-30 or nice used for $500 or less. But for true home defense a shotgun or handgun beats a rifle. We all see the news reports of mass groups of agitators marching and destroying, sometimes dragging people out of cars and beating them. Is it likely to happen to you or me?, no especially as long as we don't go looking for trouble. But right now a "truck rifle" might not be a bad idea.

Most of us already have a good gun and ammo on hand, but for the sake of those looking now for one, well either pay a lot for ammo and a gun or pick something like a lever or pump that may be easier to find for now. Even 44-40 is limited in availability right now, but a 16" or 20" 30-30 is not too hard to find.

For me though I'd direct someone toward a double barrel or pump 12 gauge before a rifle for the home. Walmart , Rural King and other stores have plenty of shotgun shells. Only shotgun hard to find or is high priced are riot short barrel high capacity shotguns like Mossberg 590 and such....see them on gunbroker being bid at over $1000 lol!
Lets face it, if your waiting to stock up now, you have missed the boat! 30rds in a compact rifle!
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