32-20 Aussie Martini Cadet Rifle

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R.W.Dale

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Gunshow score. Originally 310 but this one was rechambered to 32-20 otherwise all original. I have been looking for the right shooter grade martini for a decade now. I think this will not be my last. What a svelt great handling rifle even more so than a rolling block.

Some Aussie Sargent must have been an absolute hard ass for rifle cleaning. The bore on this thing is absolutely mint. It’s bright and sharp with no visible pitting anywhere. The rifling at the muzzle is also crisp and uniform.

My plan is to shoot some cowboy action silhouette matches. I’ll probably start the loading saga with some heeled 310 cadet bullets from Matt’s Bullets if I can find some 32-20 brass.
7B4E41B0-A1EE-4231-965C-45E8BE3871A6.jpeg 15B879E3-51D8-45DF-BB86-4966992739E9.jpeg 34D507CC-9115-4EBB-BC8E-7249FCB8CC9E.jpeg 33DBFA7E-A6B6-4C83-9165-17B1E5594FB0.jpeg 77E5F74A-701B-4A65-B579-15591D579715.jpeg 732A2A70-2F9A-45A8-8358-5A6D139375D3.jpeg 917A5C14-04F7-45C5-9D50-9203829E6776.jpeg
 
Why heeled bullets? The 32 WCF is set up for inside lubed bullets. Are the heeled bullets needed because if bore size?

Thank you.

Kevin
 
StrawHat said:
Why heeled bullets? The 32 WCF is set up for inside lubed bullets. Are the heeled bullets needed because if bore size?

Thank you.

Kevin
Click to expand...


Yeah. I haven’t done a chamber cast yet but these are supposed to run .318 to .320 ish and you will still need the heeled bullet. Really the 32-20 conversion just gets you more available brass

Not that I can find any
 
R.W.Dale said:
Yeah. I haven’t done a chamber cast yet but these are supposed to run .318 to .320 ish and you will still need the heeled bullet. Really the 32-20 conversion just gets you more available brass

Not that I can find any
Click to expand...

Thank you for that information. I wondered if that were the case, 32 WCF being more available than 310. Good luck on your search for a good load.

Kevin
 
R.W.Dale said:
Yeah. I haven’t done a chamber cast yet but these are supposed to run .318 to .320 ish and you will still need the heeled bullet. Really the 32-20 conversion just gets you more available brass

Not that I can find any
Click to expand...


I bet a soft hollow base bullet (maybe even a wadcutter) would obturate to the lands and grooves and shoot great out of this. What a neat gun!
 
I've used Hornady's .312 hollow base wadcutter with good results in a 310 Martini. Sadly, Hornady does not currently list this bullet on their website.
 
MEHavey said:
Forget the chamber cast.
Have you been able to just slug the barrel?

(Also...)
Take a look at https://castboolits.gunloads.com/sh...rifle-in-32-20-groove-chamber-incompatibility
Click to expand...


This is a topic for another thread but a chamber casting in my experience is more useful than slugging.

slugging just tells you the tightest part of the bore. This is irrelevant if your bullet is a mismatch for the throat it’s never going to shoot good anyway.

the first inch and last inch of rifling are the most important
 
natman said:
I've used Hornady's .312 hollow base wadcutter with good results in a 310 Martini. Sadly, Hornady does not currently list this bullet on their website.
Click to expand...
Speers are not available either....
 
R.W.Dale said:
if I can find some 32-20 brass.
Click to expand...
You just found some! I have 100 Starline new unprimed cases that You can have. Call it a favor from one shooter to another. Shoot me a PM with your address and I'll shoot you the brass. Don't worry about postage either. Call it an early Christmas present.
 

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I had a baby Martini years ago and it chambered and fired 32-20s just fine. The accuracy was quite good, golf ball sized groups at 50 yards. Forget fancy heeled bullets and don't worry about the differences in bore sizes. You gun will do quite well with the 32-20s .312 dia. bullets. For a little fun, load it with FFFg black powder.
 
tark said:
I had a baby Martini years ago and it chambered and fired 32-20s just fine. The accuracy was quite good, golf ball sized groups at 50 yards. Forget fancy heeled bullets and don't worry about the differences in bore sizes. You gun will do quite well with the 32-20s .312 dia. bullets. For a little fun, load it with FFFg black powder.
Click to expand...

you have a pm

I can’t say enough about how fantastic your offer is

I will have to try that. I have quite a few 32 swc lee bullets that I powercoated years ago and are at .314”

I will have to at least try them.
 
Save yourself from the hassle, use a correct heeled bullet.

There are also heeled 8mm pistol bullets available (Nambu/Swiss/Sweed(?))

While the correct bullet is available to buy, I bought the RCBS mold ~$85. 32-20 brass is thinner than 310 Cadet, powder coating the bullets can help with that.

Powder coat also solves the external lube problem, Lee Alox Lube is easy, but can be a little messy.

The big challenge is getting the 32-20 cases to the correct length, getting the bullet close to the start of the rifle ing as possible AND not sticking the bullet into the chamber when extracting live ammo, because the bullet has only one seating depth. You trim the case to get the correct OAL instead of different bullet seating lengths. Every rifle, even original .310 Cadet chambered rifles are a little different.

Reloading procedure is also different, after first firing only neck sizing, with slight mouth belling, and no roll crimp, more just a neck squeeze, just enough to keep the bullet captive and iron out the mouth bell.

If you have more than one rifle keep your brass separate for each rifle.

While just making the rifle go bang is not that hard, these little rifles will really shoot well with the correct projectiles, custom length brass, and a little tuning of the reloading process.
 
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Based on your replies and similar that I have read with respect to only ever partial sizing the case I’m going to see if I can use the 32h&r dies I already have to load for this before I spring for 32-20 dies

I am thinking this may be a fantastic use of the trail boss I have on hand
 
R.W.Dale said:
Based on your replies and similar that I have read with respect to only ever partial sizing the case I’m going to see if I can use the 32h&r dies I already have to load for this before I spring for 32-20 dies

I am thinking this may be a fantastic use of the trail boss I have on hand
Click to expand...

Trail Boss worked OK but Unique works much better for me for much less $.

I have heard that 30 Cal US Carbine dies will also will work
 
R.W.Dale said:
slugging just tells you the tightest part of the bore.
Click to expand...
Slug the bore.
If the bore-slug suddenly drops free at any point short of the chamber, you know if/where a problem may lie.
If it doesn't -- or there's only minor variation, you've got a decent basis for bullet design.
If it does drop free, you still have useful info on how much the bullet might have to be oversize.


(...and slugging is a whole lot easier/faster for most of the Gentle Readers here.) ;)
 
Bwana John said:
The big challenge is getting the 32-20 cases to the correct length, getting the bullet close to the start of the rifle ing as possible AND not sticking the bullet into the chamber when extracting live ammo, because the bullet has only one seating depth. You trim the case to get the correct OAL instead of different bullet seating lengths. Every rifle, even original .310 Cadet chambered rifles are a little different.
Click to expand...
If the gun was re-chambered to 32-20 you shouldn't need to do anything to the 32-20 case. And mine shot just fine with factory 32-20 ammo Golf ball sized groups @ 50 yards. How much better do you expect to get? The OP should at least try factory ammo, or the equivalent handloads. He might be surprised. Just because the original round used heeled bullets doesn't mean that inside lubed bullets won't or can't work.

There is no reason to make this more complicated than it needs to be.
 
MEHavey said:
Slug the bore.
If the bore-slug suddenly drops free at any point short of the chamber, you know if/where a problem may lie.
If it doesn't -- or there's only minor variation, you've got a decent basis for bullet design.
If it does drop free, you still have useful info on how much the bullet might have to be oversize.


(...and slugging is a whole lot easier/faster for most of the Gentle Readers here.) ;)
Click to expand...

if the bullet drops free after the chamber you can not do anything about it. The bullet will only be as big as the leade crushes it down it will never get bigger after that.

that’s why I say don’t worry about the bore. If it’s smaller the bullet will swage down. If it’s bigger you can’t do anything for the rifle. I do chamber casts because it is more useful information and Is not as potentially destructive as pounding a metal object through the bore with another metal object (I’ve never just pushed a slug through)
 
- Clean/oiled bore
- Standard pure lead ball (as in BP) with sizing lube on it slight larger than muzzle
- Laid on top of muzzle and smacked down flush w/ wood/plastic/hard rubber hammer
- Leaves a lead ring just like seating in a Cap/Ball revolver
- 2-3" dowel or ball-seater (just like Cap/Ball rifle) to get below muzzle by that much
- Stiffly/easily pushed through bore w/ BP ramrod or even competent cleaning rod (no pounding) just like BP rifle

So easy, a cave man can do it.
:thumbup:

.
 
Good work finding one of these in such fine shape! These rifles and actions sold for a song back in the day (this ad was from 1958) and it seems few have survived intact these days in the USA.

CadetAd1958Kleins.jpg

I'm in the process of experimenting with shooting .32 HB wadcutters through a .323" bore (long story.) Right now the front runners are Lapua target wadcutters, which start out at .314" and feature a deeper hollow in the base than most competing designs. They may or may not be the right choice for you, but FWIW, here's a link when they were available from Midway:

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/101072537?pid=212052

My own Cadet Martini had a shot-out bore and punk stock, so I completely remodeled it from the action up to shoot a .357 case necked down to .308.

ShadowCaster.jpg ReamerCtgPhoto.jpg
 
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tark said:
I had a baby Martini years ago and it chambered and fired 32-20s just fine. The accuracy was quite good, golf ball sized groups at 50 yards. Forget fancy heeled bullets and don't worry about the differences in bore sizes. You gun will do quite well with the 32-20s .312 dia. bullets. For a little fun, load it with FFFg black powder.
Click to expand...
Many 310 Cadets were rechambered to 32-20 by the importer. Yours was probably one of them. The chambers are close enough that 32-20 brass will chamber, except that the 32-20 rim is thicker. To use 32-20 brass, I had to trim a bit from the FRONT edge of the rim. Then they fireformed nicely.
 
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