Cheaper to buy Factory Ammo??

Obturation said:

I only buy ammo that isn't worth my time to load. Cartridges like 45-70 & 454 casull are often unavailable and when they can be found are outrageously priced. Similar situation with 357 mag, while it is more common, there's no way I'm p

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Good point. A large part of the arguments for buying rely on two factors: cheap mass production FMJ - which is the worst possible ammo for defense, hunting, or competition - and, the relative cost differential, “for some people” to reload an equivalent quantity of the same virtually useless round using new components purchased at current retail. I submitted if all you, as a shooter, are interested in is cheap mag dump fodder, hand-loading probably isn’t for you. I think this thread proves that.

I am not picky about accuracy or needing anything exotic for my pistols so I’m happy to buy 9mm. The costs are “close enough” and my time is worth something. This also makes 9mm my go-to for range day, these days.

But reloading is extremely worth it even at today’s component prices for many other rounds. 44-40 ($50/box and hard to find, pre-Covid, haven’t even looked recently but if obtainable at all it’s probably eye-watering) 45-70 ($60/box last I saw) even .38 Special… the last 30-30 I saw was $55/20.

I’ll happily buy 9mm, 5.56, or 7.62x39, but just about everything else makes sense to reload if at all possible.

One also has the option of changing the components of the inexpensive ammo they purchase too. I pulled apart Tula Ammunition about 2 years ago and underwent a ladder test with the components and also testing other bullets. I discovered that the powder charge was off and improved the load. For the FMJ bullets I exchanged with 123gr and 150gr bullets, I had inexpensive hunting loads. With a primer and powder shortage, this is a good option. Or for SD, a possible option also.

BJung said:

One also has the option of changing the components of the inexpensive ammo they purchase too. I pulled apart Tula Ammunition about 2 years ago and underwent a ladder test with the components and also testing other bullets. I discovered that the powder charge was off and improved the load. For the FMJ bullets I exchanged with 123gr and 150gr bullets, I had inexpensive hunting loads. With a primer and powder shortage, this is a good option. Or for SD, a possible option also.

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Do you know what powder they used? Otherwise how would you know the charge was off? Just curious. (Similarly, I disassembled an Audi A8 and turned it into a VW Passat.)

WeekendReloader said:

I consider any brass I pick up as "free", or "no cost", even if it is from a fresh box of factory ammo. If I didn't reload, it would have been tossed into the recycle bucket at the range.
When I calculate my cost per round, I leave the brass out. I guess I'm really calculating a cost per trigger pull.

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When I see a case lying on the floor of the range, I see it as a quarter or dime. But it’s really more than that…it’s Gold or unobtainium during this shortage/crisis.

If it’s ahead of the firing line, it really bugs me because one range I shoot at won’t let me use the squeegee to reach out and grab it.

If a fellow shooter isn’t picking up their brass I’ll often ask them if I may have it.

If a shooting session results in the loss of 10% of my cases, it bugs me quite a bit.

At home, I’ll do most anything to “save” a case for additional use.

It pains me to read some of you guys say they trash cases merely because of the headstamp.

It’s not the money. It’s the quest. I also keep twist ties. I still have the boxes my loading equipment came in.

In other words, I’ve become a scrounging Nazi in the short two years I’ve been loading.

CQB45ACP said:

When I see a case lying on the floor of the range, I see it as a quarter or dime. But it’s really more than that…it’s Gold or unobtainium during this shortage/crisis.

If it’s ahead of the firing line, it really bugs me because one range I shoot at won’t let me use the squeegee to reach out and grab it.

If a fellow shooter isn’t picking up their brass I’ll often ask them if I may have it.

If a shooting session results in the loss of 10% of my cases, it bugs me quite a bit.

At home, I’ll do most anything to “save” a case for additional use.

It pains me to read some of you guys say they trash cases merely because of the headstamp.

It’s not the money. It’s the quest. I also keep twist ties. I still have the boxes my loading equipment came in.

In other words, I’ve become a scrounging Nazi in the short two years I’ve been loading.

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See, for me that’s why I prefer to buy cheap factory ammo and only reload stuff with a manual action. I can account for all my 38spl cases and not need to worry a minute. I can work the bolts of my rifles gently and save the brass. I have very little control over where the brass might fly with a semi-auto, and I don’t care for the angst of knowing I’m going to be crawling around on the floor of the range trying to leave with the same number (or ideally a few more) cases than I came with.

The only thing that I miss that really gets left out in the cold is …..45acp. Currently very expensive, and I don’t reload much of it because I dislike chasing the brass. If I shot exclusively on my own property I might feel differently.

Mosin77 said:

See, for me that’s why I prefer to buy cheap factory ammo and only reload stuff with a manual action. I can account for all my 38spl cases and not need to worry a minute. I can work the bolts of my rifles gently and save the brass. I have very little control over where the brass might fly with a semi-auto, and I don’t care for the angst of knowing I’m going to be crawling around on the floor of the range trying to leave with the same number (or ideally a few more) cases than I came with.

The only thing that I miss that really gets left out in the cold is …..45acp. Currently very expensive, and I don’t reload much of it because I dislike chasing the brass. If I shot exclusively on my own property I might feel differently.

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Makes sense to me. I only shoot semi-autos in 9mm & 45ACP so I’m always chasing.

IF Walmart hadn’t pulled out of the ammo selling business here in Northern Virginia back in 2019, I wouldn’t be loading at all.

When I buy a new or new to me caliber, I typically buy a box or two of brass cased ammo to shoot through it, if it is an expensive round, then going forward I reload for it using that brass until I can't anymore. If that brass gets to the point I can't reload it anymore, I buy some brass, or if more ammo is available (pre-pandemic) depending on cost I buy more ammo and do it again. The way I look at it sometimes is for example, .45 colt brass is about $32 per hundred, .45 colt ammo used to be about $70 per 100. I get to shoot the ammo, and then save the brass and reload it multiple times.

Pre-pandemic, I reloaded for anything I wanted accuracy out of, 9mm practice ammo and .223/556 for the AR was not on that list. Now I reload everything because I have components and because I can. I carry factory ammo in my SD guns, but we all (my family and I) shoot cheaper ammo or factory replica handloads (hps or plated hps with similar profiles to our carry ammo) at the range when practicing and finish up with a mag or two of actual carry ammo.

I don't shoot any handgun competition right now, so, for me, fist sized groups at 7-10 yards with my Carry guns is my goal in 9mm handgun ammo. Sometimes I can, sometimes I can't but that it typically me not the guns or ammo. When 9mm gets cheap again (if it ever does) I will probably stock up again, until then, I will reload it when needed. I shoot bulk ammo in my 223 AR, but handload for my 223 bolt action some concept. High volume vs accuracy - accuracy ammo gets reloaded, high volume if it can't be found cheap, gets reloaded.

This is just me, so, YMMV but yes, I get the OPs concept and don't disagree, if I can find cheap range ammo, I will buy some probably more just a convenience thing for me, for range ammo, but for accurate ammo, I reload it unless it is rimfire. I want to know what my 6.5 ammo is gonna do from 100 up to 1000 so I load it.

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I may be guilty of looking for some norma 223 factory ammo, so junior can blast it and I get the cases.

CQB45ACP said:

Do you know what powder they used? Otherwise how would you know the charge was off? Just curious. (Similarly, I disassembled an Audi A8 and turned it into a VW Passat.)

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I really don't know what powder they used but after conducting a ladder test, the best load was 24.5gr of this Tula powder for using their 122gr FMJ or the 123 Speers I was using. From a ladder test using R7, the accurate load was 24.5gr R7.

CQB45ACP said:

When I see a case lying on the floor of the range, I see it as a quarter or dime. But it’s really more than that…it’s Gold or unobtainium during this shortage/crisis.

If it’s ahead of the firing line, it really bugs me because one range I shoot at won’t let me use the squeegee to reach out and grab it.

If a fellow shooter isn’t picking up their brass I’ll often ask them if I may have it.

If a shooting session results in the loss of 10% of my cases, it bugs me quite a bit.

At home, I’ll do most anything to “save” a case for additional use.

It pains me to read some of you guys say they trash cases merely because of the headstamp.

It’s not the money. It’s the quest. I also keep twist ties. I still have the boxes my loading equipment came in.

In other words, I’ve become a scrounging Nazi in the short two years I’ve been loading.

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It's good to know that I'm not the only one with that disease. I shoot a lot of different calibers, and am always scanning the ground at the range. Is that a 10mm case? Large primer? And there's another one...and another! I get pretty excited when I see that someone's run a box of 10mm, or 357, or .308, etc. and left their brass on the ground. And it does drive me crazy if I lose a piece of relatively dear brass (45-70, 303, 8mm Mauser). The disorder is real.

BJung said:

I really don't know what powder they used but after conducting a ladder test, the best load was 24.5gr of this Tula powder for using their 122gr FMJ or the 123 Speers I was using. From a ladder test using R7, the accurate load was 24.5gr R7.

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I guess I wouldn’t know whether their load was already high or low on the ladder and if I should move up or down, that’s all. You worked it out.

ahutch71 said:

It's good to know that I'm not the only one with that disease. I shoot a lot of different calibers, and am always scanning the ground at the range. Is that a 10mm case? Large primer? And there's another one...and another! I get pretty excited when I see that someone's run a box of 10mm, or 357, or .308, etc. and left their brass on the ground. And it does drive me crazy if I lose a piece of relatively dear brass (45-70, 303, 8mm Mauser). The disorder is real.

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We’re not alone. Other hobbies have this issue too. Or maybe it’s just us in whatever we do—(I still have my first career job pay stub.)

I used to restore old cars after I retired. In doing so I accumulated a lot of original fasteners—I never trashed ANY of them. For my car, which was a complete original survivor, I used only original fasteners, never any reproductions. I even bought a “parts” car and disassembled it for the nuts and bolts.

When I quit all that in 2014, I sold all the fasteners and other parts on eBay.

A guy in Sweden (Matt’s Olsen is his name if you can believe that) bought two large flat rate boxes of them. He called them “treasure.”

I can’t remember how much I sold a box for, but I do know he paid more in shipping and value added tax than I charged for the parts. Here’s a pic of my shipping receipts as verification (of his name. It’s cliche, eh?).

So, did I have a problem or did he?

Bcwitt said:

Checkout a Peterson device. It made an 03 Springfield fire a 32 auto.

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Sounds almost right. I am familiar with the Petersen Device. Designed by John Petersen (not 'Peterson') the same man who designed the (original) Model 51 .32 ACP Remington pistol of long ago.
There are three serious problems with the idea.
One, the device was destroyed en masse by the Army except for a few kept for the Ordnance department (Museum, probably). According to all the literature, there are very few left and and are rather spendy collector's items. No one makes replicas devices to my knowledge. Advertised on one auction website, expecting $25 to $30 THOUSAND for the winning price.
Two, presuming one obtains a Petersen Device, it only works on M1903 Springfield rifles that have been modified to fit the device. Among possibly other things, an ejection slot in the left side of the receiver. I do not have such a rifle, and they are collector's items and cost more than a pristine M1903 Springfield and that's more than I want to spend.
Three, the Petersen Device was NOT chambered for .32 ACP. It was chambered referred to by the U. S. Army as "Cal .30 Auto, Pistol Ball Cartridges, Model of 1918". Labelling them as 'Pistol' cartridges was primarily to conceal the true of the ammunition from the enemy to my knowledge. The design and shape of the cartridge looked like a pistol round, much like the later .30 M1 Carbine round. It was not the same as the .30 M1 Carbine round, either.
The round was designed specially for this use only. According to some stories, it was later used by the French as the prototype for the French .32 long pistol round for the French pistol 1935A and a submachinegun and so on.
The ammo used to be available as surplus. I found some ads on the internet, about $30.00 plus shipping for 50 rounds.

So the idea is not cheaper than reloading for a rifle. Not a bad thought except for that.

I have a garage full of car stuff, so to purchase all the reloading equipment and parts, along with making room for the setup. Plus the labor times involved I just assume purchase the new rounds, it suits my need more than all the reloading. Just my personal situation and oppinion.

Mark_Mark said:

Cheap Primers coming soon! no more buying factory ammo!!!

WHAT EVER!

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Well they have plenty of demand for even a few new machines. It's not like there are any on a shelf.

CQB45ACP said:

I guess I wouldn’t know whether their load was already high or low on the ladder and if I should move up or down, that’s all. You worked it out.

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Sorry, I misunderstood your comment. Ten factory rounds ranged from 24.1-24.4gr. The bullets ranged from 121gr - 128gr. I took the average of 24.2gr powder and reloaded the components and the rounds didn't group well. It was after this test that I did a ladder test and came up with 25.4grs.

CQB45ACP said:

When I see a case lying on the floor of the range, I see it as a quarter or dime. But it’s really more than that…it’s Gold or unobtainium during this shortage/crisis.

If it’s ahead of the firing line, it really bugs me because one range I shoot at won’t let me use the squeegee to reach out and grab it.

If a fellow shooter isn’t picking up their brass I’ll often ask them if I may have it.

If a shooting session results in the loss of 10% of my cases, it bugs me quite a bit.

At home, I’ll do most anything to “save” a case for additional use.

It pains me to read some of you guys say they trash cases merely because of the headstamp.

It’s not the money. It’s the quest. I also keep twist ties. I still have the boxes my loading equipment came in.

In other words, I’ve become a scrounging Nazi in the short two years I’ve been loading.

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I see little shiny pieces of gold. The ground looks especially nice after the police were there practicing. When I first started collecting brass, I felt like a chicken pecking up pieces of grain. But afterwards I got my fill of brass. Now, if I'm picking up brass and meet someone doing the same, it's a rare chance to meet another reloader.

I pick up my brass, but It hits the bucket at home and when full I use it as a coupon sorta speak to lower the cost of new. The gun shop owner loves this idea.

Mark_Mark said:

What are we going tondo with the mountain of brass we have collected over the years. I would hate to see them go scrap yard

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Capitol brass will buy it all... https://www.capitalcartridge.com/sell-brass-casings-s/106.htm

This was originall where I sold my brass, but the gun shop guy said he would buy it, and selling it local is easier and faster.

BJung said:

Sorry, I misunderstood your comment. Ten factory rounds ranged from 24.1-24.4gr. The bullets ranged from 121gr - 128gr. I took the average of 24.2gr powder and reloaded the components and the rounds didn't group well. It was after this test that I did a ladder test and came up with 25.4grs.

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You are one dedicated son of a gun!