LEO's and CCW's
- Thread starter dfunde01
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I didn't know "so many" were.
Care to cite some numbers?
Care to cite some numbers?
Frog48
Member
Depends alot on the political climate of your area. In my neck of the woods, most cops dont care one way or the other.
And there are quite a few that do strongly support concealed-carry, and they usually cite the fact that CHL holders are subject to background checks and firearms proficiency testing, so the odds are high that the CHL holder is a "good guy".
And there are quite a few that do strongly support concealed-carry, and they usually cite the fact that CHL holders are subject to background checks and firearms proficiency testing, so the odds are high that the CHL holder is a "good guy".
gunseller2
Member
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Not in my neck of the woods! What part of the country to you live in dfunde01. I suppose it depends on the political bent of the chief
LEO.
LEO.
I don't think it's the mass's of LEO's that are opposed. It's more likely the stars and bars in the department who have to kiss political a$$ in order to keep their job.
The average LEO's don't get to vote on things like that, it's the higher ups who rub shoulders with the mayors, congressman, senators, etc., who sing with the Brady bunch.
All the LEO's that I know are pro CCW, provided that a background check is done, and that the individual is proficiency tested. Doing so will hopefully weed out those who should not have a CCW for various reasons, felon, mentally unstabe, etc.
Whatever process the LEO has to go through to carry a firearm is probably what they would like to see of everyone seeking a CCW. That's only my guess?
However, after Jan. 20th, 09', CCW's may become a whole different story.
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heavyshooter
Member
I am in a line of work that puts me in regular contact with LEO's. Without exception they recommend CCW. Many of them have wives that have CCW's and it was at the behest of the local officers that I sought out my own license.
On the flip side, my father in Texas was telling me that many of the officers are opposed to their "closet law." I believe it allows all felony free adults to carry in their car as long as it is in a "closet" (i.e. console or glove compartment). Many of the officers are saying that they are going to arrest anyone with a gun even if they are complying with the law. My guess is that they are unhappy with the lack of backgroung checks. This would not apply to CCW or CHL.
On the flip side, my father in Texas was telling me that many of the officers are opposed to their "closet law." I believe it allows all felony free adults to carry in their car as long as it is in a "closet" (i.e. console or glove compartment). Many of the officers are saying that they are going to arrest anyone with a gun even if they are complying with the law. My guess is that they are unhappy with the lack of backgroung checks. This would not apply to CCW or CHL.
Treo
member
Terry Maketa
Our local sherrif is one of the most pro-gun politicians I know of.
When Colorado was a may issue state he made it county policy that all CHP was shall issue.
CSPD .on the other hand, is institutionally anti armed citizen
Our local sherrif is one of the most pro-gun politicians I know of.
When Colorado was a may issue state he made it county policy that all CHP was shall issue.
CSPD .on the other hand, is institutionally anti armed citizen
Deanimator
Member
Ohio's a shall issue state. Doesn't matter what anybody thinks.
"Larry Ashcraft -I didn't know "so many" were. Care to cite some numbers? "
Please note that I did not say "the majority" or "most". I have seen and read of examples such as Richmond County GA where the sheriff was opposed and as a result his deputies have been documented harassing CCW permit holders and holding their weapons for no reasonable or legal reason. In a thread on THR concerning the Parks Service upcoming ruling on CCW's on federal land the retired rangers association (or some such group) weighed in against allowing CCW's. I have seen public statements from some LEO organizations that were negative re: CCW's. It may be that the brass is diving for political cover. In the recent legislation in Georgia to expand CCW rights a number of LEO's and related organizations, not just brass, were making statement in opposition.
I am surprised that I have seen as much opposition from LEO's, a minority I am sure, but I am curious why the LEO's that do oppose private citizen CCW's feel that way since their stated reasons are always vague and non specific.
I will add, that most of the negative attitudes I have seen seem to come from the top and bottom of the LEO food chain. For example the top brass and groups such a transit police.
Please note that I did not say "the majority" or "most". I have seen and read of examples such as Richmond County GA where the sheriff was opposed and as a result his deputies have been documented harassing CCW permit holders and holding their weapons for no reasonable or legal reason. In a thread on THR concerning the Parks Service upcoming ruling on CCW's on federal land the retired rangers association (or some such group) weighed in against allowing CCW's. I have seen public statements from some LEO organizations that were negative re: CCW's. It may be that the brass is diving for political cover. In the recent legislation in Georgia to expand CCW rights a number of LEO's and related organizations, not just brass, were making statement in opposition.
I am surprised that I have seen as much opposition from LEO's, a minority I am sure, but I am curious why the LEO's that do oppose private citizen CCW's feel that way since their stated reasons are always vague and non specific.
I will add, that most of the negative attitudes I have seen seem to come from the top and bottom of the LEO food chain. For example the top brass and groups such a transit police.
MT GUNNY
Member
I will step out on a limb and say 90% of sheriffs in rural areas are pro 2nd and pro CCP. Especially in Montana.
Johnny Guest
Moderator In Memoriam
It's not like that in my area
I retired from a full career as a peace officer at the end of 2004. Most of the agency heads and almost all individual officers I knew were okay with legal carry by private persons. My sheriff was pro-guns and hunting, and he did a lot to promote my activity as a CHL instructor. I could always arrange my schedule to attend retraining or to conduct a class. One class I taught included five members of the sheriff's family, and family members of the chief deputy and other deputies.
Also, when the Texas CHL law was new, there was a lot of discussion about the provision allowing officers to disarm licensees. It soon became SOP with Texas Department of Public Safety and MOST agencies, that licensees would NOT be disarmed so long as there were no unusual circumstances.
Typical traffic stop dialogue:
The general idea is that only persons with a clean record qualify for a CHL. There's no reason to complicate a routine traffic matter by handling a (presumably) loaded firearm. The licensee is aware the officer may disarm him if he wishes, and doesn't want to aggravate the transaction.
It works out well.
I retired from a full career as a peace officer at the end of 2004. Most of the agency heads and almost all individual officers I knew were okay with legal carry by private persons. My sheriff was pro-guns and hunting, and he did a lot to promote my activity as a CHL instructor. I could always arrange my schedule to attend retraining or to conduct a class. One class I taught included five members of the sheriff's family, and family members of the chief deputy and other deputies.
Also, when the Texas CHL law was new, there was a lot of discussion about the provision allowing officers to disarm licensees. It soon became SOP with Texas Department of Public Safety and MOST agencies, that licensees would NOT be disarmed so long as there were no unusual circumstances.
Typical traffic stop dialogue:
Officer: Good afternoon, sir. I'm Deputy Jones with Roosevelt County Sheriff's Office. May I see your operator license and proof of insurance?
Motorist: Sure. And here's my concealed handgun license, too.
Ofcr: Thank you. Are you carrying your handgun now? Where is it?
Mtrst: Yes, in a holster on my right side.
Ofcr: That's fine, sir. Please just leave it in place while we do a little paper work.
Motorist: Sure. And here's my concealed handgun license, too.
Ofcr: Thank you. Are you carrying your handgun now? Where is it?
Mtrst: Yes, in a holster on my right side.
Ofcr: That's fine, sir. Please just leave it in place while we do a little paper work.
The general idea is that only persons with a clean record qualify for a CHL. There's no reason to complicate a routine traffic matter by handling a (presumably) loaded firearm. The licensee is aware the officer may disarm him if he wishes, and doesn't want to aggravate the transaction.
It works out well.
BullfrogKen
Moderator Emeritus
So many?
Where do you live, and how many Officers do you actually know?
Where do you live, and how many Officers do you actually know?
Blacksmoke
Member
Our District Attorney is 100% for CCW. He used to give talks at the NRA CCW class in town. We had a big shoot out here in June. He came up for a community meeting and said he was all for citizens defending themselves even if it meant firing an AK down the road at badguys in a car.
Our Sheriff? He is never in the paper and is never seen by anyone. So, I have no idea what his opinion is. He is an improvement over his predecessor. That guy locked himself out of the Sheriff's office while I was with him to get fingerprints for my application. We had to wait for one of his deputies to return from his meal break to be let into the building. Then there was his predecessor who shot himself in the butt while taking a dump- he was unfamiar with how Glocks operate.
What this tells me is that their opinions do not matter much.
Our Sheriff? He is never in the paper and is never seen by anyone. So, I have no idea what his opinion is. He is an improvement over his predecessor. That guy locked himself out of the Sheriff's office while I was with him to get fingerprints for my application. We had to wait for one of his deputies to return from his meal break to be let into the building. Then there was his predecessor who shot himself in the butt while taking a dump- he was unfamiar with how Glocks operate.
What this tells me is that their opinions do not matter much.
Ragnar Danneskjold
Member
I've never met a LEO in my life who cared whatsoever about CCWs. The one's I know personally actually endorse it. And when I've been pulled over, they didn't care in the least. Methinks the OP needs to cite some sources.
Flatbedder
Member
Anti LEO troll. I meet alot of LEO everyday ....DOT inspections and the like.
They all support CCW. The are glad that individuals are taking responsibility for their own safety.
They all support CCW. The are glad that individuals are taking responsibility for their own safety.
devilc
Member
Many police chiefs are appointed by their liberal mayors and city councils.
The National Association of Chiefs of Police is a VERY progressive body that is often at odds with the FOP.
Liberals use endorsements from them to claim cops support various schemes that most cops bristle at.
Most cops, even federal ones, love guns.
The National Association of Chiefs of Police is a VERY progressive body that is often at odds with the FOP.
Liberals use endorsements from them to claim cops support various schemes that most cops bristle at.
Most cops, even federal ones, love guns.
jnyork
Member
This is not a problem at all in Wyoming.
Kind of Blued
Member
I'm up north a bit, but I appreciate you mentioning this fellow. It's nice to see a politician or two still standing strong around here these days.
My best guess on the LEO/CCW issue is that it isn't really an issue, and has nothing to do with them being Police Officers. The same LEOs that think you shouldn't be carrying would feel the same way if they worked for an insurance company. They're probably not "gun people", and if it made sense to NOT carry a gun on their job, they'd be the first one's the leave it behind.
Now, as mentioned, depending on where you live, "people" (in general) tend to have a different majority opinion about private gun ownership.
biggiesmalls
Member
here in texas a lot of leos have chls. don't know why, since they don't really need one. but i've know 4 leos who have chls. of course 1 of them was an instructor, but still... anyone care to chime in on why they would need one?
I'm an LEO and I'm all for concealed carry for law abiding citizens, especially since I live and work in a very rural area. Out here when the SHTF and seconds count the cops are only minutes away, you need to be able to hold your own for a little while until we can get there.
Blacksmoke
Member
I once spent about three hours on the side of a rural highway with a Colorado State Trooper, an older veteran of many years on the job. I had roped an elk bull calf orphan that was sick and would not get off the black-top of the highway. A neighbor lady wanted to take the elk calf home for adoption. So, we all had to wait for the local game warden so show up and spent the morning sitting on the shoulder of the highway with the calf who by this time just laid down on the grass. Anyway, the point is I was packing a side arm concealed (with NM permit). The holster had to be visible from undey my coat. The Trooper never said a word about it during the time we talked while waiting. I never thought to bring it up as it seemed irrlevent to the situation.
The point is why bring up a concealed weapon during a routine traffic stop when all I am doing is sitting behind the wheel? The tension level is about zero. I guess if I was ordered out of the car then it would be appropriate to bring it up. There is not specific guidance on this point in the NM codes.
The point is why bring up a concealed weapon during a routine traffic stop when all I am doing is sitting behind the wheel? The tension level is about zero. I guess if I was ordered out of the car then it would be appropriate to bring it up. There is not specific guidance on this point in the NM codes.
RKBABob
Member
The 2nd in command of our city police said he though that all law abiding citizens should carry a firearm. I just about fell off my chair when he said it. 
Prior to that, I had assumed that the police were largely anti-ccw.
Prior to that, I had assumed that the police were largely anti-ccw.mgkdrgn
Member
My CCW class here was taught by two former LEO's ... one local and one FBI type.
No one knows better than an LEO how quickly some thug can screw up or take your life, and how little chance the LEO has of preventing that from happening.
That being the case, it wouldn't surprise me that the LEO's that are opposed to citizens being able to protect themselves are the ones on "power ego trips" that we end seeing in the news all the time. The fewer of them we have, the better off we'll all be.
No one knows better than an LEO how quickly some thug can screw up or take your life, and how little chance the LEO has of preventing that from happening.
That being the case, it wouldn't surprise me that the LEO's that are opposed to citizens being able to protect themselves are the ones on "power ego trips" that we end seeing in the news all the time. The fewer of them we have, the better off we'll all be.
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