Semi-Auto Rifles: The "Range Toy" Lie?

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boricua9mm

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As the AR, AK, Minis, etc. continue to grow and grow in popularity, I've been seeing and talking with a lot of folks who are interested in owning them. When you get down to asking them some of the basic questions, it seems a lot of them want to skirt the truth.

They usually start off by saying "Well, it'll just be for fun" or "Just something to take to the range" or "I want to blow of steam and be able to pop off a lot of rounds down at the gravel pit" or some variation thereof.

As you continue to talk to these folks, often times the issues of self-defense, emergency use, and perhaps even hunting applications gets avoided by the curious parties. Unfortunately, it seems that this practice leads to the purchase of a bottom rung firearm, which is fine for a true blue range toy, but...

I've found that those who purchase semi-automatic magazine fed military pattern rifles usually find themselves drawn to these firearms for defense, emergencies, camping, hunting, in addition to the purely recreational reasons. As the owner begins to recognize the usefulness of these rifles it becomes an issue of "If such and such happens, I'm gettin' my AR15/AK/whatever."

I have to assume that I am not the only one who observes this phenomenon. I know that not everyone can afford higher end magazine fed rifles, but it has become a realization that one should always buy the best that they can afford due to what amounts to a considerable shift in focus for the actual use of the firearm.

What is it? Is it that the people who are getting into these types of rifles are in denial of the all-around utility? Is it that they are afraid to admit the actual intended use due to the "assault rifle" taboo? Is it that they really don't understand the envelope of use for these rifles until they get a decent amount of trigger time behind them?

I've had non-gun fanatic friends say things like "He's got assault rifles" and instead of jumping all over them to correct their terminology, I simply smile and tell them "They are the SUVs of the gun world." If they've been fortunate enough to go shooting with me before, they usually nod their heads in agreement.

Just curious as to what you guys are seeing and experiencing with regards to this topic...

???
 
Is it that they are afraid to admit the actual intended use due to the "assault rifle" taboo?
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Yes.

Much has been done to paint the gun owners of these rifles as disturbed for merely believing that they have any reason whatsoever for wanting to possess one. 'Fudds' make up an enormous percentage of gun owners, and they still ask, "Why would you want a rifle like that?". Not everyone wants to go to the trouble to explain or educate when asked. "It's just for plinking/fun/range toy", is the politically correct answer.
 
I haven't discussed it with anyone and whenever I am at the range, I am usually by myself.

I enjoy being able to have a 30 round magazine in place or a 5-round magazine if I choose! Right now, it is black bear season where I live and I take my black rifle bear hunting. So, it's black, so, with each pull of the trigger, a round fires. I'm sure there are some people who could out-shoot me using some kind of pump gun or even using a bolt action! My gun happens to match the animal I am hunting (a black gun for a black bear).

I don't understand the big deal about these guns. They have had semi-auto pistols for over a hundred years, so the rifle is semi-auto, I could have just as easily bought a Remington Semi Auto in .270 or 30-06 instead.
 
Just curious as to what you guys are seeing and experiencing with regards to this topic...
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The majority (not all) of the owners I see at the range totin' ARs are untrained, unskilled and unsafe.

That's been my experience...

Being in Kalifornistan, home of 10rd magazines and boolit buttons, I just went ahead & got an SKS & a bunch of ammo on strippers. I'll tell anyone who asks exactly what I got it for. ;)
 
Short of full on war those cheapies will be fine. Most self defense uses are going to use less than one magazine. Even full on end of the world as we know it a wise man will stay out of full on war. Personally, if I have a fixed amount of money and I'm deciding on a top of the line rifle and a DPMS and an optic I'm getting the rifle and the optic. Either way you need magazines and ammo. Magazines are worth spending for quality. Because a bad magazine may fail 5 rounds into a 25 round fight. Statistically the quality of your magazines are more important than the quality of the rifle.

So say you have $2,000 to spend on an AR, a big sum of money for most people today. I'm not spending it all on the rifle. I want a good quality red dot so $500 to $800 there, another $100 for BUIS, another $100 for 7 Magpul magazines, I can get more later, they're cheap. I'll want a thousand rounds of ammo. I need 210 to load my magazines and another 210 to test the gun and each magazine and if I have a new gun I'm going to shoot it. So you really need a thousand. Call that $300. You now have spent $1100 to $1300 of your $2,000 and have not bought a rifle. Do wonder why people scrimp on the gun?

I'm going to say that is not what I did when I bought my AR. I went 6.5 and bought from Alexander Arms.
 
I see lots of guys buy these kinds of rifles "just because". They seem to have no real game plan other than to get one because they are popular and see lots of other guys buying them. These kinds of buyers usually decorate 'em up like a Christmas tree with doo-dads, take 'em to the range a time or two and realize "just for fun" equates to throwing a quarter down range with every pull of the trigger. After a few mags and a lighter wallet, the guns often times end up either in the closet or being on the used market with the owner wanting nearly all the money he had tied up in his toy.
 
A low-end Kalashnikov or SKS "beater" is more than enough gun for Joe and Jane Average, and most forseeable emergencies. Ditto cheap ARs, Moisins, Mausers, and pistol-caliber carbines.

If it goes 'bang' reliably, and can consistantly hit a 12' circle at 150 yards, you are all set for almost anything 'social malfuction' or 'survive'.

Sure, one can do "better" with gear. However, a cheap blaster and a case of cheap ammo mostly expended in useful practice, is a "good enough" problem solver. The high-dollar rifle that you are "saving up for", or that you cannot afford to feed often enough for useful practice, is not a problem solver.
 
because they dont want to tell you that's the gun they use in COD online or want to yell wolverine (red dawn) with their AKs hehehe...

as for me, it's easy..... Z O M B I E S










joking...



i use mine for hunting/range/CCW/training/SD/HD/TEOTWAWKI... and zombies ;)
 
Burt Blade writes:
If it goes 'bang' reliably, and can consistantly hit a 12' circle at 150 yards, you are all set for almost anything 'social malfuction' or 'survive'.
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BINGO!

The high-dollar rifle that you are "saving up for", or that you cannot afford to feed often...
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...or that you're afraid to scratch or wear the finish...
 
Hitting a 12' (twelve foot) circle at 150 yards under range conditions is good enough for you guys? You looking to scare folks away or what? :D
 
Yes.

Much has been done to paint the gun owners of these rifles as disturbed for merely believing that they have any reason whatsoever for wanting to possess one. 'Fudds' make up an enormous percentage of gun owners, and they still ask, "Why would you want a rifle like that?". Not everyone wants to go to the trouble to explain or educate when asked. "It's just for plinking/fun/range toy", is the politically correct answer.
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Thanks for the thought-out reply. It seems a lot of folks see this post as a jab at cheap (not to be confused with inexpensive) rifles. You and a few others seem to understand what I'm getting at.

The irony of the sheepish responses that I've experienced at shooting ranges is that 99% of the time, the person trying to help guide them (often times myself) is shooting a semi-automatic military pattern rifle. Nonetheless, they stick to their explanation of "range toy" and ultimately wind up with a questionable rifle as their "go-to" weapon when in fact they may already own better choices or can assuredly have been able to pony up for something more suitable to the task.

It's akin to asking someone for handgun recommendations, hiding the fact that you intend to carry it concealed. If you don't put forth the right information up front then you're going to get all the wrong answers.
 
Most of my guns are range toys. Nearly all my black rifles are. I hunt but not with them. I don't ever expect a TEOTWAWKI of SHTF situation. I am not going to go out and save the world by clearing my neighborhood of zombies. I am not in denial, I am not an armchair commando. I just like modern weapons. I just like to shoot cool guns. What's wrong with that?
 
Most of my guns are range toys. Nearly all my black rifles are. I hunt but not with them. I don't ever expect a TEOTWAWKI of SHTF situation. I am not going to go out and save the world by clearing my neighborhood of zombies. I am not in denial, I am not an armchair commando. I just like modern weapons. I just like to shoot cool guns. What's wrong with that?
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Absolutely nothing. Anything that will shoot, even if intermittently, will work for an actual range toy. Personally, I've lived through 5 hurricanes and for two of them I've been without power for over a week. Such an "emergency" makes for some special considerations relevant to that topic, but what of the cheap range toy that becomes called upon in such a time? At that point, was the cheapest possible range toy the best way to spend the money, provided one had the means to do better?
 
People always want the next fastest car, next tacticooler AR or next higher paying job. I think that has much more to do with it than realizing ARs are so useful.
 
I have a WASR, and a Doublestar AR....neither are the "high end" of things, but both do everything I'd ever ask of them. I've yet to have a malfunction, both are reasonable accurate (the AR quite so) and well...I bought them because I wanted them. I grew up on GI Joe and action movies, and I dreamed of owning such guns since a child. I won't, nor should I have to, apologize for buying something just because I desired it. I don't foresee them being used for much more than plinking and likely some hunting (for the AR at least), but yet...if need be...I think they would be adaquet for "other" uses if it came down to that. However, I didn't see the need, nor did I have the desire, to spend 2-3x what i spent on each one to have one that "other" people consider top of the line. Mine guns do what I want them to...and I'm happy with that level of performance
 
The gun ban forces always want to paint semi-auto rifles as "machine guns", "assault weapons with no legitimate sporting purpose", and "made for no reason other than killing people." People who want one, for whatever reason, feel compelled to come up with an acceptable politically correct reason for owning one.
 
I had wanted a Winchester since I was a kid. A few years ago a finally got one...a new one, with the cross-bolt, through receiver safety:barf:...but is was a real Winchester 94 30-30.

Well the thing is, that thing was designed to hunt. It's light, the butt stock is narrow, and it has lightweight wooden furniture. BOOM...what a cannon! It was a hoot to shoot. But, being designe to hunt means it was not designed to take to the range and shoot. After 20 rounds or so the thing was too hot to touch and there's a lot of exposed metal. I had bruises on my shoulder. And the jamming those rounds through the loading gate tore up my finger everytime.

Compare that to an AR-15. An AR-15 was designed to fight. It was designed to put round after round after round down-range...all day long, day in, day out. To be able to do that it has to be manageable (not cause a lot of fatigue), it has to shield the hot parts from the hand, and be easy to reload.

So while many love the Winchester 94 for what it represents, it is way less enjoyable to shoot all day at the range than an AR-15. In my mind, the AR-15 is to early 21st century America what the Winchester was to late 19th century America...the quintessential American firearm that everyone should aspire to own.
 
There's a whole generation of young guys who just want the coolest cht. and AR's and AK's are the coolest cht. Thats the way I see it. If the older generation is feeling shame because of past prejudice so be it. The younger generation don't care much about wood and walnut, other than checkering does feel pretty good as does smooth wood on your face. I think the younger generation likes cool wood stocks on M14's and M1's though.
 
I just purchased an AR-15, more specifically a Colt SP6940. For years I resisted AR's. Not that I was against owning semi-auto military style rifles, but because I saw them as generic. Everybody had one, and they were the stuff of mall ninja wet dreams. I'm not much of a rifle fan to begin with, due to my cross dominance.

But after really looking into the platform, I realized just how versatile the AR-15 can be. The high capacity magazines and great ergonomics, and economic centerfire cartridge make range sessions really fun. I can also slap a 6.8 upper on the rifle, easily mount a scope on the full length top rail, and have a great hunting rifle if I so choose. One day I might register it as an SBR and get a nice short barrel upper for it to play around with. I'm expecting to get many years worth of use from this gun.

I'm not forecasting the end of the world, the collapse of the global economy, or the rise of the undead. I live in South Louisiana where hurricanes are the real threat. Katarina, Rita, and Gustov each left us without power for a minimum of a week and Gustov left us without drinkable running water almost a week. In such times defense from generator thieves and looters was a huge concern. The 6940 will be my go to rifle for such a situation, should it ever occur again.
 
OP:

Hmmm.

I have never heard anyone refer to their AR in that manner. Well maybe once in a while in a web forum.... Maybe it's a regional thing?
 
Guess it depends on where you live. Most of the people I come in contact with are financially secure and can afford bottom feeder rifles or top end gee whiz; many chose somewhere in between. Doctors sometimes have the best but I know a few lawyers who do not want to be out done so it is kinda fun watching.

In this area of Texas most say they bought theirs for defense and or hunting and tend to look someone in the eye when they say it. I have not met anyone who calls their pride and joy "a range toy" or none I can remember???...... Just depends where you are I guess.
 
Well the thing is, that thing was designed to hunt. It's light, the butt stock is narrow, and it has lightweight wooden furniture. BOOM...what a cannon! It was a hoot to shoot. But, being designe to hunt means it was not designed to take to the range and shoot. After 20 rounds or so the thing was too hot to touch and there's a lot of exposed metal. I had bruises on my shoulder.
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Guess my Mosin carbine is the ultimate hunting rifle! :D
 
Here is why my Mini 14, 30, SKS were chosen.
A gang of armed marauders always prefers to open fire on suburban or semi-rural homes from 200 yards.
The preference for semi-auto rifles in 7.62 Nato/.308 is direct proof.
Why would criminals want to sneak within two yards and hide their intentions until the last moment?

The popularity of such rifles for the imminent s**f and long-term "Road Warrior" scenarios contradicts most of what we have read about criminal stealth.

Maybe the M-1 Garand, SKS and Jungle Carbines should go to tomorrow's gun show, in order to purchase a single, effective (glamorous, chic) AR-15, M-1A or FAL, because when inflation increases, these events will result any moment, and 200 yards will be close-in combat for the many thousands of guys like me with no LEO or infantry training;).

Without Mel Gibson's hot car and his sidekick providing Blitzkrieg tactics with poisonous snakes from the gyrocopter, what else are we to do???:eek: "..lots of gasoliiiine, kachunk, kachunk..."
 
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