RIA

I think they're pretty neat. If I could find a use for one other than range toy I'd be very intrested myself.

RIA makes some solid 1911's, and the 22TCM is definitely unique. It's a very very low recoil round with a very very large muzzle blast. I'm not 100% sure ammo availability will stay like it currently is, it might pick up even more, or go into non-existence. But since it uses .223 brass and bullets you could always handload it cheaply.

As a proprietary bottle-necked cartridge, the .22 TCM (Tuason Craig Micromagnum) was developed by Fred Craig of Rock Island Armory. Trading bullet mass for higher velocity 2000 FPS, the 22TCM was developed for high-capacity semi-automatic pistols and is longer than the 9mm and designed to be fired from the Rock Island Armory line of weapons with the Para-Ordinance-style double column .38 super magazines. The .22 TCM round is based on the 5.56x45 NATO case and shortened to be the same length as the .38 Super.

What sort of input would you like?

I have played with four, though #3 was only for a short period as it was defective (could not feed TCM or 9mm, I've forgotten which) and RIA replaced it with #4.

Specifically, on the pistol side a 5" HC, 4.25" single stack, and 4.25" HC.

In this caliber, whether you want the single stack or higher capacity version I'd grab the 5" barrel for maximum velocity.

I have shot .22 TCM from the Rock Island Armory a couple of times. It is fun to shoot with a considerable fireball and little recoil. The lack of recoil might make it good for training someone who wants to shoot a 1911 in a larger caliber. But the ammunition is much more expensive than .22lr and considerably more expensive than 9mm Luger. It seems to only be made by Armscor, so far as I can tell.

The second time I shot it, the fellow who owned the RIA swapped the.22 TCM barrel for the 9mm barrel and seemed to be having a number of malfunctions when he tried to shoot it.

I am waiting with great anticipation for the new Rock Ultra CCO to become available in 9mm/22 TCM.

Rittmeister, is that a double stack?
That might be a neat configuration!

I really want one of their single stack 5" 10mm's as they have better case support than either Colt or Glock, allowing for the use of full power 10mm. If I come across a good deal on one, I'll snap it up. If they offer it in stainless with the right sights, I'll pay MSRP for it and be thrilled!

I don't currently own any RIA's, mostly higher end brands now. But I have owned them in the past and think very highly of the brand.

RIA swapped the.22 TCM barrel for the 9mm barrel and seemed to be having a number of malfunctions when he tried to shoot it.

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I'm pretty sure you have to swap the recoil spring in addition to the barrel. Maybe the magazines too. If he got the dual caliber gun, all the necessary parts should have come with it to swap calibers.

wally said:

Maybe the magazines too.

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Recoil spring yes, magazine no. The early guns came with two extractors but they stopped doing that.

I went back to my old emails and the gun RIA replaced for me would simply not feed 9mm. The cartridges (even ball) would not follow the frame-mounted feed ramp at all, and would wedge between the ramp and slide, hammering the bullet into the case.

The replacement gun had barrel mounted feed ramps. As far as I know all new TCM RIAs do, but watch out for that on the used guns.

floydster said:

Guys, thanks for the replys, mostly interested if all the bugs have been worked out with the tcm round and the RIA 2011 models.
I reload for a lot of pistol calibers, just wanted a new range toy, however I don't want to screw around and have to send a gun back, I have had enough of that, hope you understand.
Was thinking of the Tactical 5" with the rail.
Thanks again for the input.
Floydster

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The only 22TCM I've spent (limited) time at the range with was a 2011 5" railed version and it ran like a top (and beat up a steel plate) the whole day with various shooters.

I can't say whether all of the bugs have been worked out as my sampling is only 3-4 TCM combo guns. Only my oldest is a 5" target (adjustable sight) model and it was reliable for the most part from the factory (it has since been modified enough that you couldn't judge other RIAs against it). The double stack 4.25" is the "tac Ultra MS HC" model and it was the one that RIA replaced. The 4.25" single stack is the "rock ultra MS" model (no rail) and has had no issues. Overall the single stack is my favorite.

gotboostvr said:

Rittmeister, is that a double stack?
That might be a neat configuration!

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It's single-stack. True CCO configuration. Link here: http://armscor.com/firearms/tcm-series/rock-ultra-cco1/

I've been lusting for a 9mm CCO-pattern gun for ages, but until now you could find plenty in .45 but only a very few custom-shop guns in 9mm and the prices were sky-high. Now we're spoiled for choice; RIA's will be released soon and Fusion (I think) is making a budget line of 1911s, one of them being a CCO in various calibers. I think I'll go for the RIA - aluminum frame for lighter weight, street price is likely to still be under the Fusion's, and having the 22TCM package along with the 9mm will just make it an even better deal.

What a shame that they chose to make that COO in 9R instead of "normal" TCM.

I have been shooting the RIA .22 TCM for 3 years. I did not buy the 9MM set. I have too many 9MMs now. The RIA .22 TCM is very impressive. Sighted 1" + at 25 yds it is 1"- at 100 yds.
Armscor bullets and brass are very reasonable. The 50 round boxes of .22 TCM sells for $19-$22 dollars in our stores. It is a very popular handgun for Prairie Dogs and Jack Rabbits. The nuzzle blast and flash? Hell it is a high permanence handgun.

http://www.ammosupplywarehouse.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?search=action&category=TCM0

The only gripe I have is it should have shipped with 38 super barrel instead of a 9mm. Yes I know 9mm is cheaper and more available. I'm willing to bet the problems caused by trying to feed the 9mm from the longer magazine would solved.

I picked up an RIA Citidal in .38 Super. It does not handle the .38 Super Comp Brass. My Colt 1911 .38 Super can shoot all of the .38 Super Ctgs. The Citidal is a good entry level .38 Super.

The 22TCM is basically a wildcat cartridge being commercially produced by a gun manufacturer. It is not a SAAMI standard cartridge. The ammo is only produced by Armscor/RIA. For a pistol caliber, it's not exactly an easy caliber to reload for. There is no standardized, published load data for the round, only what other reloaders have tried themselves. It's just as expensive as shooting .223 ammo. Who knows what kind of longevity the caliber will have. It was popular when it first came out several years ago, but I have noticed a HUGE decline in the amount of online chatter regarding the caliber. Having the ability to shoot 9mm does help, but personally I'd rather have a dedicated 9mm gun that a 9mm/22TCM combo gun. I don't have a huge amount in faith in Armscor/RIA to begin with. The fact that they have not bothered to SAAMI standardize the caliber or allow other ammo companies to produce the ammunition is a big red flag for me.

Olympus said:

The fact that they have not bothered to SAAMI standardize the caliber or allow other ammo companies to produce the ammunition is a big red flag for me.

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That's just bad buisness as far as I'm concerned. Wasn't it SSK that devloped the 300 whisper but was really stingy with letting other people chamber it or produce ammo?

Then AAC makes a very small change or two and gets it standardised as 300blk and let's anyone do what they want with the cartridge and its taken off as far as Wildcats go!

I've been hearing rumors of cheap steel cased ammo for plinking even! I haven't seen any yet, but have seen regular brass cased 300blk in Wal-Mart.

Yeah the 22TCM is more work to reload for than 9mm, it's actually the exact same amount of work as 300blk. But to be fair, 9mm is a straight walled pistol caliber which is about as easy as it gets.

Trim/deburr, lube, resize, trim/deburr, clean, prime, powder, bullet. Other than the first trim it's pretty similar to most rifle cartridges.