Sport pistol with 45 acp

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Dwb1957

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image.jpeg I been using sp in my 9mm with good results for several months and just got around to trying it in my 1911. I loaded it using Remington brass,cci-300 primers with a 200 gr swc bayou coated bullet at 1.255 oal. All groups were fired at 15 yds eights rds per target and measured at 12' using a rest and open sights.
4.8 grs mv 765 Es 49 sd15. Group 1.70"

5.0 grs. Mv 772-54. Group 1.63

5.2 grs. Mv 814-46-15. Group .72 thur out flyer figure it was me. Soft shooting load just what I was wanting for range fun.

5.4 grs. Mv 865-23-8. Group 1.54

5.6 grs. Mv 875-46-16. Group 1.55

5.8 grs. Mv 913-43-15. Group 1.59. This group was trying to tighten up one more tenth may do it if you like a warm load Alliant shows six grains as max with this bullet.
 
Nice shooting, looks like it is working out well for you.
Why is it there is almost always one that has to mess up a good group:)
 
5.2gr is what I have been using under a 230gr FMJ, and it has been pleasant and as accurate as I need.
I have seen great feedback on this new powder.
I am happy it is working well for you DWB1957.
 
+1. And nice group!

As OP posted, I find interesting that Sport Pistol use similar powder charge ranges as W231/HP-38 for my 9mm/45ACP loads and Sport Pistol meters better with less than .05 gr variance, so far best metering pistol powder for me.

I use 4.8 gr of W231/HP-38 for 115 gr FMJ (My reference 9mm load) and same 4.8 gr of Sport Pistol produced smaller shot group than with W231/HP-38 - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/new-alliant-sport-pistol.816514/page-5#post-10598431

I am considering buying 8 lbs of Sport Pistol instead of W231/HP-38 when current 8 lb container of HP-38 runs out.

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Thanks for starting this thread, nice shooting!

I was able to pick up 1lb for evaluation, and guess where it will be evaluated first. Looks like a good fit for 45acp, so after I completed my next round of load testing, SportPistol will be next. For now I am just planning my loads using 200gr plated bullets, but I will probably load a single evaluation load just to see where I am at regarding velocity. For now it seems the single load will be around 5.2gr to 5.4gr using the Berry's 200gr RS bullet. I will post my results as soon as I have something to share.
 
Sounds good. I used 5.3-5.4 gr of W231/HP-38 with 200 gr plated RN as 5.2 gr still blew unburnt powder at my face.

Looking forward to your range report as how Sport Pistol does with 200 gr plated bullet.
 
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bds said:
Sounds good. I used 5.3-5.4 gr of W231/HP-38 with 200 gr plated RN as 5.2 gr still blew unburnt powder at my face.

Looking forward to your range report as how Sport Pistol does with 200 gr plated bullet.
Click to expand...

Thanks bds. My initial load using HP-38 was 5.2, and it looked low based on the chrono numbers and erratic ejection pattern. I was leaning towards doing a 5.4gr in SportPistol, but maybe I'll just load up my normal quota of 6 loads and do a proper evaluation.

Have you calculated a VMD value for SportPistol yet?
 
vaalpens said:
Have you calculated a VMD value for SportPistol yet?
Click to expand...
.49 cc disk hole which "should" drop 5.4 gr of W231/HP-38 drops 4.9 gr of Sport Pistol.

So, using Lee's formula of Charge in grains x VMD Factor = Volume CC

4.9 gr x VMD = 0.49 cc

so

VMD for Sport Pistol = 0.49 / 4.9 = 0.100 which is denser than Bullseye but not as dense as W231/HP-38.

(UPDATE: I rounded up the average of 5 drops for 4.9 gr which actually was slightly less so VMD should actually be 0.1036)

And I got the following drops:

.49 = 4.9 gr
.53 = 5.2 gr
.57 = 5.5 gr
 
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bds said:
.49 cc disk hole which "should" drop 5.4 gr of W231/HP-38 drops 4.9 gr of Sport Pistol.

So, using Lee's formula of Charge in grains x VMD Factor = Volume CC

4.9 gr x VMD = 0.49 cc

so

VMD for Sport Pistol = 0.49 / 4.9 = 0.100 which is denser than Bullseye but not as dense as W231/HP-38.

And I got the following drops:

.49 = 4.9 gr
.53 = 5.2 gr
.57 = 5.5 gr
Click to expand...

Thanks bds. I will verify it when I load my first loads.

Based on what you see with .49cc = 4.9gr. That is actually a VMD of 0.1000 (4.9gr x 0.1 = .49cc)
So for .57 = 5.5gr. That is actually a VMD of 0.103636 (5.5gr x 0.103636 = .57cc)

Hopefully I am not totally off base here.:scrutiny:
 
vaalpens said:
Thanks bds. I will verify it when I load my first loads.

Based on what you see with .49cc = 4.9gr. That is actually a VMD of 0.1000 (4.9gr x 0.1 = .49cc)
So for .57 = 5.5gr. That is actually a VMD of 0.103636 (5.5gr x 0.103636 = .57cc)

Hopefully I am not totally off base here.:scrutiny:
Click to expand...

My apologies. I misread your response. You are completely correct. :oops:
bds said:
VMD for Sport Pistol = 0.49 / 4.9 = 0.100
Click to expand...
 
You are actually correct. The readings on my .02 gr resolution Gemini-20 digital scale were slightly less than 4.9 gr for .49 cc hole (I did 5 drops with less than .05 gr variance) but I rounded up for simpler calculation. So the lighter drops for .53 and .57 cc holes (instead of 5.3 and 5.7 gr) are explainable.

Using .57 cc and 5.5 gr, you do get .1036 VMD factor (I updated my previous post).


If you like, you can use the $1 Auto Disk mod using the .57 hole to drop 5.2, 5.3, 5.4, 5.5 gr charges - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/working-diy-micro-auto-disk.741988/

If Sport Pistol performs like it did for my 9mm testing, you may find a good load around 5.4 gr. Look forward to your range report! :D

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I went ahead and created the first loads with Sport Pistol and went with 6 loads from 5.2gr to 5.7gr using the Berry's 200gr RS bullets, seated to a COL of 1.175". When I get to the 200gr Xtreme SWC's from Dudedog, then I will adjust my range since the SWC's give a little bit higher velocity, probably due to being seated lower.

I used the .100 VMD calculation and it worked great. I don't use the Auto Disk since I still use the Lee dipper, beam scale and a trickler. I do use the VMD to give me some idea which dipper to use, and also to verify what I see on the scale. I also did my own testing (no Gemini 20 scale), with a .5cc Lee dipper and Frankford Arsenal digital scale. Every time I was consistent with the Lee dipper, the result was 5.0gr. Good enough for me.

Thanks again for taking the time to answer my question.

Most of the Alliant powder I use have some static and sticks to inside of the trickler when I dump out the powder. It seems that SportPistol had minimal static, and only a few kernels stuck to side. I wonder if it is coated like some of the Hodgdon powders I use.
 
vaalpens said:
created the first loads with Sport Pistol and went with 6 loads from 5.2gr to 5.7gr using the Berry's 200gr RS bullets, seated to a COL of 1.175"
Click to expand...
While load data Paul provided goes higher, I think 5.2 to 5.7 gr is a good range to test - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?attachments/sport-pistol-initial-loads-010217-pdf.228713/

vaalpens said:
It seems that Sport Pistol had minimal static, and only a few kernels stuck to side. I wonder if it is coated like some of the Hodgdon powders I use.
Click to expand...
Below is comparison picture of W231/HP-38 which is coated and Sport Pistol on the right is not coated. As Paul verified, it is cut extruded powder like N320 (Think thinly sliced rifle stick powder) - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/new-alliant-sport-pistol.816514/page-5#post-10598431

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The only thing I have done with Sport Pistol so far is trying 4.5 Grs of it under an X-Treme 158 Gr SWC @ 1.555 to 1.560 OAL with a CCI 500 primer.

I like to use this test with new powders to see how position sensitive a powder is as far as velocity goes. Six rounds each, Powder Back, Powder Forward, 7 Powder Level.

4" 586-3
6 rds PB - PF - PL
HI 788 - 605 - 696
LO 687 - 444 - 620
AVG 744 - 553 - 666
ES 101 - 161 - 76
SD 34 - 58 - 29

750ish is what I like for this plinker/target load, so I got real close there. ES numbers were poor and there was a lot of scorching on the cases. It had more recoil than this bullet at 750ish with WST or Competition, both of which leave very clean cases at that level. It was accurate though. Metered well, wasn't real 'clingy" in the measure like some powders are.

Should work well in auto calibers for the intended (Targeted) purpose of the powder.

It only lost 191 FPS powder forward away from the primer, and 78 FPS powder level , which is very good for this test. Some powders lose a lot more. Especially considering the pressure appeard low.
 
It definitely does not look like it is coated. Unique doesn't stick, maybe because of the size, but BE-86 and PowerPistol do.

I used the later pdf dated 2/27/17 https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?attachments/sport-pistol-initial-loads-022717-pdf.235357/ when deciding on my starting loads. I just wish Alliant can improve their online load data. I just looked at it for the first time in a while and this jumped out at me:

Alliant_capture.PNG

It is something minor, but it doesn't give you a lot of confidence that they check and double check what is listed online.
 
Based on my experience and what I have been reading, Sport Pistol will likely replace W231/HP-38 as my reference powder when my current 8 lb container of HP-38 runs out.

Match shooters are claiming to consider Sport Pistol as cheaper version of N320 that burns cleaner, temperature stable (W231/HP-38 is temperature sensitive), meters better while consistently producing single digit SD numbers. It's been the best metering powder I have used with less than .05 gr variance when most other "well metering" powders meter with less than/around .1 gr variance.

I anticipate Sport Pistol to surpass N320 and become "THE" USPSA powder.
 
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Good eye vaalpens.
Thank you for the kind words about the powder bds. It is good to see shooters validating our design as more than marketing hype.
Made in Virginia too...
 
bds said:
shooters are claiming to consider Sport Pistol as cheaper version of N320 that burns cleaner, temperature stable (W231/HP-38 is temperature sensitive), meters better while consistently producing single digit SD numbers.
Click to expand...
AA #2 is the cheaper can do anything N-320 does powder IMHO. Not that Sport Pistol can't prove to do this, I just don't have enough experience with it to know.
 
Well, Alliant must be pleased, as that seems to have been their target audience..
 
Alliant Reloading said:
Good eye vaalpens.
Thank you for the kind words about the powder bds. It is good to see shooters validating our design as more than marketing hype.
Made in Virginia too...
Click to expand...

I feel bad being negative about something without providing some suggestions on how to improve the data. I reviewed the https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?attachments/sport-pistol-initial-loads-022717-pdf.235357/ last load data we received against the online load data for 45acp and found these discrepancies:

Following is a capture from the online data. The load data for Speer 230gr CPRN is duplicated, with the 1.265" OAL matching the pdf data.
Alliant_capture_1.PNG

Following is a capture of the latest SportPistol load data https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?attachments/sport-pistol-initial-loads-022717-pdf.235357/ I have that I use for load workup. The highlighted loads are missing from the online data for 45acp.
Alliant_capture_2.PNG

I know it is a pain reviewing data, so hopefully this will help getting the two sources in sync, assuming it should be in sync.
 
I did some testing today with SportPistol in 45ACP, and I think it works very well in 45ACP. The chrono numbers are not that great, but the results on paper speaks for itself. Testing was done at 15yards using a rest.

45acp, P220, 4.4"
Case: S&B
COL: 1.175"
Berrys, 200gr, RS, SportPistol, 5.2gr, CCI300
Average: 762
ES: 77
SD: 31.1
Force: 258
PF: 152
Velocities: 754, 789, 774, 783, 712
Grouping @ 15yd: 1.11"
Test Date: 03/04/2018

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45acp, P220, 4.4"
Case: S&B
COL: 1.175"
Berrys, 200gr, RS, SportPistol, 5.3gr, CCI300
Average: 771
ES: 72
SD: 31
Force: 264
PF: 154
Velocities: 771, 796, 807, 746, 735
Grouping @ 15yd: 0.53"
Test Date: 03/04/2018

45acp, P220, 4.4"
Case: S&B
COL: 1.175"
Berrys, 200gr, RS, SportPistol, 5.4gr, CCI300
Average: 815
ES: 51
SD: 19.6
Force: 295
PF: 163
Velocities: 787, 838, 815, 810, 829
Grouping @ 15yd: 1.49"
Test Date: 03/04/2018

45acp, P220, 4.4"
Case: S&B
COL: 1.175"
Berrys, 200gr, RS, SportPistol, 5.5gr, CCI300
Average: 800
ES: 87
SD: 31.3
Force: 284
PF: 160
Velocities: 850, 794, 795, 800, 763
Grouping @ 15yd: 1.62"
Test Date: 03/04/2018

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45acp, P220, 4.4"
Case: S&B
COL: 1.175"
Berrys, 200gr, RS, SportPistol, 5.6gr, CCI300
Average: 814
ES: 33
SD: 13.9
Force: 294
PF: 162
Velocities: 828, 795, 810, 828, 812
Grouping @ 15yd: 0.51"
Test Date: 03/04/2018

45acp, P220, 4.4"
Case: S&B
COL: 1.175"
Berrys, 200gr, RS, SportPistol, 5.7gr, CCI300
Average: 789
ES: 116
SD: 42.8
Force: 276
PF: 157
Velocities: 846, 806, 772, 730, 792
Grouping @ 15yd: 1.39"
Test Date: 03/04/2018
 
Looking Good!

Thanks for the range report.
bds said:
... you may find a good load around 5.4 gr.
Click to expand...
But since 5.4 gr load produced second smallest SD number, do you plan to repeat the range test to verify accuracy of these loads?
 
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