Compact vs. Full a Size for CCW

MikeInOr said:

I have many friends that will ONLY carry full sized pistols and shame me for my sub compacts, pocket guns and mouse guns. At any random time you are almost assured to find that I am carrying a gun, most likely a little gun. At any random time my full size gun toting buddies are almost assuredly NOT going to have ANY gun on them. I will take a .32 in my pocket over a 1911 on the dresser any day!

I can't remember the last time I left the house without a gun on me.

I have a buddy that will only carry a 1911 but pretty much only carries when he is on his hog. He sold his Harley over 10 years ago. LOL!

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Can't recall the last time I left the house without a gun on me either, it's been at least 10 years if you don't count a vacation to Massachusetts a few years ago.**

Also, last time I left the house with something smaller than a Glock 19 or 26 with 12 round mag was the last time I carried my LCR, 5 years ago at least.

Easy enough habit to holster my gun when I put my pants on in the morning.

**You know what, now that I think on it, I've gone without a few times since then when I met my buddies for a sporting event or a planned night of carousing at the bars when I actually was going to drink. Maybe once or twice a year at most, but since I was planning on drinking I wasn't going to bring any gun, regardless of size.

MikeInOr said:

I have many friends that will ONLY carry full sized pistols and shame me for my sub compacts, pocket guns and mouse guns. At any random time you are almost assured to find that I am carrying a gun, most likely a little gun. At any random time my full size gun toting buddies are almost assuredly NOT going to have ANY gun on them. I will take a .32 in my pocket over a 1911 on the dresser any day!

I can't remember the last time I left the house without a gun on me.

I have a buddy that will only carry a 1911 but pretty much only carries when he is on his hog. He sold his Harley over 10 years ago. LOL!

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It's not an "or" question. If I'm not in bed or the shower the LCP is on me. If I'm in Sweats and a T-Shirt in my 8' fenced backyard with my 70 lb dog that may be all I have. Unless you count the AR inside the back door. Usually I only take it out with me if the dog goes charging out barking. So far it's only been coyotes, racoons and snakes.

I usually add either a .45 Shield or M&P .40c M2.0 if Im going out.

I carried only the LCP when I was a participant at a wedding and was in beach shorts at PCB.

I did enter a college football stadium without the LCP last fall to watch a game. The Secret Service were being a bit difficult.

I've carried both a full size M1911 and a 3 1/2" Citadel.

I can carry both, but the Citadel is more comfortable because I'm short.

sgt127 said:

I generally carry a gun big enough to shoot like a real gun if called upon. It’s a compromise.

There’s a time and a place for everything from a Seecamp to a full size 1911.

I’ve mostly carried a Sig P239 (in 9mm or 357 SIG) Both DAK.

But, I just picked up a Springfield Armory EMP4. I shoot it exceptionally well. And I have many years of carrying and competing with a 1911. Soooo...Made a holster for it and, going to give it a go.

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How do you like that DAK trigger?

Spats McGee said:

You are correct in that there is no right or wrong answer here. I've often said that one should carry the biggest pistol that he can comfortably conceal. I've also learned that the biggest pistol that I can comfortably conceal has shrunk in the past few years.

Any gun that you'll carry is better than any gun that you won't. I've carried as large as a gov't size 1911, and as small as a Shield 9mm in semiautos, and an LCR in revolvers. There's no question about what I shoot best out of the bunch -- the 1911, hands down. It's also the heaviest on my belt and the hardest to hide. I'm also probably about to move back up to a compact pistol. For me, those hit the sweet spot. But if your lifestyle will let you conceal a full-sized pistol and that's what you like go for it.

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To me it seems on a modern synthetic frame striker pistol size is more of an issue than weight. A LW Commander isn't an undue burden and I really can't think of one that's heavier even fully loaded. Of course I haven't weighed my M2.0 Compact with 14 Rounds of 180 gr .40 S&W vs my LW Commander with 10 Rounds of 125 gr .38 Super but I can't imagine the M2.0 being much if any heavier.

Good Ol' Boy said:

I normally carry a G26 with extended mag OWB because it shoots like a fullsize but is more comfortable to carry.

I dont think I would shoot it quite as good as my G17 at a comp.

The main reason I dont just carry the 17 all the time is because of the barrel length when sitting. OWB at 3-4 o clock just doesn't work well sitting for me.

With the extended mags the 26 gives a fullsize grip albeit different than the 17.

I think the most important thing is confidence on the draw and shooting when talking about a EDC.

Shooting stationary drills at the house I can shoot my 26 basically the same as my 17 out to 15yds. Honestly I dont think I'd perform as well in a comp.


Heres a pic to compare the grip...


View attachment 893257

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Have you tried the Glock 45? Just thinking it would give you the full grip with shorter more comfortable slide.

camsdaddy said:

Have you tried the Glock 45? Just thinking it would give you the full grip with shorter more comfortable slide.

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I have not.

Honestly what I'd ideally like would be a factory G26 with a G19 grip but I feel like I've pretty much come as close to that as I can with the +2 extensions on the 26 mags. I can get a full purchase every time even with my XXL hands.

If you notice in my pic the front side of the grips are very similar in length on my 26 and 17. The difference in feel is with the backstrap, but that's easily adaptable with practice.

I agree its up to the carrier.A smaller gun is more comfortable but when you deploy the full size you have a better chance of hitting your target.I CCW with either a S&W shield 45,Ruger LW Commander 45.

Anchorite said:

How do you like that DAK trigger?

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I love the DAK trigger. I started out shooting revolvers so, it’s very intuitive for me. The P239 is a very flat, 8 shot, 357 Magnum revolver with a fantastic trigger that doesn’t hurt to shoot.

Chamber a round? Done. Fired two shots? Done. No decock, no safety.
And, I’ll carry it appendix as the hammer is down, not enough stored energy to fire if something breaks and, I can ride the hammer into the holster to “know” if something gets on the trigger.

I’m a huge fan of cocked and locked. But, I’ve always loved DA revolvers. The DAK trigger is like a well tuned K Frame.

Spats McGee said:

I don't necessarily disagree with you, but I wanted to put some numbers on this. Granted, I suspect these are unloaded weights. If I could find loaded weights, that would be the most useful apples-to-apples comparison. I can't seem to find those, though.

I dredged up the following with a little sniffing around on the web:

Colt LW Commander: 29.4 oz
S&W Shield 45 = 20.5 oz
S&W PC Shield 45, 4" barrel = 24.8 oz
S&W M&P 2.0, .40 S&W, 4" barrel = 28.0 oz
SA Mil-Spec 1911: 39 oz

The PC Shield 45 isn't a very common pistol, as far as I can tell. I've listed it for two reasons: (1) it's the pistol I'll probably be switching to for CC, which means I've been pretty obsessive about this pistol lately; and (2) it's pretty close to the LW Commander in dimensions. The M&P (non-Shield) is awfully close to the LW Commander in both dimensions and (unloaded) weight, but the PC Shield 45 comes in at almost 5 oz lighter than the LW Commander. In and of itself, that doesn't seem like much, but we're talking about pistols that weigh less than 30 oz. Let's also bear in mind that my 1911 wasn't a LW Commander. It was a Springfield Armory GI model, which tipped the scales at a dainty 39 oz. So there's almost a pound of difference between that and the PC Shield.

Sources:
https://gundigest.com/article/1911-review-colt-lightweight-commander -- For the record, it's absolutely beyond me why any company would fail to list, on their website, the weight of a pistol with "Lightweight" as part of its name. I'm looking at you, Colt.

https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/mp-45-shield-m20-no-thumb-safety

https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/performance-center-mp-45-shield-m20-4-barrel

https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/mp-40-m20-4-compact

https://www.springfield-armory.com/products/1911-mil-spec-45-acp/#PB9108L The GI model has been discontinued, and the Mil-Spec is about as close as I could get.

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I've owned the regular Shield 45 PC since It was released. I sold all my other shield s (I owned 5 in various calibers at one point), but the 45 Shield is a keeper for sure. I'll probably will sell it off and replace it with the 4" version though. That gun interest me much more so than the P365s and the Hellcats..

I found weight to be a bigger issue than size. I'd happily go a little bigger if the weight goes down a few ounces.

My two cents. I carried a Glock 23 for many years but when the Glock 19X came out I bought it with the plan of carrying it and it gives the full grip size that is so much nicer combined with the shorter slide that makes sitting more comfortable when driving, which is what I do for 8 hours a day. I am 5'11", 170 lbs. and it fits and hides well IWB. I will probably never go back to carrying a smaller gun.

The longer grip feels so much better and comes with the added benefit of more ammo!

I have zero issues carrying a pistol with a 4" barrel. My issue is the grip. I'd actually would prefer a G26 grip with a G19 slide if I carried Glocks. The grip and thickness of the pistol is what most people have issues concealing, and it's why I will not carry a G19 sized gun. Being that no one really makes a short grip long slide double stack striker fired pistol, I prefer the M&P 9c, XD Mod 2 Subcompact, and Beretta APX Compact 13+1 round sized grips. The Taurus G2C 12+1 is a nice size too. I just add a Pearce pinky extension to get a full grip...

My guess what is that the number of people you conceal carry a fullsized gun are minimal compared to those who carry single stacks and sub-compact double stacks. I reckon the representation on gun forums are skewed as well.

Spats McGee said:

I don't necessarily disagree with you, but I wanted to put some numbers on this. Granted, I suspect these are unloaded weights. If I could find loaded weights, that would be the most useful apples-to-apples comparison. I can't seem to find those, though.

I dredged up the following with a little sniffing around on the web:

Colt LW Commander: 29.4 oz
S&W Shield 45 = 20.5 oz
S&W PC Shield 45, 4" barrel = 24.8 oz
S&W M&P 2.0, .40 S&W, 4" barrel = 28.0 oz
SA Mil-Spec 1911: 39 oz

The PC Shield 45 isn't a very common pistol, as far as I can tell. I've listed it for two reasons: (1) it's the pistol I'll probably be switching to for CC, which means I've been pretty obsessive about this pistol lately; and (2) it's pretty close to the LW Commander in dimensions. The M&P (non-Shield) is awfully close to the LW Commander in both dimensions and (unloaded) weight, but the PC Shield 45 comes in at almost 5 oz lighter than the LW Commander. In and of itself, that doesn't seem like much, but we're talking about pistols that weigh less than 30 oz. Let's also bear in mind that my 1911 wasn't a LW Commander. It was a Springfield Armory GI model, which tipped the scales at a dainty 39 oz. So there's almost a pound of difference between that and the PC Shield.

Sources:
https://gundigest.com/article/1911-review-colt-lightweight-commander -- For the record, it's absolutely beyond me why any company would fail to list, on their website, the weight of a pistol with "Lightweight" as part of its name. I'm looking at you, Colt.

https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/mp-45-shield-m20-no-thumb-safety

https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/performance-center-mp-45-shield-m20-4-barrel

https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/mp-40-m20-4-compact

https://www.springfield-armory.com/products/1911-mil-spec-45-acp/#PB9108L The GI model has been discontinued, and the Mil-Spec is about as close as I could get.

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For what it's worth, according to my kitchen scale (and memory), all fully loaded with a +1:

Dan Wesson VBob .45: 43 oz
Dan Wesson Valkyrie CCO 9mm: 35 oz
Glock 19: 31 oz
Wilson EDC X9 w/rail: 36 oz
Sig Legion 226: don't recall exactly, but I think 45 oz
Kimber Warrior: 47 oz

Never did weigh my R1 double stack with 15 rounds of .45 but I'd guess that one would top 50 oz.

Styx said:

My guess what is that the number of people you conceal carry a fullsized gun are minimal compared to those who carry single stacks and sub-compact double stacks. I reckon the representation on gun forums are skewed as well.

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I think youre right about this.

Ive always carried a full size, and a lot of the time, a BUG that most you see post these days, seems to consider to be too big to carry as a primary. But then again, Im from the era where we really didnt have anywhere near the choices in guns and gear we have today, and you learned to carry what was available and make it work. And, its not at all hard to make it work.

In doing so, Im really amazed sometimes at some of the comments about not being able to carry anything bigger than something like an LCP, when Ive carried things like a GM Colt, SIG P226, or a Glock 17, etc, every day, year round, for most of my life. Its even funnier standing in front of someone whos telling you is not possible, and Im there, in just a pair of jeans and a tee shirt, doing just that while we are talking, and they dont have a clue.

I really do have to wonder sometimes if the reason for the gun, is really taken seriously, and not something else. If you were told ahead of time, there was going to be trouble, and you only have a handgun, what do you pick? The full size you shoot best with that carries a lot of ammo, thats of a realistic caliber? Or do you bring your Seecamp?

Since you dont normally get that sort of heads up, what do you do? The fight is always going to be the fight, and no matter what that turns out to be, and Im betting its not likely going to be the one you always win in your mind. What you have to deal with it, is at least a choice. Like the old knight in that old Indiana Jones movie said ..... "choose wisely".

I carry a Browning Hi-Power, 13+1, everyday.
With a good belt and holster, you don't even know it's there.
It has the SFS system and the Garthwaite trigger is right around 4lbs.

AK103K said:

In doing so, Im really amazed sometimes at some of the comments about not being able to carry anything bigger than something like an LCP, when Ive carried things like a GM Colt, SIG P226, or a Glock 17, etc, every day, year round, for most of my life. Its even funnier standing in front of someone whos telling you is not possible, and Im there, in just a pair of jeans and a tee shirt, doing just that while we are talking, and they dont have a clue.

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I hear ya...

A lot of people confuse won't with can't.

AK103K said:

I think youre right about this.

Ive always carried a full size, and a lot of the time, a BUG that most you see post these days, seems to consider to be too big to carry as a primary. But then again, Im from the era where we really didnt have anywhere near the choices in guns and gear we have today, and you learned to carry what was available and make it work. And, its not at all hard to make it work.

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You do realize that others have different attire, are different hights, have different builds, and perform different daily task than you? I'm sure they "can" carry a full sized gun, but they probably can't conceal it or carry it comfortably based on the aforementioned reasons.

What Ive been carrying lately.

Desantis E25 Belt

Ruger LCP with 7-Rounds in OEM Pocket Holster
(1) Ruger LCP 7-Round Extended Mag with Cap (Pocket)
Note: The extra LCP mag is more for around the house where I may be without the belt gun. I never bother to remove it when I add a belt gun.

S&W M&P M2.0 Compact 4" .40 S&W with 14 Rounds in Alien Gear Cloak Tuck 3.5 IWB.
One 15-Round Magazine in Alien Gear Cloak Mag Carrier.

I haven't added it all up but with the added weight of the belt over a standard belt I'm guessing it's about 3.5 lb and I'm not in the first half of a century and to quote my Doc, "Your back x-ray looks like a train wreck".

I think some of these 25 yo that can't manage the weight of a Shield 9x19mm do protest to much.

Styx said:

You do realize that others have different attire, are different hights, have different builds, and perform different daily task than you? I'm sure they "can" carry a full sized gun, but they probably can't conceal it or carry it comfortably based on the aforementioned reasons.

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Ive carried skinny to fat, and back to skinny again, in office attire (the fat part ), to down in the dirt and mud field attire, and everything in between. Never had a problem pulling it off.

As was mentioned, there is a difference between cant and wont. And this isnt about "cant".

AK103K said:

Ive carried skinny to fat, and back to skinny again, in office attire (the fat part ), to down in the dirt and mud field attire, and everything in between. Never had a problem pulling it off.

As was mentioned, there is a difference between cant and wont. And this isnt about "cant".

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Respectfully and speaking for myself, my build, and the fact that I wear clothes that fit, I can't conceal a G19 or G17 without printing badly unless I'm wearing a jacket. Even then, I wouldn't have the option of taking the jacket or cover garment off, and I'm not wearing a jacket in the warmer months. Again, we're different heights, wear different clothing (usually a light medium t-shirt), and have different body types. What you've been able to carry at different weights does I change these fact or that we're still different.