I have a shotgun problem

Hi, I'm new here so hope this is the right place for this question. I bought a new single shot shotgun recently. The dealer sold me some 3 inch 12 gauge steel shot duck loads as that was all the cartridges they had in stock at the time. I took it to the range to try it out. It shot fine, but locked up and could not open it without severe effort. I took it back and the dealer sent it out for repair. It came back and I took it out for a test. It shot fine but still locked up and wouldn't open. Took it back again, sent for repair again, same problem again. Took the gun back to the dealer, upgraded to a new Mossberg Maverick 88 pump shotgun. Took it out today with the same three inch duck load shells, shot fine, but locked up. I had to dismantle the gun to get the spent shell out. Tried some 2 3/4 inch cartridges and and they work fine. Can it be something wrong with this ammo? Two new guns, same problem with the same box of shells. They shoot and look okay, but the chance of same problem in 2 guns? Only thing in common is the cartridges. I'm baffled ( so is the dealer).

markf1951

Rudolph31 said:

OK, I’ll ask the obvious question, are you sure the guns have 3” chambers?

I had a brand new CZ O/U that wouldn’t open after less than one box of shells. I sent it to CZ, the gunsmith there told me the firing pins were too long and got stuck in the primers.

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Yes..... it says right on the barrels ..... 3" chamber" ... " shoots 2 3/4 & 3" shells"

markf1951

Milkmaster said:

I would not trade or exchange a firearm without having tried more than one ammo. Chamber size is also important. Hard to diagnose without a little more information. Don't give up on it.

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The "gunsmith" who worked on the single shot gun ground and "polished" ( supposedly) every thing to try and correct the problem. In doing so, he has ground the hinge pin the barrel pivots on ( which I doubt has anything to do with the problem) to the point of being downright sloppy. Thus I no longer desired to own this gun anymore, so I traded it back and upgraded to the pump 12 gauge. These are brand new guns, so I didn't want to do any work on them. It is , in my opinion, the dealers responsibility to fix a new firearm. Anything I would have done for repairs would have voided any warranty..
Today, when I fired one of these shells ( Winchester Super X 3" - 1 1/4 oz steel BB ) in the new mossberg I got yesterday, it shot fine but the slide would not go back. I had to remove the barrel, which left the shell still sitting there held by the extractor. I then ran the slide back and ejected the spent shell. It didn't seem that tight in the chamber , but I don't know what else it could be. These shells are high brass but it is actually brass coated steel I think. 2 3/4" shells work fine in both guns. Only these 3" lock them up. Both guns do have 3" chambers. I am about convinced it is these shells which I have too boxes of and tried a shell from each box. They jam the gun after firing. I am thinking of asking the dealer who sold the guns and the ammo about trying another brand of 3" cartridge? I can't think of anything else .

markf1951

Virginian said:

Probably steel base shells and they are sticking in the chamber, BUT I don't know why that would lock up a single shot in the closed position. Should at least have opened partially.

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I thought the same thing, but am wondering, if the force of the shot puts pressure against the back of the camber and the shell swells and sticks thus keeping too much pressure against the release keeping it from opening. I wouldn't think so but am at a loss. I do know one thing ..... the noise of the shot is much louder and the recoil is a lot greater from those 3" shells than the 2 2/4" shells ... a very big difference.

markf1951

Thank you all for your insights. Myself, the gun dealer and a couple other knowledgeable people I know have been working on this without a definite answer. We have come to the conclusion it is these two boxes of shells. Mind you, we are still guessing that, but.... the problem: fire a 3" shell the gun locks closed.

1.) two new guns , completely different. A single shot 12 gauge and a mossberg pump 12 gauge. Problem occurs in both guns with these 3" shells. 2 3/4 " shells work fine.

2.) Single shot gun, 3" shell fits fine, opens , closes, after firing release jammed ,won't open without forcing release. Spent shell now fits snug in chamber but doesn't seem excessively tight. ( also, put spent shell back in gun, it will open and close.)

3.) Load 3" shell in pump gun, cycles into chamber and ejects fine. Load shell again, cycle into chamber, fires okay, pump action locked, can't eject shell. Only way is to remove barrel, slide it off the shell. Shell still sitting on front of bolt held by ejector arms. Cycle pump and shell ejects fine.

4.) 2 3/4" shells work fine in both guns.

5.) The 3" shells are Winchester super X , 3 " - 1 1/4oz steel BB waterfowl loads. I have two boxes and none work in the guns. ( unfortunately, I haven't been able to find any other 3" shells to try yet.)

6.) Tore both guns down, cleaned , lubed, reassembled, tried again , problem still exists.

7.) Measured shells compared to SAMI spec chart. Can't find any thing obvious. I also compared similar dimensions between the 3" and 2 3/4" shells and can't find anything that appears wrong. The 3" shells do seem to swell to the chamber after firing more noticeable than the 2 3/4" shells, but the Load also seems more.( much louder and much more recoil).

8.) Both guns ARE chambered for 3" shells.

That is all the info I have. You now as much as I do about this. So, thus far, it appears ( to me) the problem is with these shells. I believe the only way to confirm that is to find a different brand of 3" shell and try both guns again. Again, I thank you all for your input. Once I find another shell, I'll let you know what I find.

One other note. It was suggested maybe I don't know how to operate the gun. To that, I can only offer, I am 69 years old, been shooting for 55 of those years, been loading my own ammo longer than I can remember, always repaired my own guns ( I am a master machinist) , so I don't consider myself a "newbie" or lacking knowledge and experience, and I never saw a problem like this.

Thank you all

markf1951

entropy said:

The primers could be backing into the firing pin hole. This can lock a break open up pretty tight, but I've never heard of it locking a pump up to the point it can't be mortared out.

Sorry about the implication, but when someone comes onto a forum new and mentions this type of problem, it sometimes is operator headspace and timing. Sounds like this isn't the problem here. But, I will say this; if you've been shooting 55 years and loading for most of that, you have no excuse for not having sufficient ammo on hand to the point where you feel the need to shoot 3" BB steel loads when that's "all you could find" and you're not hunting waterfowl. C'mon, you lived through how many ammo droughts?

Obviously it is an ammo quality issue; If you get a hold of Winchester, they'll probably make it right. At least send you some ammo to replace those shells.

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Actually there is a good excuse for not having shotgun ammo lying around. I have plenty of 20 gauge shells but no 12 gauge. I stopped small game hunting years ago and just don't shoot a shot gun much. I have 3000 rounds of 9mm and supplies to load 3000 more. We shoot that a lot. I rarely shoot my 20 gauge side by side that was my father's and just bought the 12 gauge about 6 months ago and the ammo was all there was and this is strictly a defense gun for the house. So that's why I'm in the situation I'm in.

I did check the primers in the shells. Wasn't the issue. I measured the shells before firing and the brass is .802 diameter. After firing they are .809 diameter. The chamber measures .810 diameter ( at the rear). I can see the marks on the brass where it has pressed out against the chamber after firing. I think the high brass is sticking in the chamber after firing but don't know why. Tomorrow I'm going to call Winchester and see what they say and also return these shells to the dealer. Hopefully he can give me something different. But I do believe at this point it is the shells, just not sure why.

Thank you all. I returned the ammo to the dealer today and we discussed the problem. Unfortunately, he was out of shot shells so I will check back next week and hope he has got some. I went to 3 other stores in my area, but the shelves were bare.

markf1951