Marlin lever gun speculation.

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"6) the odd refusal to use scopes on lever guns by some"


When I was in college, I helped an old turkey rancher prepare for market and he let me deer hunt. The only gun he owned was a 1908 Win 94 .30-30, he had shot since he was a kid. He shot 5-6 deer every year.

I asked him why he didn't have a scope?

"Tried one once, it made the rifle top heavy and wobbled too much."

Wasn't no telling him different. Hard to argue with success. 70 years @5 deer/yr
 
I haven't seen, in person, the new Ruger/Marlin lever guns yet. So, I'll need to wait to form an opinion. As to Henry lever rifles, I believe they are a very well built and very accurate rifle.
True, these new Henry's[1996?] aren't Marlin's and they aren't Winchester's; they're Henry's. Thus, are they not all a bit different? I have two Henry's[.357 and .45 Colt], one Win Mod 94[30-30], and one Marlin, a 39A from 1957. I like them all. All a little different, all wonderful firearms.
Someone mentioned barrel twist on .45 Colt. Henry's are 1:16 twist. Let's see what Ruger comes out with.
 
dranrab said:
It is interesting that people have so much faith in Ruger. I don't.

My personal experiences.

*10/22 magnum back to the factory for failure to extract.
*Mini 14s with minute of paper plate accuracy.
*Ruger AR, back to the factory for magazines that wouldn't seat.
*SR 22 that would not function out of the box.
77/44 that was minute of paper plate accurate.
*Charger shipped with defective magazine.
*Hawkeye Predator with nasty burr on bolt face that I had to grind off and a frosted stainless finish that would mar if you looked at it wrong.
*LCP 22 with defective magazine.
*Several American Predator rimfires that suffer extraction issues and split cases.
*SP101 with sights that didn't have enough travel to get on bullseye and finish that looked like it had been dragged down the road.

They never could make their 10/22 magnums work reliably.
Their Wilson barrels were often horrible.
Blackhawks have suffered a myriad of issues
Number 1s often have wood with no character and horrible wood to medal fit.
Mini 14s used to be routinely horrible with accuracy. Changes have made them better, but still not good.
77 series rifles that often needed bolt shims to shoot worth a crap.
96/44s were absolute duds.
American centerfire rifles with crap magazines.


There's more. Much more. My two typing fingers are getting tired.
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The early Rugers were pretty much hit or miss. They did not know how to make barrels and usually bought them from others. I have had too many Ruger rifles that simply would not group. I hear the newer ones are much better, but I have moved on long ago.
 
351 WINCHESTER said:
The early Rugers were pretty much hit or miss. They did not know how to make barrels and usually bought them from others. I have had too many Ruger rifles that simply would not group. I hear the newer ones are much better, but I have moved on long ago.
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Same. I fell in and out of love with a couple of 77's. One was a gorgeous stainless RSI with the full length stock in 7x57. Man what a looker. But 2" groups from a bolt action don't impress me, so it was sold.
 
I have much faith in Ruger and their potential with the Marlin brand. If there is a fast twist .44 or .45, I will be in line for one. If not, there do seem to be some new 92's with fast twist barrels that might be tuned for long, heavyweight cast bullets.


dranrab said:
It is interesting that people have so much faith in Ruger. I don't.
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To date, I've bought over 80 Rugers and have only had to send one back. One that was purchased sight unseen as a gift. They replaced it with a new one that is one of my favorite sixguns. I'd say your luck is worse than average.
 
courtgreene said:
A lot of people knock the Henrys and I cannot figure out why. I know, I know, no loading gate (though the new versions have them). Frankly, I think they're fantastic. I'd still rather have the Rugers.
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Some people don't like shape and look of Henrys.

I have also heard that the internals are too soft for hard use in cowboy competitions
 
CraigC said:
I If there is a fast twist .44 or .45, I will be in line for one.

I'd say your luck is worse than average.
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With the proper groove diameter of course.

Brother, you have no idea just how bad my luck is. But Ruger's QC issues are fairly widespread and widely known.
 
.45Coltguy said:
True, these new Henry's[1996?] aren't Marlin's and they aren't Winchester's; they're Henry's. T.
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Well, that is just it, they are not Henrys. The real Henry rifle was from the New Haven Arms Company and from which then evolved into the Winchester Model 1866 or some such. Reproductions of Henry rifles are made by the so named and historically unrelated Henry Repeating Arms Company founded 1996 and Uberti. Only one of the two pretend to be Henry which was never the name of a company but of a rifle model. And only their reproduction of a Henry rifle has any legacy, the other models do not.

3C
 
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3Crows, that is exactly why I stated 1996. I know today's Henry's aren't the real deal, but, certainly offer a damn good product. Not many really care about the "legacy" aspect of it.
Not trying to argue here, just saying Henry is another lever rifle option, especially when Winchester's became rather expensive and Marlin's pretty much went in the tank. Just another option for the lever folks out there.
 
Newtosavage said:
Same. I fell in and out of love with a couple of 77's. One was a gorgeous stainless RSI with the full length stock in 7x57. Man what a looker. But 2" groups from a bolt action don't impress me, so it was sold.
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I would have settled for 2" group at 100 yards. I could have made that work. I had a .308 77 with the tang safety that would not group any ammo I tried. I don't know who Ruger had make their barrels, but like I said they were pretty much hit of miss. I never forgot that.
 
in a few years people will probably begin saying that the Ruger marlins aren't real marlins and so they are worthless. Winchester may take longer. The fact is you just can't please everyone. I like a well working lever gun. Ditto bolt guns. I don't care whose name is on it. I do get that we have our preferences though, so I support people's rights to like or dislike in opposition to that which I like or dislike.
 
.45Coltguy said:
3Crows, that is exactly why I stated 1996. I know today's Henry's aren't the real deal, but, certainly offer a damn good product. Not many really care about the "legacy" aspect of it.
Not trying to argue here, just saying Henry is another lever rifle option, especially when Winchester's became rather expensive and Marlin's pretty much went in the tank. Just another option for the lever folks out there.
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Yes sir. I am sorry, sincerely, I was not trying to argue with you or derate your opinion. I do want the Henry .44M AW and I will take one of the nice little 22 lever guns to spare wear and tear on my 9422M and 39AT :). I just keep tripping over the Henry name, it sticks in my craw for some reason. And you are absolutely right, they are an option with some nice rifles out.

3C
 
3Crows said:
The Marlin 336 rifle is appealing in part due to it's heritage and design. The issues with lever guns that have an underneath the barrel magazine and barrel band clamps is that 1) the barrel is not free floated and 2) the weight of the loaded cartridges alone can alter POI and 3) as the barrel heats up it expands relative to the magazine tube and 4) the aforementioned bands/clamps and 5) use of two piece stocks and 6) the odd refusal to use scopes on lever guns by some. These rifles were not designed for MOA accuracy but here is my Remington built Marlin 336S at 100 yards with factory ammo:

View attachment 1065401

My JM 336 Texan at 100 yards with my slightly down loaded home brew Hornady Lever ammo:

View attachment 1065402

Looks MOA to me. Both of the above are Micro Groove and I do not shoot cast lead in either unlike in my .45-70 for which the bullets alone are size MOA ;) . And before somebody thinks the Texan is more accurate than the 336S, it is a draw because the Remington Marlin 336 will go hole on hole with my home brew Hornady Lever ammo, on the right:

View attachment 1065403

There are lever guns that do use box magazines or at least do not have underslung magazine tubes, but they would not be a Marlin or a Winchester. And at that point I might prefer the straight pull Savage.

3C
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Ever see a Winchester 1895?..........Box magazine. Chambered in 30-40 Krag/405 Win. and 30/06..........:Later chambered in 270 & 30-06. Or a Savage 99?
 
The Happy Kaboomer said:
Ever see a Winchester 1895?..........Box magazine. Chambered in 30-40 Krag/405 Win. and 30/06..........:Later chambered in 270 & 30-06. Or a Savage 99?
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Are you asking me if I know that there were, importantly were, lever guns that used box magazines but save for the Lone Ranger and I suppose the BLR they were and are not any longer? We were talking about Marlin and speculation thereof and Marlin never made such a rifle and they are not going to either and what I said was done so speaking of Marlin and similar lever guns that use a tube magazine.

3C
 
Lever action rifles could be almost as accurate as bolt actions with a few small design changes. Float the barrel, get rid of the barrel band, no contact between the magazine tube and the barrel or the front hand guard and the barrel. Unlikely Ruger, or anyone else, would do so.

Personally I’d like a Savage 99 made with modern steels, in modern calibers, and better triggers. But that ain’t happening, either.
 
I inspected a new Ruglin at my LGS a couple of weeks ago. The wood to metal finish was bad. The wood was raised up quite a bit and razor sharp.

IMG_20220215_115709176.jpg
IMG_20220215_115702094.jpg

Receiver had a nice polish and the new fluted bolt was pretty. Quality was about the same as my $700 Henry, but the Henry had a better stock fitting. Not sure I'd pay twice the money for the Ruglin.
 
My only ask would be, get rid of the freakin' stupid big loop. Don't know about anyone else, but I don't shoot my lever-action rifles wearing ski gloves or down mittens.
 
Different strokes. A scope would be out of place on my Winchester 30-30. It's light slim design is great for sneaking through cover. If I want a longer range weapon I use a bolt action. I do have a scope mount for it should I decide to use it again. If I had one that used a high velocity round and had a box magazine a scope would be more useful. Like a BLR or my buddies 284 Winchester
 
I hope Ruger would leave off the crossbolt safety. But if they keep with the trend on how they did the 1895, they will have them unfortunately.
 
herrwalther said:
I hope Ruger would leave off the crossbolt safety. But if they keep with the trend on how they did the 1895, they will have them unfortunately.
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Amen! Man, I hate those things. Both of my 1895’s (JM versions) have the cross bolt safeties.

My 336 doesn’t. I don’t think the 336 is more likely to fire unintentionally than the 1895’s.

I hope Ruger succeeds with the Marlin marque. I have a batch of Ruger products and a reissued 39A in stainless would cause me to push several guns out of my safe to make room for another Ruger. ;)

(I like the looks of the Winchesters more, but the solid-top Marlins have always had a lot going for them. :thumbup:)

Stay safe.
 
I don't mind the idea of a cross bolt safety, as many good rifles have them.

My problem with the Marlin cross bolt safety is that it doesn't block the hammer from being released when the trigger is pulled. Which means you might dry fire the gun when you meant to launch a bullet down the barrel.
 
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