"Guns are not a solution"

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Guns are not a solution

By: Josh Wilder. He can be reached at [email protected].
Issue date: 9/25/07 Section: Editorial / Opinion

It has been almost a year since the gruesome school house shootings in the Amish community of Bart Township, PA shocked the nation. Violence in schools has been an issue of concern since the Columbine tragedy, but this massacre caught everyone off guard.

While you can never "predict" where or when such a shooting would take place, the fact that a gunman would choose a one-room Amish school house proved that no school in the country is safe. Whether you are in the suburbs of a city like Boston or in the middle of rural America, the potential for violence comes along for the ride.

A grim reminder of the questionable safety of our schools, the shootings raised the question: How can we prevent these tragedies from happening in the future? The subsequent shooting spree at Virginia Tech showed that we still haven't figured that out yet. The issue rages on today, with various "solutions" being offered.

A teacher in Ashland, Ore. has offered her thoughts on the subject, and are quite possibly the worst ideas to date. This teacher, who is known by the pseudonym "Jane Doe" in court and newspaper articles, wants to bring her 9-mm pistol to school with her while she teaches.

She originally got the gun to protect herself from an ex-husband who has frequently threatened her with violence. There is only one problem, though - the law in her district states that only law enforcement officials can bring guns into schools.

Well, that didn't sit well with Ms. Doe, and she has decided to challenge the school district in court. And lucky for her, now she has some supporters.

Like always, those wacky NRA nut jobs have found a way to get involved in the situation and now are turning it into a Second-Amendment showdown.

This issue isn't really about the right to carry guns because, well, for starters, that right will never be revoked or changed. This really comes down to logic - sitting down like big boys and girls and talking about an issue intelligently.

How do we protect students in schools? Jane Doe and the NRA are arguing that giving guns to the teachers will give them the power to regulate such violence; and in case another kid snaps during fifth period, they will be there to pop a cap immediately.

Guns don't kill people; people kill people. Well that is true, but the guns sure make it easier. The problem with this rationale is that you are trying to stop school shootings by putting more guns - the tool used for shootings - in the school, the place where the shootings take place.

Say your buddy is trying to cut back and lose a few pounds. 'Today is the day I lose the weight,' he says, as he fills his house with Oreos, Ring Dings and peanut butter cups. He is surrounding himself with the things he is trying to avoid.

Of course, some will say teachers are responsible, stable figures, so we should give them guns to mediate a situation. From my experience in school as a child, I can tell you that many teachers are completely off the wall. Some are great people, but many are high-strung, overworked control freaks. They need vacations, not guns. Not to mention the teachers who have sex with students - not the most grounded folks.

Let's follow this dangerous line of thinking a little farther. Campus safety is on everyone's minds these days, and the University of Massachusetts is as susceptible as any other university. So in order to make the area safer for students, how about giving guns not just to the professors but to the students also?

You check in on move-in day and get an assignment book, key and a gun. But it is a B.Y.O.B. affair - bring your own bullets, of course. Upperclassmen get bigger guns, since they have paid their dues. If anyone around here thought about trying something, they would know that everyone else had a gun too. Problem solved, right?

This example, while perhaps far-fetched, illustrates the crux of this issue. Bringing guns to school is a reactive solution, not proactive. If lawmakers are serious about implementing safety measures in schools, they could start with some common sense.

Instead of giving teachers guns, why not give students bulletproof vests? Sure they might be bulky, but does anyone doubt that students would feel safer if they knew they had a safety net like that?

Or what about installing shields on the desks or putting metal detectors at the entrances to schools? These ideas are really common sense; it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure it out.

Americans love guns and the right to use them, but those who deny the role they play in school violence are kidding themselves. If we are serious about preventing further tragedies, we need to put the guns down and pick up our thinking caps.
 
None of my guns are a solution. They tend to be solids more than anything. :neener:


Yeah, I know. Groan groan. That's the same response I get when someone asks "Is that <insert food here> organic??"

"I'm pretty sure there's a carbon atom in there somewhere, yeah."

I usually get blank stares, but the looks from those who get it are worth it. :D
 
This really comes down to logic - sitting down like big boys and girls and talking about an issue intelligently.

I would suggest that the author take their own advise then, edit and resubmit their editorial. Every paragraph had something in it to discredit his argument.
 
"Instead of giving teachers guns, why not give students bulletproof vests? Sure they might be bulky, but does anyone doubt that students would feel safer if they knew they had a safety net like that?

Or what about installing shields on the desks or putting metal detectors at the entrances to schools? These ideas are really common sense; it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure it out."

I'm pretty sure that would cost the state alot of money. The federal goverment would impose an unfunded mandate and it would come out of the taxpayers pocket. And i'm pretty sure putting steal into desks would make them way more expensive and more uncomfortable then they already are.

When on the other hand, if people were givin the right to bring their own firearm on campus it wouldnt cost a thing. Then the state would make the money form all the taxes on such things.
 
Well, if guns are not a solution, I'm sure the author would support legislation FORBIDDING the police to use firearms to intervene in any school shooting.

Pepper spray or bare hands, that's it.
 
It's always interesting to see how the other side thinks.

The author interestingly decided to extend the idea of arming teachers to arming university students as well. This is, of course, exactly what many of us have been saying for some time. He's sitting right on the solution and laughing at it. He then suggests other things that would make people feel safer. Does he really thinking that feeling safe is as good as being safe?

He also says that arming teachers is reactive rather than proactive (as opposed to installing shields and metal detectors?); is it just me, or is arming people proactive against all violent crime?

This issue isn't really about the right to carry guns because, well, for starters, that right will never be revoked or changed.
What a fun fairy tale he's living in!
 
Like always, those wacky NRA nut jobs have found a way to get involved in the situation

This was where I kind of zoned out.

Instead of giving teachers guns, why not give students bulletproof vests? Sure they might be bulky, but does anyone doubt that students would feel safer if they knew they had a safety net like that?

Or what about installing shields on the desks or putting metal detectors at the entrances to schools? These ideas are really common sense; it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure it out.

This is where I started laughing. I guess this is an attempt to come up with an alternative solution other than "It's a fluffy social problem, and all of society is at fault when one of its members goes nuts with a firearm."

These measures just make us a fear state. I don't think that gun-totin' should be mandated for teachers. I don't think it should necessarily be encouraged. But I think if a teacher wants to take their safety into their own hands, it should not be forbidden to them just because they work at a school instead of a first-class career where people are allowed to defend themselves effectively.

When all the kiddies are running around in class III body armor, wearing kevlar helmets, throwing smoke grenades before they venture into the hallway, just what are we doing to society then? How is that less damaging to our tender sensitivities than letting a school administrator CCW legally?

-Jephthai-
 
Like always, those wacky NRA nut jobs have found a way to get involved in the situation and now are turning it into a Second-Amendment showdown.

This issue isn't really about the right to carry guns because, well, for starters, that right will never be revoked or changed. This really comes down to logic - sitting down like big boys and girls and talking about an issue intelligently.
Yes, sir, Mr. Wilder. Name calling is SOOOOOO intelligent. I would bet that the next thing that happens is you will bring up your well-thought opinions on my sexuality, or find a way to insult one of my family members.

You have illustrated your own worth in your own column. Thank you for making my job easier. Have a nice day.
 
Guns aren't the solution to all problems, but you'd be hard pressed to argue that they aren't a damn fine solution to some problems.
 
Say your buddy is trying to cut back and lose a few pounds. 'Today is the day I lose the weight,' he says, as he fills his house with Oreos, Ring Dings and peanut butter cups.

Although I am rather quite fond of oreos, ring dings, and peanut butter cups like I am also fond of firearms, last time I checked, they were different animals altogether. :rolleyes:
 
A metal detector isn't going to stop somebody who walks in the door with a gun in his hand intent on shooting whoever he sees. He'll shoot the metal detector operator (can't really call them a guard since they won't be armed) and walk right on past. A metal detector isn't a magical force field any more than a "gun-free zone" sticker on the door is.
 
> Instead of giving teachers guns, why not give students bulletproof
> vests? Sure they might be bulky, but does anyone doubt that
> students would feel safer if they knew they had a safety net
> like that?

> Or what about installing shields on the desks

Yes - let's encase teacher's desks with 'sheilds' and issue 'bullet proof vests' to all students. :banghead:

Of course, the number of people who die on the freeway or drown in pools is an "acceptable loss" which in case of pools requires no legislation whatsoever in the case of cars only a seat-belt law. But the very few people who die from school shootings is "outrageously high" and justifies the revokation of a constitutional right.

They keep saying that nothing can stop a school shooting - that is only true if you accept the 'party line' that the only reaction to agression is to wet your pants and die crying.
 
True guns are not a solution, they are just a tool that gives you the ability to factor into the final solution. Those who do not have one tend to be left out of the "debate" while those who possess them tend to have a great amount of imput!
 
Josh Wilder,

Evil has existed forever and will continue to. You cannot close your eyes and wish it away.
Laws, regulations, restrictions, education, bans, prohibiting or any other measure has never stopped Evil.
It never will.

Evil existed before bow and arrows, swords, knives, blackpowder guns, smokeless guns, telegraph, telephone and name any modern technology that Persons choose to blame and want to restrict, regulate or ban in the hopes of getting rid of Evil.

Mr. Wilder,
Everyone has impulses, the difference in Law Abiding and Evil is, Evil chooses to act upon impulses.
Intent, is the key. Everything can be viewed from a Intent Perspective.

Guns are not able to do anything without a user.
They are not problems or solutions until a user chooses to pick one up, and the Intent of the user defines the result.

Your computer Mr. Wilder is not able to do anything until you choose to use it.
Your Intent dictates even without a computer, no word processing software, you Intend to deny persons a means to protect themselves from Evil.

Mr. Wilder, your computer is not a solution.


.
 
Something that keeps bugging me about these anti's articles: stop saying "giving" guns to people! This legislation would allow licensed teachers to carry... it doesn't GIVE carry weapons to anyone! Why do they keep bringing that up?

It bugs the living daylights outta me... sigh
 
I love articles like this. All these fools do is complain. No solutions. They just like to rant in print. If arming teachers and students isn't the solution, then what is? All articles like this seem to say is, "we don't know". Well, here's a thought Suzy-1990s-style-liberal-ranter: If you don't have a solution, then keep your mouth shut. I'm pretty sure that after every shooting, we're all aware that something needs to be done. The difference between the antis and us is that WE actually offer a solution. I'll bet by next April, they STILL won't have a solution... but they'll still be ranting in letters to the editor!
 
This issue isn't really about the right to carry guns because, well, for starters, that right will never be revoked or changed.
Perhaps he should investigate the laws of Illinois or Wisconsin? Even his state of Massachusetts is less than forthcoming with their permits.

Seems like Mr. Wilder has a chance at a career with the Associated Press. Much like AP articles, his editorial is subjective, poorly researched, talks about "feelings" and not facts, and even resorts to name-calling.

Say your buddy is trying to cut back and lose a few pounds. 'Today is the day I lose the weight,' he says, as he fills his house with Oreos, Ring Dings and peanut butter cups. He is surrounding himself with the things he is trying to avoid.
I know what to do! We should remove all of the food from his house. Maybe by the time he dies, he'll be skinny. Exercise equipment is not allowed either since people get hurt with that stuff!

Some are great people, but many are high-strung, overworked control freaks. They need vacations, not guns. Not to mention the teachers who have sex with students - not the most grounded folks.

And what of the child molesters who bait children with nothing but some candy? Obviously candy is the problem.

Most estimates place close to 300 million guns amongst about 30-40% of households in this country. I live in a rural area that has a large number of gun owners. We are not murdering each other by the dozens.

You check in on move-in day and get an assignment book, key and a gun. But it is a B.Y.O.B. affair - bring your own bullets, of course. Upperclassmen get bigger guns, since they have paid their dues. If anyone around here thought about trying something, they would know that everyone else had a gun too. Problem solved, right?

No one is asking for mandatory gun-carrying. As for everyone having a gun, think about how many school shootings there have been in the last 15 years. Now, think about how many shootings there have been at a) gun shows b) police stations and c) domestic military bases. By the author's logic, those three places would be death traps due to "everyone" having a gun or access to one.

we need to put the guns down and pick up our thinking caps
Yeah, next time put on the thinking cap before sitting at your keyboard.
 
This really comes down to logic - sitting down like big boys and girls and talking about an issue intelligently.

Hmmm... well then... if I ever encounter a mad man shooting up a school, I'll pull him aside for a chat.

So in order to make the area safer for students, how about giving guns not just to the professors but to the students also?

http://media.www.dailyutahchronicle.com/media/storage...

No shootings in Israeli schools since the 70's.


-T.
 
Take it easy on him. He is young and idealistic. And from Massachusetts. Or at least going to University there.
 
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