Gun Store Kick-Out

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Killermonkey21

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I posted this on another forum, in a more local section, but I thought you guys would get a kick out of this. I'm an active duty soldier in the US Army and like to think of myself as a gun nut, as well as a pretty well read guy on the laws pertaining to age and carrying of weapons, considering I'm still under that magic number of 21 years of age. Enjoy.

Post Copied from Opencarry.org


I am currently on my honeymoon in Reno and decided to do a little browsing while I was here and my wife was occupied. I am 20 years of age, and active duty Army. I had to jump through many hoops in North Carolina to buy a handgun (private sale) under 21, so I know all the applicable Federal Laws and NC laws in regards to this situation.

Let me say this, loud and clear: I had no intention of buying a firearm, nor did I have a firearm in my possession. Zero. None. Nada. This is a complaint purely from a customers point of view.

I found Gun Trader online and entered the store at approximately 1300 hours on July 9th, 2009.

They greeted me, and after finding out I was military (I say sir a lot, apparently) we got into a discussion and I browsed their firearms, and took a look at the 14 round SW MP .45 full size magazines.

I then got in the discussion of how I acquired my S&W M&P .45 ACP fullsize. I mention that I bought it from a person at a gun-show in North Carolina, and that I had to get a pistol purchase permit and jump through some hoops with the Cumberland County Attorney's Office to get that because I was under 21.

That perked their ears. One of the men rolls his eyes and says:
Him: "You know you just admitted to a felony."
Me: "Excuse me?"
Him: "You can't buy a gun when you're under 21, period."
Me: "Yeah, from a FFL. It was a private sale though."
Him: "It doesnt matter. You just admitted to a felony."
Me: "Sir, I hate to tell you you're wrong, but federal law says 18 to possess, 21 to buy from a dealer."
Him: "I do this for a living. And you come in here admitting to a felony, you can just beat feet out of here if you think you know so much. I do this for a damn living."

I could be wrong with a few of the quotes, but that was the general gist of the conversation.

I left the store with no further argument wondering if ignorance really was bliss.

I was not trying to argue Nevada law (because I don't know it) but Federal law. I guess they didn't lose a customer, but they sure as hell didn't show much customer service.

-John
 
What are the laws of handgun purchase (dealer or private). And are there any exceptions for active military? For someone under 21.
 
Federally they are just as says. 21 to buy from a dealer, but 18 is ok for an in state deal. State laws may vary.
 
He might "do that for a living" but it certainly doesn't mean that he's very knowledgeable about it or very good at what he does. Sounds ignorant to me.
 
My point was that fed law says 21 to buy from a dealer, but 18 to possess, as in my dad could give me one, or in states that don't restrict it, from a private sale, as long as its not a FFL holder.
 
I was curious because I work in a pawnshop and had a 19 year old active army customer who told me he was going to get his ccl and was buying a gandgun. I told him that I wasn't aware of any exceptions so I couldn't sell him one. It wasn't an i'm right and your wrong type a thing, more like I may be ignorant and don't want to chance it.
 
If you weren't looking to buy, why bring it up in the first place? That being said, sounds like the gun store guy was being a jerk just to be a jerk.
 
This reminds me of the time I found a .22 rifle which had been obviously chopped down into a pistol. I told the guy at the table that It was illegal to cut down a rifle into a pistol and he should get it off his table before someone from the ATF walks by.

He insisted that as long as the there was no but stock on the gun the barrel could be of any length. I tried to tell him he was just moments away from serious trouble and to get rid of the thing but he didn’t listen so I got out of there.

Dan
 
Some FFL's believe that if its not how they do business it is illegal. You should see the look I usually get from them when I tell them I have a Curio and Relics license that I'd rather just buy a C&R gun from them and give them a copy of my 03 FFL instead of filling out a Form 4473, they usually act like I just asked them to convert a Mac-10 to full auto.

--

Also, some dealers, just like some people are just jerks.

There are plenty of dealers who would also like to see private party sales banned - it means more money for them.

Once I walked into a shop and very respectfully asked if a dealer he performed FFL transfers and he told me that "Sure, you can have a gun shipped here and I can transfer it for you, but I'll make it so expensive that you'll never do it again." Obviously from that point forward he would never see a dime of my business.

You just run into it sometimes.
 
Its too bad that a fellow "gun enthusiast" had too much PRIDE that he couldnt admit to being wrong or wasnt open minded enough to learn something new.

Id mail him the law then tell all my friends never to shop there.
 
I've run into situations similar to yours on the other side of the counter, except that in KY there's no "pistol permit" or anything necessary. Usually, after hearing about such information from a customer/potential customer, my next question or comment is "Good stuff. How's it shoot?"

It behooves the guys behind the counter to know the law just as much as purchasers, to avoid looking stupid.

It probably also helps that I acquired my first handgun at 19, so I'm well aware of the legal situation there :D

And while I certainly cannot speak for all gun-counter-monkeys.....if a customer is not obviously off their rocker and comes in with pertinent or intriguing information, rather than raving that their uncle got a deer at 800 yards with an iron-sighted .270 Mauser Lever-Action, I'm always game to learn something new. You just gotta find the right counter guy to talk to sometimes.
 
Big gun shop back home has this fat guy who's parents wern't married at the gun counter and I have yet to buy anything from him when he's there and waits on me. If you ask for a certain kind of ammo,powder or bullet he has something to say about it and by the time he's finished I decide not to buy anything and walk out. He has to be married to the boss or something. I mentioned him to another guy once and turns out he had the same opinion.
 
I hate to sound hypocritical, but in America these days it's probably best to keep most stuff private, IE, you don't talk about it with anyone else. Not even when you're drunk.


At this moment, he probably feels as right as you do. if you'd never said anything at all, you'd probably have no reason to have made this post, though.

It sucks either way you go. You're either cheating yourself out of an opportunity, or burning a bridge.
atleast until the military lets you stop shaving your face that is.

Mum's the word, my friend. You can't trust the average citizen, (Gun store owner, and cops alike) to handle what you're trying to tell them. Often times saying one or two little bitty insignificant words will totally unravel a person's composure.
 
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I've always wondered how those laws were justified in the first place. At the age of 19, I got my first CCW permit, back in the day when you had to jump through some serious hoops to prove you needed one (mid 70's). Funny thing was, I couldn't legally purchase a NEW firearm until I was 21, but I could buy a USED firearm any time I wanted! I couldn't see the rationale then, and I still can't see it now. P.S., I still have my very sweet nickel-plated model 19, my first handgun purchase (USED of course....)
 
KM21:

Thank-you for your service, Sir! I appreciate your efforts in making the post. You handled the matter as well as anyone could have, and did not dishonor yourself in the mix. Kudos!

Geno
 
Don't let the guys at Gun Traders bother you as they are first class dicks. How they stay in business with all of the people they have pissed off in this area is beyond me. There's Scheels, Cabelas and Sportsmans Warehouse, all of which offer better service and selection than the tiny independent shops. If you get over Carson City way, look up the Armory in Mound House. Good folks, lots of interesting stuff. Have fun in Reno! BTW, you can open carry a legally possessed pistol if you are 18 in Nevada. It's concealed carry that requires you to be 21 to obtain the permit.
 
You're right, he's right.. if you'd never said anything at all, you'd probably have no reason to have made this post.
Click to expand...

I'd say it's better to dispel the right information about what's legal than to not say anything at all. I haven't heard anyone say that an in-state private sale to someone between 18 and 21 is illegal. That information might be useful to someone in that age bracket interested in owning a handgun.
 
WinchesterAA said:
I hate to sound hypocritical, but in America these days it's probably best to keep most stuff private, IE, you don't talk about it with anyone else. Not even when you're drunk.


At this moment, he probably feels as right as you do. if you'd never said anything at all, you'd probably have no reason to have made this post, though.

It sucks either way you go. You're either cheating yourself out of an opportunity, or burning a bridge.
atleast until the military lets you stop shaving your face that is.

Mum's the word, my friend. You can't trust the average citizen, (Gun store owner, and cops alike) to handle what you're trying to tell them. Often times saying one or two little bitty insignificant words will totally unravel a person's composure.
Click to expand...
I take no pleasure in seconding your comment. Most people now are decent or reserved, and maybe ignorant, but there's 10% who snap at you like a rattlesnake with rabies if you just try to talk to them, and if there's even a HINT that they're wrong. So many people are itching for a fight. People seemed much kinder, calmer, and more intelligent when I was a kid in the 70s. People weren't afraid to impart helpful advice. People are afraid to talk to each other now. They're afraid to give each other helpful information. Everyone is so easily offended. NOW, you run the risk of getting your head bit off, not if you "say the wrong thing," but if you speak to the wrong PERSON. Most people won't reason anymore. They have two modes: attack and ignore. I think we've all been banned from forums for merely privately questioning the wrong moderator and trying to reason with them. Your account is fine, then you send a PM to a moderator where you merely disagree with them and lay out your point of view, then you return later to find your account banned and various insults thrown at you telling you you're not worth talking to. People won't reason anymore. They get furious and think that spending the effort to listen and reason is equivalent to mowing your lawn for you for a year. They think the mere possibility of being wrong is the worst thing on earth, and must be prevented at all costs. They think that listening LEADS to the possibility of being wrong, and therefore won't listen.
 
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I know your frustration, man.

I used to get looks at gun shows and stores when I was a little younger (I'm 20 now, so pretty much the last 5 years) from the guys behind the counter "You're too young to handle that" and "Where are your parents?" My father was always close by but it's annoying when you're the one in the market for a firearm and people automatically dismiss you because of your age.

Heck, amongst my gun buddies, I'm the youngest but I seem to (sadly) know the most.
 
With ~20% national unemployment*, you'd think stores could hire knowledgeable, polite staff.


*The 8% official figure is 'newly unemployed'. People who lose their jobs and don't find work eventually get dropped from the official number, but any discussion of unemployment should include the # of US citizens wanting work.
 
should had kept your mouth closed about your previous purchase of a handgun. Who cares if you had to jump through hoops to get it?
 
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