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Diagnose my CZ barrel; Is this rust or copper?

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Geneseo1911

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May 6, 2005
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I have a P-01 with a barrel that I just can't seem to get clean, and I'm starting to worry it's rusty. I thought it was just some stubborn copper fouling, but I've cleaned it several times with Barnes CR-10 (which was suggested in a previous thread about the problem) and the spots are still there. I wouldn't worry about it if it was just the color, but as the photos show, the barrel has a visibly rough texture. :uhoh:

I just can't hardly believe it would be rust, as I have only shot '08 headstamp S&B, WWB, Speer GD, and Fiocchi Extrema through the gun. It has been cleaned after each firing with Hoppe's (until this last time where I used CR-10), and promptly oiled. I leave the bore wet with oil, as it is sometimes a while between outings. I just don't see where there was an opportunity for rust to set in.

This barrel was cleaned until I couldn't get anything more out of it. My focus was a bit too deep on the last two pictures, but it does show that the roughness extends throughout the entire depth of the bore.

So here's my questions:
1) Is this rust, or copper fouling?
2) What can/should I do about it?

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232323232%7Ffp537%3B7%3Enu%3D333%3A%3E%3A53%3E648%3EWSNRCG%3D339%3B63%3A55%3B336nu0mrj
 
Looks like copper to me.. hard to tell with the picture and the previous cleaning....

What are you using to clean it with?

Something specific for lead or copper fouling or something "generic" Hoppes #9?

Brushes, patches, scotchbrite?
 
get some foaming bore cleaner (for copper fouling) if it comes out blue, its copper... if brown or nothing, rust...

fwiw...looks like rust to me.
 
Sorry I didn't scroll WAY to the right.....

You need to get some copper solvent and a bronze brush. I think it will take care of it.
 
My question is! How old is the barrel and what have you been shooting though it and how much?
 
The gun is '04 production, I bought it new about a year ago. At that time the barrel looked like a new barrel should. The gun probably has about 500 rounds through it, all new, clean factory ammo (see list in OP)

As I mentioned before, on this recent cleaning, I alternated Hoppe's #9 and Barnes CR-10 until patches, wet and dry, came out clean. I brushed with a bronze brush, as well as soft & hard nylon brushes, both soaked and dry. I can't understand why as rough as the barrel looks, I can't seem to get brown or blue color on the patch.
 
Okay try this. Get some Lysol toilet bowl cleaner, yes I am serous, and be very care full to keep it away from all blued surfaces of the gun. Fill the barrel and cap both ends for an hour. Then flush it out with hot water. It has to be Lysol only.

Then take a bronze brush to it with Hoppes # 9 and see what that does for you!

The Lysol T/B Cleaner will also take bluing off a gun if anyone is interested!
 
Flitz. Use a little, and very infrequently, and you'll be fine. I'm assuming that's not a match barrel. ;)
 
Yeah, it looks like copper fouling too me. It looks kind of broken up like you got half of it off already. I would let some good quality copper solvent sit in the barrel for an hour and then resume scrubbing.
Mauserguy
 
Well, I finally got ahold of some foaming bore cleaner as was recommended. Let it sit for 30 min, and the patch came out completely clean, so I'm at a loss. I'm guessing at this point that it is rust, although I can't figure why post-brushing patches don't come out brown, or how it could have happened in the first place.

I haven't noticed any major difference in accuracy since I got the gun, so I guess I'll just stop looking down the bore.
 
It looks like copper to me as well.

I have a S&W m19 that had the same looking stuff an i bought a new bore brush and copper removing past and sat down and scrubed back and forth for 10 min or so and it came out nice and shiny.
 
Get some RemClean and follow the directions on the bottle. Be sure to shake the bottle right before you "dose" your patch or it won't do anything useful at all.
 
Okay, so the new suggestion is a paste-type bore cleaner. JohnKSa has suggested Remington brand. I'm willing to give it a shot as I haven't used the pastes before. So far I've defeated:

Hoppe's 9
Barnes CR-10
Gunslick Foaming Bore Cleaner

Any suggestions other than or supporting Remington 40X?
 
I would go to the nearest hardware store and purchase a small cork that will seal the chamber end; stand the barrel up somehow and, fill until the bore was full clear up to the muzzle with copper/bore solvent.

Let stand a couple of days. Then drain, remove the cork and run a bore brush wrapped in a strip of copper choreboy back and forth about 50 times followed by very tight patches; first sopping wet with solvent and then completely dry.

Repeat if necessary.

If that doesn't work you may need to lapp the bore.

Beyond that I'd just shoot it as long as accuracy was ok and when that begins to suffer...replace the barrel.

Good luck,

TB
 
Fill a tupper container with a mix of Hoppes and some motor oil and let that sucker soak in it over night. That should take care of whatever it is. I have a tupperware full of it and I soak parts in it sometimes. It does a good job.
 
Looks like copper to me.

My advice is to stop worrying about it.
If it's not rust and it's still shooting well then there's no real problem.

Any suggestions other than or supporting Remington 40X?
Click to expand...
I've used it as well as JB Bore Paste.
Both are very similar, but the Rem is a liquid.
They both work well but I prefer the JB because it isn't as messy. Also, I'm not sure if I'm right but the 40X feels like it's more abrasive.

Whatever you do, don't go too crazy with the cleaning.
10 minutes brushing with any metal brush, 100 swipes with an abrasive cleaner (40X, JB, etc), letting a corrosive solvent sit overnight....that's all potentially risky business. You could (I didn't say will) be eating away the life of your barrel.
 
Sitting in motor oil with a little solvent isn't going to hurt your barrel. A car engine sits in oil for 20 years and it doesn't hurt it a bit. I wouldn't soak it in 100% solvent for a long period of time but a barrel is not going to dissolve. I also don't think your going to damage your barrel cleaning it. You'll wear a box full of brass brushes down to a nub before you even put a scratch in the life of a steel pistol barrel. Its not a match grade rifle barrel after all.

I would suggest you try this also.

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=21587/Product/LEWIS_LEAD_REMOVER

This should take out whatever it is. Its probably not a bad idea to have one anyhow.
 
Sorry Jon, I wasn't referring to you.
What you suggested definitely won't do harm.

When I said that, I was thinking about a couple of guys I've known who will let stuff like CR-10 sit in the barrel overnight and keep applying it as it dries.

You'd have to clean a pistol barrel in almost an abusive way before you see any accuracy changes, but still...it's just a warning to not do any possible harm just for the sake of making it perfectly clean. It's just going to get fouled again anyway.
 
I see. Yeah letting solvent evaporate on the surface is definitely not good for the metal and can score the surface. I agree all the way with you in that case.
 
I have a CZ75 SP-01 and started to get some fouling like this in it's barrel. I tried Gunslick Foaming bore cleaner and it helped, some. Got curious and took a dental pick to some of the deposit. Scratched at it just enough to determine that it was hard baked powder fouling and copper. Rather than scrape the entire barrel, like a dental tech would do at a cleaning session for your teeth, I used some Nu-Finish Car Polish which I had recently discovered worked great for this type of fouling. Just wet a patch with the polish, use a jag instead of a patch "loop", and work away at it. The car polish won't damage the barrel as the polishes used are designed to be used on Clear Coat car finishes. You'll be greatly pleased with the results.
 
Personally, if it was my barrel, I'd do nothing. It looks fine to me, certainly nothing worth obsessing about or spending any additional time on.
 
Thanks for the tip amlevin. I haven't worked on this gun in a while, and have been waiting until I placed an order somewhere to get a Lewis Lead Remover before I tried again, but I have some Nu-finish and I might try that.

I also recently bought an ultrasonic cleaner, so I was going to try that as well.

I find that when I have a difficult problem to solve, I have the best results when I set it aside for a while before I try again.
 
up to the muzzle with copper/bore solvent.
Let stand a couple of days.
Click to expand...
Bad advice.
That would run a barrel if you were using some of the high ammonia content copper solvents.

Just get some brand of copper solvent and follow the directions on the bottle.

Easy to do, and the copper will be gone in no time flat..

rc
 
I agree you need to let the solvent sit for awhile, 30 min (what I do) to 1 hour. More than that is probably not a good plan.

You probably have just been putting the solvent on the patch and running it through. It doesn't have enough time in the barrel to work.
 
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