How do you get started? AR?

Hi!
For a first time AR, you will probably want to go with a 5.56mm or .223 caliber AR-15 rifle. (In rifles, the bullets are ranked by caliber versus shotguns which are ranked by gauges). If your goal with it is just plinking, then I would suggest one made by Bushmaster or made by DPMS Panther, both good brands that are on the lower end expense wise.

IMO, 9mm AR's look goofy.

One thing to consider: A .223 round actually penetrates fewer walls than a 9mm. evaluate your surroundings and see what will be around you if you need to deploy your system in the house.

Here's a decent 9mm AR-15 style carbine.


If you want a cheaper alternative but still a 9mm carbine you could get a Kel-tec SUB-2000 or a Hi-point carbine. The Kel-tec comes in different models that can utilize the magazines for other pistols: Glock, Beretta 92, or S&W 59. (off the top of my head, I heard a rumor they were doing SIG mags too).

If you want to go for an AR in a pistol caliber the Lone Wolf Glock lower receiver simplifies things (See here). It uses Glock mags so you don't have to get Uzi or grease gun mags (Not sure how available 10 rounders are in those models). Two things here can happen.

1. You buy a complete lower, nothing else has to be done. Get it shipped to anyone with an FFL and fill out the proper paperwork and any other NY stuff that you need to do
   
2. You buy a stripped lower and then get a lower parts kit and put it together yourself. There are videos out there and I have done this myself. If I can do it without making metal spontaneously combust with my mad Murphy's Law skills any one can. (I was chasing a little spring detent all over the place for almost an hour )

Then search for a 16" barreled complete upper. This is the modular and more affordable way to go if you can't shell out the cash for one in your state or online and have it shipped.

Keep in mind if you use a standard AR-15 you can get conversion kits to use .22 LR ammo as there are .22LR magazines that fit the AR mag well. Not sure if there's a conversion kit for the Lone Wolf lower.

Hope that starts this in the right direction. Remember to check about NY law before buying anything.

Edit to add: For a starter AR-15 check out Del-ton. Pick your style and make mods if you want. They use quality parts and are about on par with Bushmaster quality if you ask me. I've got two, one runs like a top, the other is new so I have about 500-700 more rounds to go through that before I can say anything. Note: that link is for the uppers only, you would need to acquire a lower (stripped or complete) to put those on. Great thing about the AR is you can buy different uppers and they are not considered separate firearms. You just need a complete lower receiver to run them.

Also, sorry about the length and detail, little overloaded on caffeine and B-vitamins at the moment.

He's got a 9mm pistol, he said that.
People on this forum talk a lot about their "Bug-out" or shtf rifles or their tactical guns and stuff-you don't need a rifle thats going to penetrate walls, its irrelevant for just plain range shooting. The OP said that he wants something to plink with.

EDIT: Sorry, I realized I kind of came across as a dick there. Let me rephrase that.
The .223 AR gives off an original vibe. With the AR's, especially probably on gun forums like these, its often that you get a lot of people talking about accessories and house-defense stuff, things that they will never actually use and just seem a bit nerdy talking about.
9mm AR's are fine, I'm sure. There is just kind of a neat feeling shooting a good old .223 AR. The recoil is just right, the sound is great...I guess a lot of it is just opinion really. However, it will most likely be a more accurate round for plinking and range shooting.

if money is low, just get a stripped receiver.

mickeyblueyes said:

Does anybody like the Colt AR ? Law enforcement model.

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Yeah, Colt makes pretty good ARs, they just aren't the only ones and often aren't the least expensive.
Del-Ton makes good ones, and for a very reasonable price too.

Mickey, I just joined the AR club myself. I got started with a Doublestar ($669 from budsgunshop.com), however I was not limited to the regulations from NY. My doublestar is a great plinking gun, and its accuracy actually surprised me. It could be worth looking into seeing if they make NY compliant AR's.

Not sure from your post, but do you have a plinking .22? If not, and this is to be your first rifle, get a .22 for a couple hundred, and work on the basics. By the time you're reasonably proficient, you can save up the amount you spent on a .22 in the first place. You'll also have a better idea of what you want and need in an AR. We can suggest all day, but what works for me or someone else may not work for you.
Good shooting,
RT

The AR-15 will only shoot the intermediate calibers, like 5.56. Moving up to .308 means moving up to the AR10, a two pound heavier rifle with 25 foot pounds more recoil.

In either case, only the import and military surplus ammo is dirt cheap, all quality ammo will run just as much a regular commercial hunting rounds. A lot of berm blasters miss that and discover when they buy a different caliber it's not cheap, as if being in an AR it should get a 50% discount. Their bad.

After that, there is the choice between M16 rifle configuration, or M4 carbine. M4geries are highly popular right now. They don't do some things as well as a rifle, the shorter barrel limits the effective range somewhat. They are also festooned with options most never need. The M4 has parts on it that are compromised to do different jobs for different units and users. The M203 barrel cuts are weak in high volume fire, the Army dropped them. The carbine gas is too short for a 16" barrel, the adjustable stock nice to have but really useless unless you wear body armor. If it has quad rails, it's because different equipment gets used: KAC, the supplier, has said before very few need 48" of rail, and almost nobody loads them up because it makes it a twelve pound hulk. Unless it's a duty gun for an entry team, it's really wannabe, and a good $300 more. It's popular regardless, that's why it's a fad.

The rifle is more accurate, a smoother shooter, and considered more reliable. With an A3 flattop, it can use a lot of optics, and the 20" sight radius with irons is a bit more accurate. It may not look as cool, but it will shoot further.

Self loading gas operated military weapons don't have a lot of different loads, they stick to having a minimum gas pressure, not less, and are considered hot loads for the most part. Shoot full power loads and keep the upper track lubed, the AR will keep functioning as it was intended. It's NOT a show and tell presentation gun, it's a combat machine and just needs mechanical maintenance at normal intervals. Manual action bolt gun rules don't apply, like "fit and finish." It shakes, rattles, and rolls after a few years, but it's still accurate and will take a beating and still keep cycling.

Most importantly, it's a gas piston action - despite what most say. The back of the bolt is the piston head for the gas cylinder that rides in the carrier. Instead of the gas pushing a piston which pushes an operating rod which pushes the carrier which cycles the action, the gas pushes the bolt toward the chamber, and the carrier moves directly to the rear. No extra parts needed, and you have it real easy cleaning the gas cylinder and bolt - which doesn't need more than any other gas piston gun. The Army just wastes your time doing it, because they will sit for months in some cases.

It's one of the most advanced design yet in firearms, the Browning BLR even copies parts of it. Most of the control layout is used in all the newer combat guns because they are in the right place finally. It's a classic that will be around for a hundred years, just like the Winchester 94 was.

If you are interested in AR's the Colts are very, very good. The .223 (5.56) is the most popular caliber (not guage) in the AR platform. The 5.56 will give you more performance than 9mm. The 10 round magazines (not clips) are OK for NY and available through a dealer or online.
There are many options in AR's, but don't overthink it. Stick to a decent manufacturer and buy with confidence. BCM, Spikes, Colt, Smith & Wesson.... any of the aforementioned would provide you a lifetime of reliable service.

I have an A2 version with standard handguards and stock. It seems that people are coming back to this version because it is a nice range rifle and can be used for other purposes. The gas system for a standard rifle is also what the rifle was designed around. I would suggest a Government profile over an HB though if you are not shooting for score. These rifles can be had for a reasonable cost and will suit most people well for plinking. Get an A3 version if you want a dedicated optic. Personally I prefer iron sights on my AR's.

As far as 9mm vs .223 I would suggest a .223 rifle. A standard version in .223 is accurate to minute of bad guy out to 500 yards with iron sights. I believe a 9mm does not hold a candle to the flexibility of .223 for range work.

If you want cheap ammo in a center fire rifle you will want a 5.56mmx45mm (labeled 5.56mm on the box <--click link) chamber. Take note that a 5.56mm rifle can fire the surplus 5.56 as well as .223 Remington (or .223 Rem). If the rifle specifically says .223 rem DO NOT put 5.56 through it, the pressures are higher and you can get a "kaboom" (your gun blows up)


like this:




As far as a stripped receiver, this is what a stripped receiver looks like:



This is essentially the lower half of an AR-15 and the part that the ATF considers the firearm.

If you get one it will have to be transferred/registered as a pistol as there is a pistol configuration you can build with AR-15's. This will have the grip, trigger, fire control group (hammer and mechanism including safety), and the stock attached.

Like I said earlier:

If I can do it without making metal spontaneously combust with my mad Murphy's Law skills any one can.

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Here is what a completed "lower" (lower receiver) looks like:




Building a lower gets complicated only by what kind of grip or stock you want. If you want to keep it simple and relatively cheap I can't say good enough about the Magpul MOE gear (Which is what the stock is on that last picture).

Here is a rifle with an MOE handguard (the barrel shroud, or part your non firing hand will hold) MOE grip and MOE stock put together by Smith and Wesson. The magazine is a PMAG made by Magpul, they are the most reliable magazines out there right now:



I believe the rear sight is an aftermarket Magpul back up sight as well, but I don't think it comes with the rifle. I like the handguard on this one, it's very ergonomic vs the other standard round one.

Again, sorry for the long post

...must have 10 rd clips

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100 round clips - $9.95

Colt, is the standard, by which all other AR brands are judged.

Well, has anyone checked to see if a citizen in the State if New York can even buy any sort of "standard configuration" AR?

OP is state-restricted to 10rd magazines (I'm pretty sure)--which will make a Colt 9mm Carbine probably not possible. But, a LoneStar in 9mm with the well set up for Glock 10rd mags might be possible.

Or not. I seem to remember that a previous NYS poster was having trouble getting an NYS-legal SKS.

What OP might need to do is to browse the Local Gun Stores (LGS as we abbreviate it here) and see what's legal to sell in NYS. Might be that his best best might be an S&W or the Ruger, or the like, off-the-shelf and out-of-the-box.

Which could get complicated, if he catches the AR "bug"--but, we'll know, as we'll get questions on barrel vises; handguard removal tools, BUIS (back up iron sights).

What OP might need to do is to browse the Local Gun Stores (LGS as we abbreviate it here) and see what's legal to sell in NYS. Might be that his best best might be an S&W or the Ruger, or the like, off-the-shelf and out-of-the-box.

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I think I'm in agreement. If you want a pistol carbine look to a hi-point, kel-tec SUB-2000, Ruger Camp Carbine, or Beretta CX4 storm. You would most likely be able to find at least one of those in a local place.

(Oh, look a relatively short post )

W.E.G. said:

100 round clips - $9.95

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It made me lol

It looks like the bullet it seated pretty deep in the cartridge to the right of the rifle. Who makes an AR in that configuration not chambered in 5.56. I'm guessing that was a reloading error.

There is a ton of good AR-15 "TYPE" guns offered under a Bazzzillion diffferent trade names.

Buy forged aluminum lower, and get a top quality parts kit. There is some junk out there on the net as far as parts kits go.

The good stuff will have a nice ground hammer/sear/trigger set
The ones I prefer (stock parts) are DPMS to name one.

The online warehouse sales outfits that dont post a Phone number are in many cases selling junk or rejected parts.

I get Ar's in all the time for issues with doubling and such due to bad hammer/trigger sets.

If you are going try and assemble an entire gun from parts, buy the upper receiver holding fixture (clamps around the receiver and has a plastic plug the goes up the inside where the carrier goes)
Plus buy the universal wrench that can tighten the barrel nuts and the CAR stock nuts.

There is a handy tool kit that has the sight tools as well as the little tool to assist in installing the front takedown pin detent without launching the spring and detent into orbit.

Tape the sides of the redeiver up with two layers of duct tape when driving in the roll pins. Looks ugly when you Mung up the side of a new receiver.

Use a punch designed to pilot the roll pins, it saves a lot of damage and chasing the pins around.

I have little rods that are drilled to allow the roll pins to just sit inside and this allows easy installation.

Have fun

Snowy

A .223 round actually penetrates fewer walls than a 9mm. evaluate your surroundings and see what will be around you if you need to deploy your system in the house.

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No it doesn't.
Here we go again.

I know, you saw this test where a frangable .223 didn't penetrate as well as a FMJ 9mm. Apples and oranges.

Then I'll show you a test where the .223 penetrated 12 sheets of drywall. (That's six walls)

How do you get started? AR?

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Back to topic.
Read this site. It is the best information I ever read before I bought mine.

http://forums.officer.com/forums/showthread.php?81462-So-you-want-to-buy-an-AR-15-huh

Without being too technical, he covers thing I never though about.
Sites like AR-15.com are too advanced for the beginner.

I'd go with a 5.56 for sure.

how about one of the .22lr AR-type rifles?


Smith%Wesson M&P15-22.....

I'm beginning an AR build. I bought a Stag Arms lower and amd going to purchase a kit from Del-ton.

Should right at about $600 total minus Mags.

What about just getting a bargain bin rifle from CMMG?