Guns in the movies

I believe that the barrels are plugged and have an orifice drilled in it to provide the pressure to operate the slide

Most recently I saw a video my boss's son made (he is in college for video editing) and his video was of him shooting a gun, slide moving back and forth, spent shell ejecting, and muzzle flash. This was all done with video editing (and looked real enough to me even though he was in his dorm room) and all he had was a black prop gun that had no moving parts at all. Special effects are getting quite convincing.

Some firearm functions are the result of CGI, some are blank firing gun, and some are flash paper guns. CGI is usually pretty easy to tell and nothing spectacular about that to discuss on this focused forum. Blank firing guns usually have an internal or well shrouded external blank firing adapter. The adapter traps the limited gas from blanks inside to cycle the action almost like a normal round. Flash paper are used for close shooting between actors where blanks can still be dangerous. Essentially they operate similar to cap guns: make a little noise, some flash, shoot some harmless paper out the barrel and CGI takes care of the rest.

If you will look closely at the muzzle you will see that the dia. of the barrel is way less than the round being fired. Adds to the pressure to operate the slide.

I usually end finding flaws with the guns themselves. Like when a gun is empty and the slide is locked back, yet somehow you can hear the hammer drop and click when they try to shoot it. Or when a Glock's trigger is all the way back but the person somehow pulls it to make it shoot. Or when a gun is empty/locked back in one frame, close in the next, THEN a new magazine is inserted...but somehow a round was chambered

Movie guns are heavily modified in multiple ways, and are provided by specialized hollywood armorers. Some fire blanks, some are propane or gas guns that just shoot out huge muzzle flashes.

As noted, in some lower-budget movies (and increasingly in top-tier films) CGI muzzle flash replaces blanks/gas.

We used to make field-expedient blank adaptors for M16s by cutting the bottom off a spent casing, knocking out the remainder of the primer, unscrewing the flash suppresor, placing this little dubisary on the end of the barrel, and screwing the flash suppresor back on. Easy-peasy.

Check out the blank-firing guns offered at www.maxarmory.com. They have small openings to allow muzzle flash, but enough constriction within to build enough back pressure to cycle the slide.

As long as they keep their fingers on the triggers at all times and point the guns straight up in the air while stacking outside a door that's all that really matters.
Oh yeah, and they should rack the slide on their 12 gauges several times prior to shooting.

I'm still looking for a Glock that I can cock the hammer back, just like in the movies...

Most gun action is done post production. With the cheaper movies, they save money by not hiring weapons wranglers and use solid rubber guns or air soft type guns. Like some airsoft, the gun action is powered by a gas cartridge. The flash & bang is added later.

Or that clicks loudly when you pull the trigger when it's empty multiple times

Shotgun sound FXs....

A common weapon/gun forum gripe is the constant use of the shotgun action pump sound effect being used for nearly every gun.
I've seen a few TV shows & action films where a character would do a quick check to see if a firearm is loaded, which makes sense(and is a prudent thing to do) but the "racking" sound when you pull a pistol out or cock the hammer on a revolver is just stupid. :banghead:

As for blanks, Id see; www.imfdb.org . It's very handy.

As posted, in 2014, many studios & producers require the use of CGI(digital FXs) to avoid accidents. Insurance or legal issues may require it too.

I've often wondered why movie producers don't hire technical advisors to educate their actors on gun techniques. Especially those movies that have directors like Stanly Kubrick who was infamous for demanding perfection. Even with R.Lee Ermey there Full Metal Jacket was rife with poor trigger discipline and muzzle awareness.
To me it really takes away from the film when almost every aspect of the movie is mostly accurate but the weapons handling is cliched and sloppy, almost as though the producers feel that weapon related authenticity is completely unnecessary.

Most moviegoers don't care and most movies do not have endless budgets.

The more real firearms & explosive devices are used (opposed to rubber guns, airsofts, CGI) the more it costs the movie budget, and insurance for the movie & stars goes way way up. In practice, actors & stars usually don't want to spend time learning real firearms handling & shooting skills due to time commitment because it won't help them make any more money. -Currently, it is a big Deal that Brad Pitt is training with real soldiers for his next WWII movie, -something he obviously didn't need for filming "Inglorious Basterds".

Most movies make-do with in-house props dept people rather than outside licensed weapons & special effects companies & trainers because of these costs.

I believe the movie was "Contraband". Even in all the high speed action, it showed clearly a blank crimped casing tossed toward the camera. Pretty sure they don't need the old fashioned blank adaptors I remember using.

LT.Diver said:

almost as though the producers feel that weapon related authenticity is completely unnecessary.

Click to expand...

I think that's it right there. And I'll take it a step further: I think a lot of the bad gun stuff is done on purpose.

For many people, all they know about guns is from what they see in TV and movies. So if producers and directors showed guns and gun handling with 100% realism, many people would probably think it was LESS realistic. For example; if a movie showed what a silencer really sounded like (especially a rifle silencer), many people might think it was unrealistic. Or if they showed an actor using a thumbs-forward grip (in my experience, a thumbs-forward grip looks odd to people not familiar with it). Or if they showed how loud guns are (especially when fired indoors). Or if they showed someone getting shot with a shotgun and NOT flying backwards. Or if they showed someone drawing a gun but it didn't make a cocking sound. The list goes on and on.

And the worst offender is the constant finger-on-the-trigger. I'm convinced that producers and directors specifically tell actors to put their finger on the trigger (maybe to look more menacing or something). If you notice, in almost every movie poster and video game cover where the character is holding a gun, they have their finger on the trigger. I think it's too common to just be bad gun handling; after all, many actors get great real-life gun training for certain roles. For example, Tom Cruise got a heck of a lot of training from a former SAS operator for his role in Collateral. But here's a poster for a movie he filmed after that:



I'm convinced they told him to put his finger on the trigger for that picture, because he must know better than to do it on his own.

Also, I remember seeing a Time magazine cover of three soldiers in full combat gear with their fingers on the triggers of their rifles. But that safety rule is greatly emphasized in the military, and especially in the Army and Marine Corps. I'm convinced that the photographer who took that picture instructed the soldiers to put their fingers on their triggers.

With most of today's movies being shot digitally rather than on film, and because of tragedies involving blank cartridges, it has become common to eliminate blank firing entirely, using dummy or deactivated guns and having the muzzle flash and noise added to the digital master in the editing process. The insurance goes sky high if there are operable guns (even blank firing ones) or real cartridges of any kind on the movie set.

If there is a need to do so, slide action can be added in, but in real life a slide won't be seen to move, so why should the movies bother?

Jim

I remember a relatively recent Russel Crowe movie where he had a 12 gauge shotgun, and kept racking the slide as he chased someone as an intimidation.

Of course no shells were ever ejected but if he did that in real life he would have ejected several live shells for absolutely no reason.

Every time I watch "We Were Soldiers" I see more weapon issues. Last night I had never noticed the gunship had mini guns before in Nov. of 1965. We did not have those until later. When I left the aviation unit depicted (A/229) at the end of 67 our D company was still using quad 60's in support.

CWL writes:

I'm still looking for a Glock that I can cock the hammer back, just like in the movies...

Click to expand...

ISSC pistol in .22LR.

http://www.gunblast.com/images/ISSC-M22/DSC09893.JPG

I have a hunch that some of them have the recoil spring replaced with something much lighter. I've seen some pretty frail actors rack the slide with very little effort.

351 WINCHESTER said:

If you will look closely at the muzzle you will see that the dia. of the barrel is way less than the round being fired. Adds to the pressure to operate the slide.

Click to expand...

That is a pretty good indicator. Many 1911s and other .45 in movies or TV are actually 9mm as .45 blanks don't like to behave and 9mm blanks are easier to use.

For some good and realistic firearm scenes look at the Jessie Stone films with Tom Sellick. They are top notch.

Tech advisors.....

Many major films & TV series like Criminal Minds, NYPD Blue, The Unit etc have in fact, highly trained advisors or specialists to train-guide them.
Dale Dye has been an actor & is also a military trainer for several Hollywood hits. Platoon, Saving Private Ryan, Glory, Under Siege.
Former counter-terrorist & Desert Storm combat veteran; Andy McNab taught a few actors & crews about spec ops/weapons.
CSM Eric Haney(US Army, retired) worked on the CBS action series; The Unit. Haney served for many years in SFOD-1(Delta Force).

If you watch carefully in the 1990s era cop drama; Dead Bang, actor Don Johnson's LA County Sheriff's Dept detective shoots a Colt Python .357magnum in a tense scene. Johnson swiftly uses a HKS speedloader in the Python & keeps shooting.
A few actors are highly trained & concerned about proper techniques.