What 1 unarmed citizen did in Baltimore last night..

Let's focus on how we can help educate those close to us and leave politics out of the situation.

Click to expand...

Seems to me politics IS the situation, both for the riots and the defense of victims.

Armed citizen

I can say with firsthand knowledge the police cannot protect you.

In the days after Hurricane Katrina that I and several of my neighbors stood guard at the entrance to our dead end street. And yes we were openly armed with everything from a single shot 12 gauges to an AR15. Only once did any
"undocumented shoppers": venture near and decided to seek shopping elsewhere. In the first five days a police car came by once and the officer did ask if we were ok and told us there was virtually no police protection and we must consider that we had to protect ourselves.

After things got back to normal several people at work who had been mildly anti gun asked me about purchasing a firearm. I referred all to a local range/gun shop where they could get proper training and make a purchase; all of them did and have become converted.

Sniper56 said:

I can say with firsthand knowledge the police cannot protect you.

In the days after Hurricane Katrina that I and several of my neighbors stood guard at the entrance to our dead end street. And yes we were openly armed with everything from a single shot 12 gauges to an AR15. Only once did any
"undocumented shoppers": venture near and decided to seek shopping elsewhere. In the first five days a police car came by once and the officer did ask if we were ok and told us there was virtually no police protection and we must consider that we had to protect ourselves.

After things got back to normal several people at work who had been mildly anti gun asked me about purchasing a firearm. I referred all to a local range/gun shop where they could get proper training and make a purchase; all of them did and have become converted.

Click to expand...

I used to sell home security systems for a living. Most of the calls we got were from folks who had just been burglarized. It sucks that most people wont take proactive steps until its too late.

Not too long ago I was talking with my friend in Watertown MA over facebook messenger and we were talking about guns. I told him that since he's a business owner, he should probably have one and so on and so forth. Moments later I read that a guard at MIT had been murdered. So I showed Chris the story and started listening to the police scanner in that area. (its an app called scanner radio for android devices) As I was listening to the scanner I heard the police talking about Watertown, and Arsenal Street. They were saying two guys were running around with bombs and guns, setting off explosives and whatnot. My whole family on my fathers side is from Watertown and that place is only 4 square miles. I immediately called my uncle who still lives there and told him what was going on. (if you haven't caught on yet it was the boston matathon bombers) Mind you, none of these people I spoke with own firearm, Effectively the only option they had was to stay in their homes in fear. Even if these occurrences are rare, their still reason enough for me to always have a firearm.

The police cannot protect you. They will not protect you. And they also have no legal liability to help you.

I know we all have the means to protect ourselves here on THR. But we should do what we can to educate people and show them that guns aren't only for murder. They're for self defense, and FUN

So whenever you get the opportunity I urge you to bring a newbie with you to the range! You never know, it could save a life!

Definitely stands to reason that if the police are all tied up protecting the downtown area, it is quite impossible to protect the homeowners at the same time. Looks to me that the criminal element was looking for a reason to loot and destroy, and they got it.

Definitely stands to reason that if the police are all tied up protecting the downtown area, it is quite impossible to protect the homeowners at the same time.

Click to expand...

Not that they're out defending homeowners at other times anyway. That's not the way policing works, and I think we all understand that. However, the fact that some police were in these various crummy "hotpots" watching the looters doesn't seem to mean that any criminals took advantage of that distraction to go bother homeowners in other parts of town.

In other words, stay out of the slumland public/retail spaces where the looters are busting things up, enjoy a nice night in with the family and you're REALLY unlikely to have your evening disturbed.

Sniper56 said:

I can say with firsthand knowledge the police cannot protect you.

In the days after Hurricane Katrina that I and several of my neighbors stood guard at the entrance to our dead end street. And yes we were openly armed with everything from a single shot 12 gauges to an AR15. Only once did any
"undocumented shoppers": venture near and decided to seek shopping elsewhere. In the first five days a police car came by once and the officer did ask if we were ok and told us there was virtually no police protection and we must consider that we had to protect ourselves.

After things got back to normal several people at work who had been mildly anti gun asked me about purchasing a firearm. I referred all to a local range/gun shop where they could get proper training and make a purchase; all of them did and have become converted.

Click to expand...

There was a detailed accounting in a book (Thank God I Had A Gun - I think it was this or a Massad Ayoob book) about Katrina. Scary stuff when lawmen were scant. At the very least one should have a single firearm in the home, just in case. I don't think those who dislike guns think the whole situation through to the end of a what if situation. I have tried this with those friends of mine who dislike guns and it doesn't seem to help in the abstract. It seems to take something happening near their home for it to be real to them.

Sheepdog1968 said:

There was a detailed accounting in a book (Thank God I Had A Gun - I think it was this or a Massad Ayoob book) about Katrina. Scary stuff when lawmen were scant. At the very least one should have a single firearm in the home, just in case. I don't think those who dislike guns think the whole situation through to the end of a what if situation. I have tried this with those friends of mine who dislike guns and it doesn't seem to help in the abstract. It seems to take something happening near their home for it to be real to them.

Click to expand...

At the risk of repeating myself, city people run around secure in the mistaken knowledge that should evil come to visit "someone" will come to save them. While born in a city I was raised in the country where I learned in practice that when the animal by-product hits the air conditioning there ain't nobody to save you but yourself. You can prepare for the evil beforehand or submit to it afterward. There are no Men in Black, there are no GhostBusters, there is no Starship Enterprise, just you and whatever you have on hand.

627PCFan said:

Prayed and stood guard..unarmed

Didnt want to derail another thread so made this one.

I have a college buddy that I keep in touch with pretty regular who post graduation stayed in Baltimore. Over the years hes expressed an interest in guns because of the "cool" factor (Watches alot of tv) despite the fact hes ex military. Hes a big time anti2a along with his wife who will not even spend the night at my house because I have guns. He now has a family of 4 and lives about 3/4 Miles north of the action last night. I got a text from him just after the fires started and told me he was scared for their welfare. Jokingly I asked him if he had his Glock at the ready (He mentioned he wanted one 2 years ago and half heartedly hoped he got one without my knowledge) He replied "I wish I had one now, I'm really scared and there's nothing I can do"

I had some more convos with him today and told him he learned a lot last night since he stayed up all night. Hes asked about how to get a handgun Post O'Malley and I had walk him through the steps. Hes not happy but he had no problem when he voted for that candidate...you reap what you sow.

Click to expand...

If rioting and looting are taking place within 3/4 mile of where I live and I have a wife and children I am gone. If I have the means to defend my home and property and a few willing neighbors then I remain but rest assured my wife and the children are gone. So unarmed your friend decided what? That he should remain home when he was 3/4 mile from major rioting and looting?

The decision to own a gun is a personal decision. I was enjoying the shooting sports long, long before owning a gun to defend one's self or personal property was ever thought of.

Been exchanging emails today with a good friend I was in the Marine Corps with. He sent me a picture of himself holding his AK and a pile of loaded magazines. He lives about 9 to 10 miles from what was going on and was not overly concerned. Your friend was 3/4 mile from the riots? May I ask where he lives? The inner city areas where the rioting happened are not exactly middle class residence neighborhoods, more like Fort Apache Baltimore even on a good day.

Politics and Maryland gun laws have nothing to do with it. My friend is a happy gun owner, enjoys shooting and lives in the Baltimore suburbs. Your friends decision to not own a gun is just that, his decision.

Ron

Ron

An interesting account of an encounter with a riot when unarmed.

http://www.seraphicpress.com/jew-without-a-gun/

Officers'Wife said:

At the risk of repeating myself, city people run around secure in the mistaken knowledge that should evil come to visit "someone" will come to save them. While born in a city I was raised in the country where I learned in practice that when the animal by-product hits the air conditioning there ain't nobody to save you but yourself. You can prepare for the evil beforehand or submit to it afterward. There are no Men in Black, there are no GhostBusters, there is no Starship Enterprise, just you and whatever you have on hand.

Click to expand...

Some of us city people get it, usually those of us who have had the experience of waiting for the police to show up while something bad is happening.

city people run around secure in the mistaken knowledge that should evil come to visit "someone" will come to save them.

Click to expand...

The city people I've known, and certainly those of specific classes/races, had no illusions that anyone was going to come save them, from anything.

It is a good idea not to paint with a very broad brush.

A couple of Federal court decisions have ruled police have no duty to protect you unless you are in custody. That "To Serve and Protect" painted on the side of the cars is a nice saying, just not reality.

I was enjoying the shooting sports long, long before owning a gun to defend one's self or personal property was ever thought of.

Click to expand...

You must be over 400 years old.

TimSr said:

You must be over 400 years old.

Click to expand...

I think he meant before he ever thought of it for himself.

Timsr

Thanks, for a great chuckle. Still laughing!

Best advice to anyone living in Baltimore today,is pack up everything you still have and move away quickly.

Best advice to anyone living in Baltimore today,is pack up everything you still have and move away quickly.

Click to expand...

Why?

There is no credible danger to citizens' lives or homes at this point. And outside of a very few spots, 99% of the city has suffered no damage whatsoever due to this little tempest in a teapot.

HexHead said:

A couple of Federal court decisions have ruled police have no duty to protect you unless you are in custody.

Click to expand...

And we know how well protected you are while in prison custody.

Another perspective: Any time I see protests in US turn violent I just can't believe how terribly under-equipped the cops are. Most of their riot gear is entirely unable to protect them against stones and other objects being thrown. Then of course these under-equipped cops let the rioters have the streets - because it is either get out of the way or get wounded for them (or shoot, which is not an option, as it should not be). And then comes the cavalry equipped for downtown Kabul.

Anyway, as was said above, No. 11 post nails it.

TimSr said:

You must be over 400 years old.

Click to expand...

No I am 65 years old, born in 1950 in NYC. My formative years were the late 50s and early 60s. Home defense was when someone kept a loaded 12 gauge shotgun by the door or in a bedroom. Most people never bothered because there was no real threat. The riots of the late 60s were not happening yet and really life was much simpler. You did not own an AR because there were no ARs. There was no CCW because nobody really gave it much thought.
The "shooting sports" consisted of going to a range and shooting targets and going hunting Upstate NY. You didn't worry about defending your home, property or your life because nobody was looking to take any of those things from you.
Today? Not so much. You don't need to be 400 years old to remember when things were simpler.
While many will disagree my post #11 is simply how I saw things and see things today. Nope, not 400 years old.

Ron

All I can tell people is very seldom do gun people turn anti-gun. It is not uncommon for anti-gun folk to get it - all of a sudden.

I live in surburbs of NOLA 95% of what you hear about what happened after Katrina is fiction. I am not saying things didn't happen. But there were things that I had first hand knowledge of that didn't happen the way people who were not here claimed. Some folks that were here were full of it.

"At the risk of repeating myself, city people run around secure in the mistaken knowledge that should evil come to visit "someone" will come to save them. While born in a city I was raised in the country where I learned in practice that when the animal by-product hits the air conditioning there ain't nobody to save you but yourself. You can prepare for the evil beforehand or submit to it afterward. There are no Men in Black, there are no GhostBusters, there is no Starship Enterprise, just you and whatever you have on hand."

Stereotypical for the most part. The people they put on the news are mostly the helpless. But then maybe people here are way more resourceful than where you are talking about. Probably more of a problem for those used to being babysat by the gov't. There are a lot of city folk that are just as tough as anybody else. Many of them came from the country.

The problem is in a riot nobody can handle it from a civilian perspective. If an individual or group had to use force to protect themselves from violence I am fairly certain they would have a whole bunch of problems running downhill on them. I would venture to say they would be scapegoats for every group that was involved.

There does seem to be a different vibe about the Baltimore riot in many aspects from the little I have seen of it.