Reloading 38 special with 158 gn RNL over 4.4 gn Unique. About 25 % of cases seem to shave some lead off the bullet. Micrometer on case and bullet dimension shows case 0.376-0.379 OD, bullet measures 0.357-0.358 OD. Completed rounds fit case gauge and chamber in S & W Bodyguard 38 spl just fine. Does not happen in any other caliber with RNL. Checked and rechecked sizing dies. Anybody else having this lead shaving issue?
158 gn RNL 38 spl 0.358
- Thread starter dadpig
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And chamfer the inside of the case mouth. It takes off the square edge of the inside of the case mouth and it will help reduce bullet shaving.
This is pretty much a one time thing until you trim your cases, if you trim your cases.
This is pretty much a one time thing until you trim your cases, if you trim your cases.
ArchAngelCD
Member.
The outside dimensions of the case doesn't effect the bullet being shaved. Like said above, you are not belling the case mouth enough.
You can do what I did and expand using a Lyman "M" expander. It doesn't overflare, yet opens the mouth of the case to readily accept the base of the bullet to avoid shaving lead bullets
RealGun
Member
I think any expander, whether a PTX or an expander die, will solve this problem with adjustment for more flare. The M die, for me, simply helps make the bullet stand straight for seating.
There is another issue, and that is that the die set may not be a good choice for lead, at least the expander function, expecting .357 instead of .358. I use a Cowboy expander to get another .001 of case neck diameter. Things go much easier that way. Problem is the expander plug will stick if you don't also have a Cowboy sizer. I find the standard Lyman die set to be very close to the RCBS Cowboy dimensions. Either one works okay, and the cases don't have so much of a bullet imprint like a stuffed sausage. If you are going to load lead, get dies for lead. You have to check bullet diameters too, but you already did that.
There is another issue, and that is that the die set may not be a good choice for lead, at least the expander function, expecting .357 instead of .358. I use a Cowboy expander to get another .001 of case neck diameter. Things go much easier that way. Problem is the expander plug will stick if you don't also have a Cowboy sizer. I find the standard Lyman die set to be very close to the RCBS Cowboy dimensions. Either one works okay, and the cases don't have so much of a bullet imprint like a stuffed sausage. If you are going to load lead, get dies for lead. You have to check bullet diameters too, but you already did that.
ljnowell
Member
I do not trim handgun brass of any caliber. I never have and probably never will.
There are issues that come with that, and you may be experiencing one of them. If you have the one case in four(in your case) that is just a hair shorter it will not flare as much and will have issues with shaving lead. It will also not have as firm of a crimp.
There are issues that come with that, and you may be experiencing one of them. If you have the one case in four(in your case) that is just a hair shorter it will not flare as much and will have issues with shaving lead. It will also not have as firm of a crimp.
Average Joe
Member
Not enough belling of the case, like others have said, check your expander die.
ArchAngelCD
Member.
What makes the Lyman M die so good? What does it do that other dies don't do? Are the Redding dies good too? How is the M die used in conjunction with the other dies?
The "M" die is an expander.
The difference is that instead of expanding with a constant flare, the first part of the plug expands the case to the desired final dimensions, then there is a step that forms a "pocket" to receive the tail of the bullet. The sides of the pocket are parallel with the sides of the case.
The difference is that instead of expanding with a constant flare, the first part of the plug expands the case to the desired final dimensions, then there is a step that forms a "pocket" to receive the tail of the bullet. The sides of the pocket are parallel with the sides of the case.
Here's the illustration that convinced me
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...and here is a comparison with a RCBS expander
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[resize=400]
[/resize]...and here is a comparison with a RCBS expander
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[/resize]Schwing
Member
I bought one to do 9mm and won't go back. It completely eliminates bullet shaving. For me, my 9mm slugged at .358 so trying to stuff a .359 bullet into a case belled by a traditional expanding plug just didn't work. Not only does it eliminate shaving but it gives the bullet a micro sized ledge to sit on so it is almost guaranteed to go in straight every time.
beag_nut
Member
One more good thing about the expander die previously mentioned several times: for me, it reduces splits at the case mouth.
FWIW; and K.I.S.S. Basically, a case is a hole, and a bullet is a peg. For a peg to enter a hole, it must be smaller than the hole. So, if your bullet "shaves" during seating, the case mouth is smaller than the bullet and the edge of the case "shaves" lead from the bullet. The case needs to have the mouth opened up to accept the bullet. Whichever method you choose (M die, Lee powder through die, dedicated flaring/expanding die, punch, or bottle necked case), more flare is needed...
ArchAngelCD
Member.
Thank you everyone, those explanations and illustrations wee very clear.
Last questions, you still use the full length sizing die and then the M die, correct? I would eliminate the Lee powder through expander? Does any company sell a powder through die without an expander? (or can I adjust the Lee die not to expand while still dropping a full charge?
I feel like a new reloader here, this is all foreign to me...
Thanks again, I think a few new dies are in my future! LOL
Last questions, you still use the full length sizing die and then the M die, correct? I would eliminate the Lee powder through expander? Does any company sell a powder through die without an expander? (or can I adjust the Lee die not to expand while still dropping a full charge?
I feel like a new reloader here, this is all foreign to me...
Thanks again, I think a few new dies are in my future! LOL
RealGun
Member
Since the case activation of the powder drop relies upon the caliber specific PTX. just adjust it so it doesn't flare, only expands. The M die plug is .001 larger generally, plus the mouth of the case is expanded even more, no harm done to expand in two levels. Note that the expander plug can be a bit sticky, because the preceding dies were designed for bullets .001 smaller.
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