1851 Confederate Navy

Status
Not open for further replies.

rhoggman

Member
Joined
Oct 22, 2008
Messages
368
I am the happy recipient of a Pietta 1851 Confederate Navy. I purchased this from Cabela's on sale for $119 with an additional $20 off coupon, making this a $99 gun before taxes and shipping. Basically it ended up being $114 to get this thing on my front porch. Cabela's also threw in a presentation case for free, but this was backordered so I have no idea when it will show up.

I have been really excited about this purchase, and have been doing a lot of black powder research on the internet for the last week or so. Naturally I wanted to open it right away, and did not expect much in the area of fit and finish. I figured, "how nice could it be for this price?"

Other sub-$200 firearms that I have purchased (new and used) have not been extremely impressive in the looks department. Consequently, I was blown away when I removed this BP pistol from it's packaging. It makes the Heritage Rough Rider look like scrap iron, and contends with the visual quality I am used to with S&W revolvers. I swear to God I bought a brand new model 60 that I picked excess metal off of between the frame and barrel.

Something else that really impressed me was the cylinder lock up. At full cock the cylinder is rock solid. I have not fired it, but have manually worked the action without letting the hammer fall onto the nipple, and by god the trigger is even smooth.

If this thing fires the way it looks I guarantee more will show up on my doorstep. A crystal ball tells me another will be on the way soon. Maybe before the sale is over:)

I bought .451 & .454 round ball and Goex fffg. Seemed liked there was alot of mixed preferences for ball size. The manual calls for .454, and has a min/max BP load of 12-15 grains. Cabela's recommends no more than 25 grains in there custom insert????

Nevertheless, I am thrilled with this. I have a strange feeling that BP shooting is going to be a hoot. I have already thought about ordering beeswax, & mutton tallow, but have not fired my first ball downrange:evil:
 
The apparent dichotomy in recommended loads has started many threads on this and other forums. Your gun has a brass frame; the 25 grain load is the absolute maximum you should use repeatedly as brass frames can wear prematurely under repeatedly heavy loads. Understand that your gun is safe with any load you can manage to stuff in the chambers, but that brass frame will not like being abused.

We often hear about the bad examples; it's nice to have someone point out the good ones. Pietta has really improved their products in the last few years. But, making generalizations from one example can be, well, a bit dangerous. The next one might be from the other end of the spectrum.
 
Be careful on that tight lockup. Pietta's often come from the factory with a bolt that is larger than the slots on the cylinder. It will rapidly peen the cylinder slots. Check yours out and if it is indeed larger, then you'll need to file off a bit to get a better fit. I wanna say take it off of the left side of the bolt, but don't take my word right now. I'm not at home. I've got the instructions on how to do it on my home computer. Look back tomorrow night, I should be back home by then.
 
The past few Pietta's I have handled have been bank vault tight lock up. A good starting load would be in the 16-18 gr area. I personally would nor exceed 22-23 grs as a max load for a .44.
These cap and ball revolver can become very additive.
 
I bought the same pistol a month ago and am just as happy with it. You'll also enjoy the presentation box. It's far nicer than most "free" things. I have a Uberti 1858 Army Conversion which uses .45 long colts (when I can find them) and have just ordered the 1858 BP Police .36 from Cabelas. BY the way, I swapped the original 1851 nipples for stainless steel and was pleased with the way the nipples came out of the cylinder. I had read horror stories, but had no problem at all, using a ratchet steel nipple wrench (from the Possible Shop). The gun had of course been fired before shipping and a couple of the nipples concealed some pretty good corrosion/gunk. You might remove your and clean things up a bit or replace the nipples altogether with something a little better.
 
becarefull with those roundballs. as mentioned here before most pietta 1851 take .451 only. if you try to press in a .454 round ball it may get stuck and you will end up bending the arm just trying to get it in. or you will have to remove the cylinder and dump the powder and hit it out from behind.
 
I believe that the above statement is incorrect. I have used .454 balls in a Pietta Confederate Navy .44 before, no issues whatsoever. The balls are soft lead, just use .454s. They perform better. The .451s are undesized for the barrel.
 
Hey, guys. You both have been around long enough to know that these guns vary quite a bit from specimen to specimen; what works for one may not apply to another. For sure we all know that generalizations don't apply.

Measure the chambers and the bore. Then you'll know for sure what applies to your gun.
 
451 v 454

I've been happy with .451 round balls in my 1851 Navy (Pietta). Have never used .454 so I can't comment on them.
 
I have a Pietta 1851 brass frame sold by EMF I'm surprised that both Pietta's manual and EMF pamplet list only a .454 ball the powder charge is Pietta 12-15 grs FFFg EMF 22 gr FFFg max 30 FFFg which to me is a tad stout, while 12-15 okay for brass but steel frame I'd step it up a little.
 
I got a pair while they were on sale and agree with your assessment. Good finish, a precise feel, even decent wood in the grips. Haven't been able to get to the range with them yet, lousy weather, but the range reports I've seen said they were sweet and accurate. If I recall, the best results came with a powder charge in the low 20 grain range but that's going by memory. The display cases are nice, much better than I expected.

Jeff
 
If this thing fires the way it looks I guarantee more will show up on my doorstep

Mine sure didn't... I only shot a few cylinders out of it and after having it jam with 2-3 shots left a few times it went back...I don't like hammering on loaded guns
 
You might want to consider adding some filler to the chambers, as you'll bottom out on the loading lever before properly compressing a 20 grain load. Now, I know lots of people shoot these using just the powder and no filler, but that isn't necessarily the best way to go with these brass-framed guns; I should know, I've had mine for over twenty years. Add 10- 15 grains of Cream of Wheat or Instant Grits after the powder and before the ball to assure positive compression, no gaps 'twixt powder and ball, and to move the ball closer to the forcing cone.
 
I am jealous. I just bought one of the .44 caliber sweethnearts and they didn't give me a presentation case...just the crummy cardboard box it shipped in!! Oh well I got some nice oakboards to build a pretty box out of, that could be fun. Don't know if I will ever shoot this gun, but who knows? Got a .36 CVA revolver kit that looks a lot like this one without the bluing but I like the raw metal look. I'm still working on this one. I remember back in the 1970's when I could have bought these brass framed replica's for between $25 to 35 any day of the week. Could kick myself for not buying 4 or 5 of themback then.
Paul
 
Paul,
The display case had to be asked for specifically when the order was placed. If I hadn't been alerted to that, I wouldn't have known. I don't think there was anything in the product description about the case. I ordered before Christmas and they were back ordered. Mine came last week. I don't know if the offer is still available.

Jeff
 
mykeal said:
Measure the chambers and the bore. Then you'll know for sure what applies to your gun.

+1
The manufacturers recommendations are a starting point and not cast in stone. The only way to know for certain is the measure the chamber. Personally I use .454's in my .44 Pietta's as .451's are just a tiny bit small. They shave a ring but not much of one.
 
scrat

becarefull with those roundballs. as mentioned here before most pietta 1851 take .451 only. if you try to press in a .454 round ball it may get stuck and you will end up bending the arm just trying to get it in.

Wonder if that is why when Colts introduced the belt sized 44 they also introduced a new ram system. Perhaps they realized the old style did not work? Could be why Colts never made a 44 caliber 1851.
 
I have fired plenty .454 balls from my '51 Confederate Navy with no problems whatsoever... That particular size of ball results in a nice ring of lead being shaved off the ball, ensuring a tight fit. The box of .451 balls I purchased initially for the pistol were so loose that no ring was shaved off. I have NEVER had a ball attempt to jam in the pistol when loading... To the OP, Congratulations on your purchase!!!
 
Wonder if that is why when Colts introduced the belt sized 44 they also introduced a new ram system. Perhaps they realized the old style did not work? Could be why Colts never made a 44 caliber 1851.

The .44s were holster pistols. The Navies were the belt pistol. What we now know as the 1860 Army was introduced in 1860 as the 'New Model Holster Pistol" or "New Model Army Pistol", replacing the Improved Model Holster Pistols (Dragoons). The 1861 Navy that was introduced around the same time was known as the "New Model Belt Pistol" or "New Model Navy Pistol". Both were improvements on the pistols currently in service. When the 1860 came out; Colt ceased manufacture of the 'Dragoons'; but, the '61 Navy never really caught on, and demand for the '51 Navy continued till it was discontinued in 1873.

Colt did make a 44 cal 1851 - it was the 1860 Army. The .36 cal barrel for the Navy was too small to bore out to .44; so, when the the '51 frame was redisigned to mount a .44 cal rebated cylinder, the barrel also got redesigned into a rounded profile with the improved creeping loading lever. Some of the first 1860s produced had 'Navy sized' grips and full fluted cylinders. The Navy grips and fluted cylinders could also be special ordered for the 1860s.
 
Last edited:
Thanks for all the input. I believe I will be shooting this weekend if the weather permits. I have everything I need except some sort of flask for the black powder. Need to come up with a substitute until the one I ordered arrives. Any suggestions?
 
I just bought an 1851 Navy in .36 caliber for $70 shipped from a member on another forum. I can't wait to get it in my hands.
 
"Thanks for all the input. I believe I will be shooting this weekend if the weather permits. I have everything I need except some sort of flask for the black powder. Need to come up with a substitute until the one I ordered arrives. Any suggestions? "

Do you have a set of Lee dippers? I'd reckon a 1.0 cc dipper would give you a good starting load. That would throw approx 18 grains. Then you could work up a bit 'till you find what your gun is happiest with.

A syringe makes a good measure also. They're usually marked in 1CC increments.

Send me a pm with your e-mail in it, and I'll attach the "Tuning the Pietta" article and send it back to you.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top