1911: 4" vs. 5"

[natedog]

Does the extra 1" of a 5" 1911 offer ANY velocity advantage over the 4"? What about accuracy? Does the slightly shorter sight radius affect accuracy? What about concealibility (sp?)? Are the 4" models offer very much of an advantage over the 5" models for, say, IWB carry? What about weight differences? Which do you prefer?

 

[stans]

You do lose a little velocity by dropping to a 4 or 4 1/4 inch barrel, on average about 30 to no more than 50 feet per second. Any time you decrease sight radius you make a gun harder to shoot accurately, but honestly I have seen little difference between Government models and Commanders. The slightly shorter barrel is easier to conceal, especially if you are not particularly tall.

 

[1911Tuner]

re:

Ditto what stans said. The shorter sight radius won't make any difference
except on paper targets at a distance outside of typical defensive range.
Across a room, it will hardly matter. The Commander-length 1911 offers
the advantage of being a shade quicker out of the leather, which can
be the deciding factor in a kill or be killed situation. The slight velocity
loss won't mean anything either, unless the hollowpoint bullet that is used is marginal in its expansion reliability. A 200-grain bullet would regain the
lost velocity, and is what I consider to be the best compromise for
functional reliability. I don't care for the 185-grain loadings in the caliber
due to the timing/recoil impetus factor.

Luck!

Tuner

 

[stans]

I have never been impressed with 185 grain bullets in 45 ACP either! 200 to 230 grains seems to be optimum for reliability and accuracy in the 45 ACP. I see little need for +P in this caliber as well.

 

[M2 Carbine]

nate,

You asked about 4 or 5 inch barrels in the 1911 pistols.
I have several but I really like the three inch barrels the best.

And of the 1911's I have, I like my 3, 3 inch Kimbers the best.

I do a little 50 yard plinking for the fun of it.
So to answer your question about accuracy, I just took my 3 inch Tactical Ultra ll into the back yard to see what it will do.
The TU is my carry gun.

I fired a couple magazines to see where my reloads were hitting.
These aren't my best loads but they are usually OK for 25 yards.
I heard one that sounded like it may have been a little light on powder.

As it turns out the fixed sights are right on at 50 yards.

I sat on a bench with my feet in a chair and rested the pistol on my knees.
It's not real steady but it beats standing, offhand.

The paper is 8x11 inches.
The target is a scaled down from the Texas CHL 15 yard qualification target.

The 3 inch Kimber does OK.
The 4 or 5 inch should do better, right.



BTW, this is my backyard range.

 

[natedog]

Cool, thanks. Which would you reccomend for general range use, and a HD pistol (not CCW)? Still the 3"? I've heard 2 schools of thought- 1) Just go for the 5"- the 4" isn't that much easier to conceal, and you loose sight radius and 2) The 5" is too difficult to conceal, and the 4" doens't loose much (if any) performance for practical operations.

 

[M2 Carbine]

nate,
One of my Kimbers is a 4 inch, all steel, fixed sights, lower cost (about $600) excellent gun.

A friend shot it a couple weeks ago and couldn't get over how well it shot.

For your use I'de get a 4 inch barrel, steel gun.
As has been said, the 4 inch will do anything the longer barrel will do and it is small enough to be a good carry gun and big enough to be a good defense gun.
I think the 4 inch is a perfect size for an all around gun.

(I favor the 3 inch because for me carry is number one and everything else is number two)

I'm sure some of the other brands have some good guns, maybe with a lower price but I don't own any Springfields, etc so I can't give you any suggestions.

 

[1911Tuner]

Short Pistols

Beware of 1911-based pistols with barrels shorter than Commander-length...(4.25 inches) The tend to be a mite persnickety. Some hit the ground runnin'...Some need a bit of the ol' tweak...Some will drive ya 'round the bend before they'll run...:banghead:

Anyways...That's my story, and I'm stickin' to it

Luck!

Tuner

 

[M2 Carbine]

Tuner,

The only 3 inch 1911's I've been involved with have been the 7 or 8 Kimbers that a couple friends and I have and they have been 100% right out of the box.

Well, actually 99%.
Of all things our two Ultra Eclipse ll wouldn't feed hardball at first. They would feed SWC, JHP, etc but not a regular hardball round. (the guns were very tight)
After a couple hundred rounds of mixed ammo the guns got over this weirdness and now would probably function with a brick if it would fit in the magazine.

Do you know of any 3 inch barrel brand names, in about the $400 to $500 range that are reliable?

Or 4 inch?

 

[George Hill]

I've had a number of small .45 1911's and they have all run for me just fine. I did have one that didn't like hollow points... but then again, I've had several 1911 Governments that didn't liek them either.

 

[1911Tuner]

Reliable Shorties

Howdy M-2,

I've heard good reports on the Colt Defenders. I'd be leary of a .45
caliber pistol with a ramped barrel. The ramp only has to be a little off on the angle or the height to cause feeding problems, especially with longer rounds like hardball...maybe the cause of George's experience.

If a 5-inch gun doesn't like hardball, it's time to look at the possibility of a stem bind. Also a slightly long link with the barrel riding the link around the front radius of the lower lug.

They've come a LONG way since the first Officer's Models...Those things
were positively evil. They still can be a little tricky, and it varies from
pistol to pistol. Some run...Some don't, and it's usually a matter of hitting
the sweet spot on the recoil spring rate and the extractor tension. The
shorter, lighter slides don't have the momentum to get the rim under the hook unless the extractor is juuuust right...and going to a stouter recoil spring usually brings on other issues.

I know a guy who has 3 chopped pistols, and they all run fine. Some guys have all the luck. Right here on the forum, there's an old coot who runs
around with red-headed cheerleaders!

Another friend of mine bought 4 before he found one that he trusts for carry.

Good news is that with the ones that do have problems, the warranty usually takes care of it. The downside is being without your pistol until they do. Rule one: Have a backup.

Luck!

Tuner

 

[ruger357]

I had a 3 inch and I had a 4.25 inch 1911 but I have two 5 inch 1911's. I favor the longer sight radius.

 

[happyguy]

I agree with Tuner that a 4 incher will be a little quicker out of the leather, but the leather itself will likely be a bigger factor in getting the gun on target quickly.

Some holsters are WAY FASTER than others and it's a design thing. There are some really slow high quality holsters out there.

I have borrowed a friends Commander and have found that the GM conceals better for me. The extra length somehow seems to cause the butt to press more tightly against my side.

But I'm still thinking about that new S&W Scandium Commander.

Regards,
Happyguy