1911 and hydra-shoks feeding issue

[ghettofab]

Hello all
I'm the proud owner of a Springer mil-spec with some light customization all done myself. Beavertail, trigger, hammer, spray and bake finish, bushing and feed ramp polish. I love my weapon, but when I took it out the other day to run some hydra-shoks thru it, it choked. With a Wilson 47D mag no less. First two fed fine and then cha-chunk! Didn't return to battery. Seemed as tho the edge of the jacket hung up on the very edge of the bbl. throat. This ammo has been around for a while and every round has been chambered once or twice or 5 times, so is it possible that my ammo has deformed and is the culprit? Thanks all.

 

[kingpin008]

It's possible, but also keep in mind that no matter what mods are done to a 1911, th fact remains that it is a pistol designed to only feed reliably with ball ammo and you may continue to have problems. I am aware that some manufacturers are now doing throat jobs and polishing straight from the factory to help alleviate this problem in their guns, but it seems to me that nothing will work 100% in making ammo that the gun was not designed for feed reliably.

I'd say try some different brands of hollow points, and see which work best in your 1911. Or, get your hands on some EFMJ from (I think) Federal and see how those do. They've got the same profile as standard ball ammunition, but they still expand upon impact.

 

[glockman19]

it is a pistol designed to only feed reliably with ball ammo and you may continue to have problems.

YES you may continue to have issues with the amo. It's OK to use BAll ammo for SD.

 

[Walkalong]

All this "1911's can only feed ball ammo" every time a feed faliure is mentioned in various threads makes my stomach hurt. :banghead:

 

[Black Majik]

Regardless of pistol platform, it's usually advisable to test out any defensive ammo you have the intention of using primarily for this purpose. Some guns, such as the 1911 platform are finicky with JHP ammo. It's just a good idea to try out a couple manufacturer's JHP to see which runs best in your gun.

You might have two, lets say... Kimbers. Both are Custom IIs, one might eat Gold Dots all day, and the other might hate it while preferring Golden Sabers. It's good to find out your particular pistol doesn't like the Hydrashoks, now try out a different JHP ammo.

I had someone try Hydrashock ammo in his Springfield Loaded, jammed a few times. Ran it through my tighter PII with no problems. So, all guns are different. They have different preferences, different personalities. Some are picky about what they eat, others eat everything and anything given to them.

I think it's the ammo. Try some other JHP ammo.

 

[ugaarguy]

With a Wilson 47D mag no less.

Try a current production Colt, Kimber, or Springfield 7 round mag with flat dimple follower. I've seen myself, and 1911 Tuner has also written in volume about, that 1911s are more magazine sensitive than ammo sensitive. Search his thread "Magazine Observations" in the Gunsmithing sub-forum here for a detailed explanation.

1911s will feed JHPs.

 

[Linkinlog]

How many rounds do you have through the gun?

Most say you should wait until after the 500 round break-in to start using JHP. I'm at the 600 mark with mine but haven't tried any...yet. It's just my range gun so I don't really have a need to spend the money on JHP ammo.

If you are past the break in period, I would try using other brands of JHP and see which one your gun likes.

 

[ghettofab]

thanks for the replies

My pistol came to me second-hand, stock except for grips, drop-in beavertail, and hammer. Judging from the frame contours, I'd say mine is pre '97, and probably has many thousands of rounds thru it. As for these dimpled followers, does anyone have a pic of these? Also, I've got one cmc shooting star 8 rnd flat follower mag, how do these generally do? Other than that one hiccup, Ive had no malfs in 2k+ rnds, provided I was using either the cmc, wilson, or an eleven rnd metalform? mag with a round follower. All that shooting was done with 230 gr ball and 185 gr remington semiwadcutter. Reliability suffered using ball only when using some no name mags purchased from cheaperthandirt for the princely sum of $7.95 each. I was so disgusted with them that I tore one from the magwell after it refused to eject, threw it down and put a single 230 fmj through it, launching the spring and follower some 80 yds!

 

[Lonestar49]

No more Hydra Shok's

...

I have fired without any problems, one box of 20, 165gr JHP's Hydra-shoks by Federal thru my 40cal, way after 3200 rounds, 100% trouble free. But the the other day, after cleaning my 40cal, then went to load it, they would not chamber, one, after another, and jammed during the ejection and rechambering process and my guess is two-fold as to why.

When my Beretta Px4 was hot, they fed, fired, ejected, no problems. But, when the gun was cold, they would not chamber, nor eject and this was using the sling shot method.

So I took them out, looked carefully at them, compared to Hornady's 155gr JHP's and saw both, that H-S's bullets had a much wider mouth, along with, a less smooth, bullet-casing match, compared to H's more, coned bullet like mouth, and a much better bullet to casing finish, smoother.

So, IMHO, it's either the bigger mouth, or the fit of the bullet to casing, thicker edge, one can feel.

As the H's 155gr, fed right in, cold, and cycled, thru my 10 round test, and are in the gun, with confidence.

No more 165gr H-S JHP's in this shape, as opposed to their newer fully closed
"Expanding FMJ" bullets, for feed issues.


LS

 

[kingpin008]

All this "1911's can only feed ball ammo" every time a feed faliure is mentioned in various threads makes my stomach hurt.

I'm sorry you feel that way, Walkalong, but I never said that. What I said was that the 1911 was designed for BALL AMMO ONLY, which is a fact. I also said that it may not like to feed HP ammo, regardless of modifications or throating/polishing jobs, which is also a fact. I never said anything about 1911's only being able to feed ball ammo...because they can handle HP ammo. SOMETIMES. It makes MY stomach hurt when people jump all over those of us who point out that the DESIGN of the pistol prohibits the use of certain bullet shapes and designs..like WE made it that way. Facts are facts..yes, some 1911's will gobble HP's like candy, but guess what? They're the exception.

Sorry if I got a little loud..but your post kinda bothered me. I was stating a possible reason, with no bias against HP ammo, based on facts. What's the problem?

 

[Lonestar49]

Back on subject.. 1911 models

...

First, very good post KP, as to the design of the 1911.

And, the same reasoning for the shape of Hydra-Shoks will apply to my Colt Defender.

Either going with Expanding FMJ ammo for SD/HD or Hornady's more cone-bullet-shaped JHP's.


LS

 

[longeyes]

Try Rem Golden Sabers or Cor-Bon Pow'rball.

 

[Walkalong]

I'm sorry you feel that way, Walkalong, but I never said that. What I said was that the 1911 was designed for BALL AMMO ONLY

Not picking on you, although you did say feed reliably, not just feed. That is just where it sounded like it was going and jumped in early.

Sorry if I got a little loud..but your post kinda bothered me. I was stating a possible reason, with no bias against HP ammo, based on facts. What's the problem?

Certainly sounded biased. Don't be so touchy. No malice intended. I was addressing the thought which is held by many, not jabbing at you.

Too many well made, not necessarily expensive, just well made, 1911's feed all kinds of hollow points reliably with good mags to listen to a whole lot of "won't feed anything but ball ammo" that is said in these threads all the time. Just stickin' up for the 1911.

Sounds like someone polished the barrel ramp until there was a sharp edge at the bottom. If so it needs to be very lightly, very very lightly, radiused. This is a good question for Gunsmithing and Repairs.

The Wilson 8 rounders (and other 8 rounders) tend to have the first round DIP down as it comes out of the mag. There is so much spring pressure from cramming 8 rounds in the mag the rear of the round drags against the feed lips from spring pressure and the front dips down.

 

[cordex]

I'm sorry you feel that way, Walkalong, but I never said that. What I said was that the 1911 was designed for BALL AMMO ONLY, which is a fact.

Actually, kingpin, you said:

it is a pistol designed to only feed reliably with ball ammo

These statements are not semantically equivalent.

ghettofab,
Are you confident that the throat polishing job that you did actually served to improve reliability? I ask because a botched polishing job can impact feeding just as you've reported. Especially for bullets with more complicated nose profiles such as a hollow-point projectile. That was my first thought when reading your post, anyway.

 

[kellyj00]

I'd buy a new recoil spring and see if that helps you out at all.
Springfield makes a good quality product, and I love my mil-spec 1911. It has fed everything just fine...until one day it just started to choke more often. There's something about 10,000 rounds or so on the factory recoil spring that makes it ftf properly.

 

[ghettofab]

I only polished the ramp to remove some flaking coating left over from the spray-and-bake, I did not alter its shape. I have replaced the recoil spring wtih a 17# Wilson. After reading Tuner's observations, I think I'll hunt some of those dimpled mags and run the bucketnose bullets thru again.

 

[CWL]

ghettofab,

I think that longeyes has the best suggestion. The fastest thing that you can do to get your gun back up and running reliably is to explore other JHP solutions. I would reccomend Golden Sabres or Gold Dots myself, but you have to find what works in your gun.

Every gun is an individual and will feed differently, so comments by others about what feeds in their gun has no direct relevance with what will work reliably in your modified gun.

Also of great importance is the fact that your ammo was old & has been chambered 1-2-5x. You may wish to fire a few boxes of new hydrashoks to see if you still get the same FTF issues. It may be nothing at all.

 

[Lonestar49]

About Wilson Combat Mags, vs Factory mags

...

Just the opposite occurred with my Colt Defender's factory 7 load mags.

It would jam after the 1'st or 3rd shot with FMJ ammo, every time. And, with a chambered round, with 7 in the mag, it would jam after the first shot, every time.

So, on the advice of the Range officer, who CCW's his Defender, I bought 3 of the Wilson Combat Mags and it has never jammed using either JHP or FMJ ammo, including one chambered, 7 in the mag.

And to be clear, this was, and is, in the break-in period, as it still only has, to-date, only 250 rounds thru it..

FYI, IMO


LS

 

[Walkalong]

Golden Sabers and Hornady XTP's seem to feed better than a lot of other hollow points. My Kimber CDP feeds those as well as Gold Dots flawlessly with Wilson mags. Some guns don't like the Wilsons though.

If a gun won't feed Golden Sabers, it will have problems with many bullets.

 

[03Shadowbob]

I have been firing quite a lot of Golden Sabres out of my GI .45 and they have worked flawlessly. Might want to give them a try.