1911 recoil reduction

Status
Not open for further replies.
E

Eric F

Member
Joined
Jul 23, 2007
Messages
2,933
I have a 38 super RIA 1911 that I built, I am shooting a 130 gr agulia fmj(factory) and reload a 135 gr fmj both at 1450 fps.
As for the gun it has a 19lb main spring and a stock recoil spring.
The problem is recoil seems a bit brutal. My friend has a STI that was built by a local gunsmith and the guns weigh almost the same his is 2 ounces heavier but the same ammo in his gun recoils way less.
What can I do to help this out?

The gun is for IDPA and I can not add any more weight to it.
 
How sharp is the angle on the bottom of the firing pin retainer?

A sharper angle decreases the mechanical advantage the slide has in cocking the hammer, absorbing more energy from the slide and typically decreasing the felt recoil (the cocking forces are between fixed points on the gun frame).
 
I have a long radius with no corners that is smooth, If I follow the above post properly This is a good thing, am I right?

I have tried heavier recoil springs but find the slide slams back making for a worse condition in the oposite direstion.
 
This is a good thing, am I right?
Click to expand...

No, that allows maximum mechanical advantage and reduces the energy taken form the slide.

A sharper angle reduces felt recoil.

It also makes hand cycling of the slide harder.
 
So I want a square angle on the fireing pin stop? I will go look at my spar parts box and see what I have.
 
if I did put the main spring back to the 23 lb what effect would my trigger pull see? I like my 2 lb trigger(which is a pound more than what I had it before it was stolen)
 
Raising the value of the mainspring has very little effect on felt trigger pull. A 2 lb. trigger pull on an IDPA gun seems awfully light considering what it will be used for. Be very careful.
 
I have many many discussions on light 1911 pulls and do not care to get into another one here. I will be careful.

I ordered a new pin stop that will need to be fitted, what shape should the base be? Any one have a pic or drawing? The one that is on the way is square.
 
I THINK the original had like a .030" or 1/32" radius but Tuner KNOWS, so lets see what he says.

You need at least some radius there so the factory square corner does not gouge up the face of the hammer.
I tried it but do not have the sensitivity of The Princess and The Pea and could not tell a difference in recoil.

Why do you load power factor 195,000+ ammo for IDPA which only requires 125000?
Some .38 ACP type stuff, that 135 at 1000, would be just about right for ESP and kick you around a lot less. That is what I load in 9mm P for the same purpose.
 
oh small detail.....its also my cary gun and thats what my defensive ammo does. I dont do IDPA USPSA and other games just to play a game if I did I would be shooting 9mm to the lowest power factor possible. I shoot these things for real world practice.
 
Then it would be wise to just get used to the recoil of YOUR ammo in YOUR gun, wouldn't it?

As I said, I think fooling with the firing pin stop is for fine tuning of the action and will not make a whale of a lot of difference.

I don't know why your contact's STI would have substantially less felt recoil for only two ounces difference in weight.
Does he have one of those Recoilmaster gimmick spring systems? I would not want that in a carry gun.
 
It has a 2 piece guide rod that I do not have but recoil springs are the same. Maybe next time I see him we could maybe swap slides. He is out of town for now so it might be a week or two. I think I want to still try the pin stop out. Also I shoot fine the way it is, I just think it could be better. Since the other gun is way better on the recoil I would like to try to duplicate that.
 
The original radius was increased at the request of the army to make racking the slide easier.
 
The original radius was .078 inch, which comes to 5/64ths. It was changed for the reasons that brickeyee posted...to the present-day standard of 7/32nds, nominally.

When I fit an EGW stop, I don't shoot for a closely toleranced dimension, but they generally average about 1/16th...smaller than the original.

I don't do it for recoil reduction. It's a reliability tweak. It does have a small effect on recoil, but that's incidental. It's never been my reason for doing it.
 
To quote a usually reliable source (Me!)

"You need at least some radius there so the factory square corner does not gouge up the face of the hammer."
 
Just breaking the corner on a 45 degree angle will do. Over time, the bevel will start to take on a radius.

The 19 pound recoil spring has a lot to do with the sharp recoil you're getting. Drop to 14-16 pounds with the small radius on the stop. The 23 pound mainspring won't affect your trigger action much more than 2-3 ounces.
 
A full-length guide rod will take a little edge off the muzzle flip and recoil. There are tungsten heavy rods, but the regular one helped my Combat Commander. I also installed a small radius stop & like it (I had to relieve it on three sides - top wouldn't clear my Heinie rear sight; I used Arkansas stones to keep it slick). These little things will add up and make a difference, just try & see how they work. I attached a couple of pics I took of the slide stop secured on my bench with a brass screw during the process (not the final product!). I got it symetrical after figuring out how to use the stone (shade-tree machining technique; not recommended by competent smiths but great in the shade ;) ).

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/pid=23756/Product/1911-AUTO-ONE-PIECE-GUIDE-ROD
 

Attachments

  • P7170004.jpg
    P7170004.jpg
    270.4 KB · Views: 23
  • P7170001.jpg
    P7170001.jpg
    270.2 KB · Views: 25
I have installed the new stop. I just broke the corner to 45* as advised. Testing later today. Tuner: the main spring was 19 lbs. I have increased it to 23 pounds the recoil spring is 12 or 14 lbs I can not remember exactly but it functions the slide with out a sharp return. Trigger pull is now 2.5 pounds.
I can not add any more weight to the gun as per IDPA weight regulations. Otherwise I would have a guide rod in place.
 
I personally wouldn't carry a gun for personal defense with that low a trigger pull weight. :uhoh: Some overzealous public official could make a huge issue of this even with a justified shoot. Just sayin...
Joe
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top