1913 P-08 DWM Luger

[theidleidol]

First post, be gentle.

I'm looking for more information on a wonderful pistol and piece of history I've recently come across.







This, from what little I know, is a P-08 Luger made in 1913 in or after August by Deutsche Waffen und Munitionsfabriken (DWM) in Berlin Germany. I'm just now learning about Lugers, so please correct me if I'm wrong.

This particular gun was offered to us for sale by a good family friend in need of some funds. It was his father's gun and came with a whole treasure trove of other items.

His father was a bombardier for a B-25 Mitchell C/D (possibly MK 1 British import, still awaiting details) during the Chinese Revolution. He flew with the 1st American Volunteer Group (AVG) known as the "Flying Tigers" in an attempt to neutralize the growing influence of the Communist and Japanese incursions leading up to, and during, the Second World War.

This model was imported to the Chinese during this time, but I can't find actual information on the total number imported or any significant markings that might help me get to the real history of this piece. I've read that the presence of a buttstock lug signifies that the gun was made during/after August 1913.

Additionally, 1913 was a slow year for the DWM Lugers, totaling 22,000 pistols. This along with the previous year's 10,000 numbers were some of the lowest production numbers recorded in it's entire service. With more than a hundred thousand being sold before and after it.

The gun is available for photography or specific inquiry. It is functional, having been fired (against my advice) within the month.

Please add your own expertise. We're just trying to figure out what we have here and the history behind it.

I will try to update this post as people respond and/or I have new information. This is a real history boner for me.

 

[MCgunner]

Beautiful

 

[Deaf Smith]

Sad he didn't pass it down to future generations (along with its story.)

Still, it's a fantastic looking gun.

Deaf

 

[tark]

Welcome to the monkey house!

Lugers are one of the biggest snakes nest in all of the collecting world. There are so many variations and types (Made for various countries) that one hardly knows where to begin.

Always check first for two things: Do all numbers match? The last two digits of the serial number were stamped on most of the small parts. Point #2; does the magazine have a serial number and does it match the gun? If either or both of these two things are absent, the gun has little collector value, unless it is in near new condition. Any accessories, such as a holster, cleaning rods, etc. increase the value. A second matching magazine, with matching numbers can double the value of the gun. Because of this, there are many fakes out there. Beware!

You mentioned the lack of a butt stock lug. If this were rare, I would guess that would increase the value.

It might be worth it to get a professional appraisal, just make sure you contact someone who really KNOWS lugers, not just the local gun store.

good luck

 

[Pilot]

If you don't get enough info here. Go to Jan Still's site. These guys will know.

http://luger.gunboards.com/forum.php

 

[tark]

Good advise, Pilot.

 

[Jim K]

I see nothing on that pistol to bear out the story of Chinese use, so I am afraid that will make no difference to the value of the pistol.

Jim

 

[theidleidol]

Sorry for the length in between responses and updates. I lost internet for almost a week solid, but I kept myself busy drooling over the gun and pouring over documentation.



@Tark: The gun is all numbers matching, you can't see all of the markings but they're all "850" or "50" including the magazine. We did find some extra marks under the barrel which I've learned stand for Boehler-made Steel barrels and the 24 is supposedly a rating on the hardness of the steel. We're still researching that.

I do not know the significance of the script below the Bo24 mark, nor have I figured out the 8,82 below that.

As always, thanks for any input. I will be updating shortly with his roster pictures, newspaper articles, the silk maps the Chinese gave them in case they were shot down to be sewn into their clothes. Not because they're really going to add anything to this particular gun's value, but because I value the history and the story and enjoy sharing.

 

[Monac]

The 8,82 is the European way of saying 8.82. It is the actual bore diameter in millimeters, I think. I also think the Germans measured from groove to grove rather than from land to land, which was the system in some other countries.

I just saw a review of this book:

http://www.amazon.com/THE-LUGER-PIS...p/9080558354/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top?ie=UTF8

on YouTube, by the YouTube guy called "ForgottenWeapons". It seems to be a good and relatively inexpensive basic guide to Lugers.