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1st outing with M&P9...issues?

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by Babarsac, Jun 13, 2013.

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  1. Babarsac

    Babarsac Member

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    Took my M&P 9mm to the range to give it a whirl. I started my range session off with my Buckmark, K-22, and K-38. I was hitting bullseyes, feeling good, and decided to try the M&P.

    I set a target at 10 yards and was hitting 6-8 inches low

    20130612_185245_zpsc281cabd.gif

    After a few more magzines I was able to bring the rounds slightly higher but not by much.

    20130612_185252_zps9da7bc3c.gif

    First off more practice is definitely needed but I'm wondering how to approach it. Of the following sight image chart I was using style #3.

    sightimages_zps4c192804.gif

    Should I be using a different sight picture or is there something else that can be recommended?
     
  2. allaroundhunter

    allaroundhunter Member

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    The M&P uses the 2nd sight picture. How much experience do you have shooting centerfire handguns? I would guess that you are anticipating the shot and/or slapping the trigger.
     
  3. Babarsac

    Babarsac Member

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    Most of my centerfire shooting is with revolvers and recently the majority of my semi-auto action has been rimfire. By switching to sight picture #2 wouldn't the point of impact fall even lower?
     
  4. allaroundhunter

    allaroundhunter Member

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    Yes, that would happen if you continue to shoot with the same mechanics as you were previously using. The problem is not with the gun, it is shooter error. You cannot correct for shooting low by just holding higher when the gun is doing its part. (well, you can, but that is not how to fix this problem)

    The gun is capable of much more than that, so it is a matter of figuring out just what you are doing wrong in order to get your groups tighter and in the right location.
     
  5. Potatohead
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    Potatohead Member

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    yea but a pistols sights are not always zeroed perfectly, out of the box, correct?
     
  6. ku4hx

    ku4hx Member

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    Move up to about 3 yards. Once you gain confidence and expertise, begin to move back in small increments. Maybe a couple of yards at a time.
     
  7. Water-Man

    Water-Man Member

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    Get used to concentrating on the front sight rather than the target and stop looking at the holes each time you fire.
     
  8. allaroundhunter

    allaroundhunter Member

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    They are usually pretty dang close, and when they are off, they are never that far off (especially a gun from a larger manufacturer). If a gun is 'off' from the factory it will be by at most a couple inches, not 6-8.

    If a group is that big, then there is no way that I will say that the gun is having problems.

    If someone thinks that a handgun is shooting poorly from the factory, before doing anything, have an experienced pistol shooter have a go with it.
     
  9. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator

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    Perfectly, no

    Good enough, usually. I've shot a lot of different M&P9s and usually, out of the box, elevation has been pretty close while I've see the rear sights off a bit to the left

    If the OP were using perfect technique and the gun was shooting that far below his POA, it still wouldn't be due to the sights.

    We might have a different opinion, if his shots at 10 yards was closer to 1"...certainly under 2"
     
  10. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator

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    Every M&P9 I've shot has hit accurately with sight picture #2

    A few things to try if you can't get a more experienced shooter to try the gun.

    1. Move the target in to 3-5 yards
    2. Shoot off a rest
    3. Shoot at a smaller target...like a 2" square Post-it

    Are you by chance left handed?
     
  11. Wahoo95

    Wahoo95 Member

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    I've never found an M&P that sighted in to use a 6 o'clock hold. They're Combat Sighted like #3 which is POA/POI. Google it to see for yourself. Shoot with #2 and you will continue to be low.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2013
  12. ifit

    ifit Member

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    a friend also first time out with his m&p, could not hit his target worth crap. he thought the gun was defective, so I had a go at it, and to be honest one of the worst trigger pulls outa the box from a polymer pistol. if you notice your shots are hittin low=heavy trigger. try standing 5' from target and put a 6 oclock hold on the x target and shoot 5 rounds. don't worry about where your hitting...just concentrate on the x, then take couple step back and repeat...so and so on, and see the groupinng
     
  13. Potatohead
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    Potatohead Member

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    thx 9mm and Allaround.
     
  14. Jack19

    Jack19 Member

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  15. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator

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    I cringed with the suspicion that this link would lead to this flawed chart, that just won't go away. This has been around so long that is has become legend, but with today's more common two-handed techniques, it has become irrelevant as an aid in correcting handgun shooting errors.

    As titled at the top of the image, this diagnostic chart is for a shooter holding his gun in his Right hand...yes, for one handed shooting. Using two hands to hold your handgun changes the dynamics of forces applied to the gun influencing the strike of the bullets on the target
     
  16. Byrd666

    Byrd666 Member

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    Funny, the only thing I use the rear sights on my M&P9c for is to rack the slide. Being a one handed shooter it comes in real handy like that. :)

    Have you tried strictly focusing on just the front sight and letting rear sight blur or disappear from your sight line/sight picture? Even shooting only one handed, my groupings at 10+- yards are well within a 2" radius. Normally within 1" if I really concentrate. And at about 50 yards they are normally within the paper plate using only my front sight. Just a thought.

    Or as others have said, try using a rest to align, or make sure your sights are straight.
     
  17. Babarsac

    Babarsac Member

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    Thanks for suggestions all. I'll try a couple of the things recommended above in my next range trip.

    FYI I'm left handed and left eye dominant, however I prefer to hold handguns with my right hand. The only time I shoot left handed is with long guns.
     
  18. allaroundhunter

    allaroundhunter Member

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    This could be throwing your grip for a loop. If you do everything with your left hand, then fine motor control is probably better with it. Yes, you can develop it with your right hand, but I would bet that your trigger control is much better shooting left handed.
     
  19. Babarsac

    Babarsac Member

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    Well...I don't do everything left handed.

    Left:
    -Write
    -Use fork
    -Shoot long guns

    Right:
    -Throw a ball
    -Use scissors
    -Shoot handguns

    I think I'm stuck somewhere in the middle :confused:
     
  20. Fremmer

    Fremmer Member

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    I had to work at using the tip of my trigger finger to pull the trigger straight back when I tried the M&P. And like someone else mentioned, make sure you aren't lowering the gun to look at the target immediately after you fire.
     
  21. Potatohead
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    Potatohead Member

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    Hey 9, is their a chart you know of for two-handed (for a right-hander) shooting?
     
  22. allaroundhunter

    allaroundhunter Member

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    You've got the same problems that my younger brother does. In that case, you are borderline ambidextrous and a little more practice should have you shooting better.
     
  23. Potatohead
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    Potatohead Member

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    Geez Bab, you're all screwed up! Kidding.
     
  24. jon_in_wv

    jon_in_wv Member

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    Not any of the M&Ps I own or have shot. #2 is the correct sight picture for them. #3 would be high. You align the sights, not the dots. I would suspect he is anticipating the recoil and/or looking over the sights.
     
  25. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator

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    Not that I know of. I tried to come up with one once, but it was harder than it looked to shoot with improper technique...I'll try again some day.

    You have to understand that differing grip styles/geometries, in a two handed hold/grip, have differing effects. If you use a neutral, enveloping hold with a perfect trigger press, everything will be about pressure you introduce to upset that neutrality.

    However, ultimate accuracy, will always come down to trigger management
     
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