.223 for Deer?

[El Guero]

Thanks for all the input! I thought it was funny when people suggested the lever-action 30-30s, as we already have 2 of them and I've already had 2 deer with mine!

The consensus seems to be that the .223 is just a little too wimpy for deer, and that's what I expected. What I'm looking for is a done deer with one shot, I don't really like the idea of follow-ups in hunting, or at least picking a weaker gun for that purpose. I might end up getting an AR15 just for fun sometime, since we already have some pretty decent deer guns.

As for the AKs.... I think they're great functionally but I just don't like the look of them, just too utilitarian and menacing to be my fun-gun. SKS is almost passable, and if I found a good cheap one I could get one of those anyways.

 

[DougCxx]

It can work just fine, as noted. I do not subscribe to the theory that you need 3000 ft-lbs to knock down a 100-lb deer, but I don't hunt much, so whatever.
-----
I can say that I live in IL, very near the IL/MO border, and rifle hunting is not legal in IL but is in MO, down to .223.... ...-And most of the stories I have ever heard of IL guys taking .223's deer hunting in MO was people who wanted to try using their Colt/black rifles for deer hunting.
.......
-So now I am wondering when the limit went down to .223; was this after the military went to .223 as a service caliber? Was it set as the lower limit because the cailber was designated as the military service rifle caliber? Or was such a small-caliber minimum always that low? I thought that before the military caliber, there was no .223, just the .222. I am not old enough to remember any of this first-hand. Have large-animal/white/blacktail deer caliber minimums ever been significantly lower in any state?
~

 

[twoblink]

BTW..

I wanted to add that:

#1 Shot placement
#2 Bullet tip type
#3 Bullet type

Buddy used a 308 softpoint, and did take down the deer, but we had to do a little trailing first, and it was a perfect heart shot too.. So use something more effective for hunting, like a Nosler or Bear Claw..

That said, when you see a .223 shot at sub 50 yards, you don't have as much meat left as you'd like..

 

[zahc]

IMO .223 is pefectly fine for deer. No problem, as long as you hit it in the lungs/vitals. So it is effective in any situation where you can do that.

 

[RustyHammer]

".223 is pefectly fine for deer. "

Yeah .... and who says hunters don't have a use for full auto? Duhhhh

 

[Bottom Gun]

My vote is also for the AR10 in .308 if you like the AR platform. An Eagle Arms rifle will only cost you a couple of hundred dollars more than a decent AR15 and then you'll have a rifle you can use on other big game as well as deer.
I took an elk this year with mine.

 

[DougCxx]

Well my point about people using Colt rifles for deer was that they wanted to use that specific rifle, not that they thought that the .223 was that great a caliber choice.
......
Also I guess depends on where you are hunting; where I live is all wooded areas with fairly short-range shots, and 30-30's with iron sights can do very well. They mightn't work so hot in plains states. A <50-yd 223 shot on a deer should hit well hard enough, a 300+ yd shot maybe not....
~

 

[WonderNine]

It can be done with a .223 easily enough, but you also have to think about meat damage and bullet fragmentation. You don't want to be tasting .223 fragments in your dear jerky. Your penetration with shots of over 100 yards will probably also be questionable.

My father's favorite deer gun is his Winchester .243. Extremely accurate and it drops em cold. Not a much larger diameter bullet than a .223, but almost twice the bullet weight and alot more powder behind it. He had a 300 yard kill a couple years ago, one shot.

 

[twoblink]

Inside 100yards, you will get a lot less meat..

That alone would make me want to step up..

 

[tex_n_cal]

No.

Yes, it will kill them, but I have had small deer run off from even perfectly placed .25 cal bullets out of a .25-06, and take a while to find due to no blood trail.

A former hunting bud used to swear by his .22-250...until you got a few beers in him, then he'd admit to wounding and losing a few. In the end, he went to a .25-06.

.25 cal is the smallest I try on deer, and that only because I have an exceptional .25-06, with which I got my first deer.

 

[MeekandMild]

Sure, cartridges like the .222 or .223 will kill a deer. The problem lies in the skill of the shooter.

Not just skill, Art. You've got to have situational experiance and the right equipment.

The skilled shooter needs to practice using whatever rest he's going to use in the field so he doesn't get all bewildered when time comes to shoot. (I'm a great fan of using a big oak tree or a walking stick as a standing or kneeling rest; both take a certain amount of practice before one can figure out how best to wrap themselves around them.)

Another thing, I've seen some pretty atrocious triggers on ARs, SKs and AKs. If one is destined to shoot a deer with one of these military style rifles they'd best either learn how to use a heavy creepy trigger or invest in a better one.

 

[Dizos]

For a good general purpose rifle, a M1A or a M14 clone is a fun plinker and uses the venerable .308. I use my Springfield M1A for hunting. It is a bit heavy (9lb) but I don't mind. Big problem with the Springfield is cost ~$1000. There are cheaper M14 variants available (Polytechs run ~ $600). I'm not in a situation where I can own a lot of firearms so I have tried to pick ones capable of multiple functions.

-- Dizos

 

[Onslaught]

The man says he wants an AR... now anybody who WANTS an AR for plinking is just NOT going to be satisfied with a Remington Mosin NaSavage Lever Action

My dear ole Dad has dropped deer using a Savage 24V with a 22" bbl in .223 using 40gr specialty varmint ammo (comes in 10 packs at Walmart), but I do still have to agree that bigger is better. I have an AR, but I won't hunt with it. That's what my new Savage 10FLP is for

So my vote is still to either get an AR in another caliber (like the Oly Arms 7.62x39, or even 10mm) or buy the AR first, have fun with it, and then when you're ready to hunt, use/buy something else

But I do understand... when you WANT an AR, nothing else will do!

 

[Dr.Rob]

If you want one, get one.

Our deer are too big for 223. Minimum caliber is 6mm or larger, use expanding bullets 70gr or larger, and have a rating of 1000ft lbs of energy at 100 yards.

Elk and moose require a minimum 85 grain bullet.

I know it can be done with a 223, I'd just prefer a little more OOMF in my game rifle. Get a 308 if you want an evil black rifle that you can still hunt with... just be aware that you'll need a 5 shot magazine too. Not many states allow you to hunt with a 20-30rd magazine.

 

[Sharpshooter223]

Just from my personal experience I would'nt hunt with an AR... But as far as the .223 caliber that all depends on the rifle the shooter and the experience. Some have mentioned the remington 700 vss that would be a great choice I have one and it's very fun to shoot. I have my own shooting range and on the Remington I have a bausch & lomb 4x16x50 scope and I was very proud of it's ability to shoot 1/2 inch groups with factory ammo and 1/4 inch groups with handloads at 100 yards... until I got a browning A-bolt medallion with a bausch & lomb 6x24 which shoots tacks out at 100 yards every time.. measured the group of 5 at .006. 223 ammo is extremely cheap and will easily take a deer if you place the shot right with the right ammo. Just please take some time to familiarize yourself with the rifle before you take a shot at a deer. Good luck with any choice you make.

 

[MuzzleBlast]

<----- Just being a jerk:

There are many people who hunt deer with bow and arrow. Is the .223 less effective than an arrow?

 

[cordex]

There are many people who hunt deer with bow and arrow.

Yeah, but those guys have always been a bit odd.
*covers up the compound bow in the back seat of his car*

Is the .223 less effective than an arrow?

For what?
Ever see someone make a 600 yard shot with an arrow?
Ever see a .223 cut a 1.5 inch clean slice through something?

 

[Byron]

I am from the N GA mountains. The 223 is very poplar especially in a Mini 14. I frequented a small gun store in Blue Ridge a lot. In deer season, he sells a lot of the Federal 68 or 69 grain match for deer and has so for several years. The WW 64 grain is poplar. Handloaders swear by the Speer 70 grain semi spitzer. The terrian is mountainous and shots are usually 75 yards and under. Sometime ago on TFL, pictures were shown of a FL hunter having germission to kill deer in Orange groves. The pictures were impressive. He used Military M193 and I belive a 161/2" barrel AR. Byron

 

[son of a gun]

There are many people who hunt deer with bow and arrow.

 

[JShirley]

I think I'm just going to get some optics and decent hunting cartridges for my bushy 20" HBAR A3.

If you do decide to do any hunting with .223, be sure you get a good round. I took a .223 flattop carbine with me, about three years ago. I was still hunting during the afternoon, and three does walked fairly close by. I was waiting for the perfect low-penetration shot in the neck, and so did not fire before the does bolted. With a better caliber- or, even with a sturdier bullet than the 50-grain HP I was loaded with- I would have taken the shot into the heart I was offered.

John