Deer rifle for a 100 pound girl

[horsey300]

I don't wanna go knocking on anybody's favorite puppy here, but for a novice hunter, the Grendel and x39 with their many perks, do lack something that the other cartridges do offer, in standard configuration the x39 does not offer a great selection of bullets, and without a good longer barrel and stouter load, neither of them offer the excessive amount of trauma and shock that a light .308/.260/.243 class rifle offers. If my kid misses by 3" because of the infamous fever (anything that does not directly impact the vitals is a miss around here) then I want the temporary wound cavity created by the shock of 2500+ fps and 1300+ fpe being dumped into the now deformed lung soup. Are those two cartridges capable of humanely taking deer sized game? Absolutely! But they are certainly not ideal for a novice hunter on their first game hunt.
ETA at 200 yds, 3" is only 1.5 moa for anyone thinking that 3" miss sounds unrealistic, how many 1st time hunters (bench shooting is a different game and we know it) can hold under 1.5 moa in sub perfect conditions from field positions?

 

[Nature Boy]

I think I would second the suggested .22-250

There's a lot of grown men I hunt with that started their kid off hunting with them, saw how lethal they were, then switched to it themselves. It makes a bit of a mess but it lays them down pretty quick.....and is relatively light recoiling.

 

[horsey300]

I think I would second the suggested .22-250

There's a lot of grown men I hunt with that started their kid off hunting with them, saw how lethal they were, then switched to it themselves. It makes a bit of a mess but it lays them down pretty quick.....and is relatively light recoiling.

+1 and with the bonded solid base you won't lack penetration either

 

[Arizona_Mike]

I was thinking 243 or 260.

Mike

 

[entropy]

I think I would second the suggested .22-250

There's a lot of grown men I hunt with that started their kid off hunting with them, saw how lethal they were, then switched to it themselves. It makes a bit of a mess but it lays them down pretty quick.....and is relatively light recoiling.

That's how I went to .223. Actually, the kid started out with a 12 ga., but WI went to rifle statewide a few years ago, and he got a Savage Axis and took 11 deer with it the first year he hunted with a rifle. I bought one and hunt with it, he since bought an AR and hunts with that.

If she likes the AR, find out what her maximum effective range is with it, get her familiar with what a deer looks like at that range, and teach her to hold the shot if she has any doubt. That's how i trained my sons. The older one now out shoots me with a rifle.

 

[Newtosavage]

Are those two cartridges capable of humanely taking deer sized game? Absolutely! But they are certainly not ideal for a novice hunter on their first game hunt.

I've noticed that you and I tend to agree on a lot of things, but this is an area where we may differ. Good starter rifles will be easy/fun to shoot, and for that reason they will be shot a lot - and that is the key to good clean kills for new shooters. Too much recoil will keep a kid from shooting as much as they should prior to that first "real" shot on game, and that's a recipe for a lost deer, regardless of the caliber.

My choice for a brand new, never before hunted shooter last fall was the x39 with literally 100+ practice rounds of cheap steel case ammo, followed by a one-shot kill at 100 yds. with my handload.

I don't know many 100 lb. girls who will shoot 100 shots of .243-class rifles before they take their first shot on a live critter.

 

[LocoGringo]

I haven't read any replies, but a .243 is great for deer, but might I add an alternative?

Since you already have an AR in .223, you could get an alternative upper in 6.8 SPC with a 6.8 SPC magazine and have a perfect for 300 yard and less shot, low recoil, plenty of power, handy, familiar rifle for your daughter. A good upper can cost less than $500 and excellent ammo is the Hornady 120 SST.

 

[Gordon]

In Georgia, any centerfire rifle caliber is legal for deer. Where I hunt, we would be looking at 200 yard shots max.

I have a 100 pound 16 yr old daughter that wants to go deer hunting this fall. She can fire an AR 15 all day long, so I don't think 223 Remington is a problem, but I am not thrilled about using 223 Rem for deer though I know some people do it.

She has shot a Ruger M77/44 in 44 magnum, but doesn't like the recoil compared to the AR. My opinion is the M77/44 doesnt have as much recoil as a 308 Win. I deer hunt with either the 77/44 or a Savage model 10 in 308.

How do you think she would do with a 243 Win in a bolt action?

Am I underestimating the 223 Remington for deer for 200 yd or less shots on deer that are usually 150 pounds or so?

I don't really want to add a 243 unless i have too. I have a lot of 223, 308, and 44 mag ammo on hand.

Use the .223 ! No doubt in my mind the best solution for you , incase you want a studied answer from a good old boy :

 

[Gtscotty]

Given that that your daughter isn't really a young child (you'd probably be ok with her having a few rounds in a semi-auto mag in a deer stand by herself) and that she is already comfortable with AR-15s, I would say that an upper in 6.8 SPC for your existing AR-15 would be a good option. The 6.8 is probably the third most popular AR round after 5.56x45 and .300 BLK, and is readily available at most sporting goods stores (where I shop anyway). There are many varieties and several brands of factory hunting ammo available, if you load there are tons of options. I only shot two deer with my 6.8 (110gr Accubonds @ 2,660 fps), but performance was excellent. 6.5 G would also be an option, although factory hunting ammo is a bit less common, if that matters. The fact that she is comfortable with the AR system would be a driver for me, she'll probably be more comfortable shooting it than a larger bolt gun that she's scared of.

 

[Deaf Smith]

Put me down for a .308 reduced load. End up with a 30/30 in power. Later you can always add powder and work her up to a full .308 load.

Deaf

 

[Cemo]

Let her stick with the AR if that ts what she likes. Federal makes a .223 round loaded with the Nosler 60 gr. Partition bullet. It kills deer very dead. I saw my 10 yr old kill a deer with 1 shot, and did it for the 3 following years. You don't need heavy recoil to kill a deer.

 

[horsey300]

I've noticed that you and I tend to agree on a lot of things, but this is an area where we may differ. Good starter rifles will be easy/fun to shoot, and for that reason they will be shot a lot - and that is the key to good clean kills for new shooters. Too much recoil will keep a kid from shooting as much as they should prior to that first "real" shot on game, and that's a recipe for a lost deer, regardless of the caliber.

My choice for a brand new, never before hunted shooter last fall was the x39 with literally 100+ practice rounds of cheap steel case ammo, followed by a one-shot kill at 100 yds. with my handload.

I don't know many 100 lb. girls who will shoot 100 shots of .243-class rifles before they take their first shot on a live critter.

I agree about the recoil, myself included, every kid around here has put hundreds if not thousands of rounds of rimfires and .223/.22-250 rds downrange before they even contemplate a big game hunt, they don't learn to shoot after we buy the tag, and the entire year before deer season, they practice keeping their form shooting prone and kneeling with a 9ish lb .243 bolt action in all weather from freezing -10* 15 mph wind and snow to 90* summer heat. If they can't keep all their shots minute of dead out to 150-200 yds, they're limited on yardage and will pass anything that is not ideal. I'd rather they walk home empty handed than have to track and shoot multiple times. If they're not proficient enough, they can still tag along and learn to read the wind, stalk, and field dress. The rifle itself makes as much difference as the cartridge, and a decently balanced, weighted, high power rifle doesn't have to be any scarier than a plinking .22 with good technique. If I knew the shots would be inside 150 yds, a Grendel with a scorching 100 ballistic tip would be fine for a first deer rifle, but at 200 yds as far as taking game, it's not the raw energy number that makes the kill, there are other factors that will have a large impact on the success of the hunt. Trajectory, shot placement, poor form, and underwhelming terminal performance will be exhibited and much more pronounced when the nerves turn a .75 moa load into a 1.5-2 moa load with hair in the sights at 200 yds.

 

[CptnAwesome]

*I'd say Hornady reduced recoil for 308
*if that recoil is too heavy the 243 probably will be too.
*If so I'd go 22-250 Rem all day.
*Or if you want to stick with the 223 that will work also. Since 200yds is about the max range I'd be comfortable using all of them. I would trust the first 3 a little more with "not quite perfect" shot placement.

 

[CB900F]

Fella's;

The 6.5 mm bullets do quite nicely thank you. Look a the sectional density & B/C numbers. I went to the JBM ballistics site & plugged in the Hornady 123 grain SST bullet at 2450 fps muzzle velocity. At 250 yards it's still at 2069 fps & carrying 1169 ft. lbs. of energy. More than enough to cleanly kill a deer. That's not book max for velocity either, and I'm giving another 50 yards range error also. With a 100 yard zero the 200 yard drop is 5 inches & at 250 yards it's 10 inches. Another point is that Hornady produced the figures from an 18 inch barrel. If you go to the CZ site, the barrel is listed at 24 inches, but the weight is under 6.5 lbs. Sounds just fine for the girl.

900F

 

[LoonWulf]

From a 24" tube a hot load can push a 123 to 2700. The grendel with that load is a much more formidable deer cartridge than it is at 2500fps (which is what i can get from my 20).

 

[Orcon]

Fella's;

The 6.5 mm bullets do quite nicely thank you. Look a the sectional density & B/C numbers. I went to the JBM ballistics site & plugged in the Hornady 123 grain SST bullet at 2450 fps muzzle velocity. At 250 yards it's still at 2069 fps & carrying 1169 ft. lbs. of energy. More than enough to cleanly kill a deer. That's not book max for velocity either, and I'm giving another 50 yards range error also. With a 100 yard zero the 200 yard drop is 5 inches & at 250 yards it's 10 inches. Another point is that Hornady produced the figures from an 18 inch barrel. If you go to the CZ site, the barrel is listed at 24 inches, but the weight is under 6.5 lbs. Sounds just fine for the girl.

900F

You can literally use this same logic ( differing figures of course) for any number of cartridge and caliber choices. The man said he isn't wild about adding a new cartridge to the mix, so why go there?

 

[Eagle103]

https://www.targetsportsusa.com/wolf-65-grendel-upper-receiver-p-59034.aspx

 

[horsey300]

Fella's;

The 6.5 mm bullets do quite nicely thank you. Look a the sectional density & B/C numbers. I went to the JBM ballistics site & plugged in the Hornady 123 grain SST bullet at 2450 fps muzzle velocity. At 250 yards it's still at 2069 fps & carrying 1169 ft. lbs. of energy. More than enough to cleanly kill a deer. That's not book max for velocity either, and I'm giving another 50 yards range error also. With a 100 yard zero the 200 yard drop is 5 inches & at 250 yards it's 10 inches. Another point is that Hornady produced the figures from an 18 inch barrel. If you go to the CZ site, the barrel is listed at 24 inches, but the weight is under 6.5 lbs. Sounds just fine for the girl.

900F

The cz makes quite the appeal for the Grendel and I'm a huge proponent of the 6.5 calibers, I may not have expressed my views as well as I could have, so please allow me to clarify. Longer tubed grendels aren't something I'd ignore by any means. I see the shortcomings most pronounced with 16-18" barrels and the 20" barrels looking much better with a 100 gr bullet, impact velocity and its implications on modern expanding bullets mean more than the incomplete kinetic energy formula that too many seem to rely on. The Grendel in a cz could very well be a PERFECT youth starter rifle, especially if one handloads, but the cartridge in general at mediocre velocities does not inspire loads of faith from me in an 18" or shorter tube. I think with proper standards and precautions many novice shooters could benefit from such a cartridge. My personal preference for a game cartridge in a novice's hands requires an impact velocity ABOVE 2200 fps to create the terminal performance and shock of expansion=energy DUMP to effect a short hunt after the shot. I'm not recommending everyone start shooting a belted magnum their first hunt by any means as I've seen grown men fail with a .30-06 their first time out. I very much applaud the low recoil high performance rounds, but feel they should be treated appropriately and not just for granted that "enough energy kills" as killing is a very wide and debated standard. Other cartridges not yet mentioned are the .250/3000 .257 Roberts and 7mm Mauser, they could all suffice depending on the people and situation involved. But a Grendel with a short tube and factory loads would not make my list for these reasons, and without knowing for sure how the op would execute the use of such a cartridge, I can't bring myself to make a generalized agreement. If you handload and are tenuous with instruction and care to bullet selection and have a well configured rifle, the Grendel makes plenty of sense.
ETA just for the sake of argument, by the time you push the velocity hard with the Grendel, how far are we from a light loaded .243/.260/.308? At this point we've maxed out the Grendel, and if we graduate to longer shots and/larger game we should be looking at heavier bullets (perfect for .260/6.5cm) that the Grendel will be severely crippled with and without knowing whether or not the child will make that progressive move, I would again forestall the Grendel camp for another year or two.

 

[Crowman]

I am a huge fan of 6.5mm cartridges and just love the ballastics of the long for caliber 6.5mm "flying knitting needles". Fly straighter looooong ways, penetrates like no tomorrow, all without a hard kick. Get to have your cake and eat it too.

My goto deer rifle is a 16-1/2" barrel Ruger M77 Compact rifle with Burris fixed 4x20 Short Mag scope chambered in .260 Remington. Loaded with 120 grain Nosler Ballastic Tips over a charge of Varget, it hammers deer...hard. Recoil is light, plus the rifle is both light and compact.

I frequently hunt from a box blind in my back woods and the short rifle allows me to swing inside the blind easily. Also, when I move up on the ridges, the compact rifle handles well in the dense woods where I hunt. They are hard to find, but are a great rifle/cartridge combination. With a different Bullet (139-140 grain controlled expansion...ie Partitions, A-Frames and other such), it will handily penetrate and drop black bear. The .260 Remington would allow for growth and cover any CXP2 and most CXP3 game animals.

Alternately, a compact rifle chambered in .243 Winchester would be an excellent rifle/cartridge combination for white tails. Also easier to find rifles chambered for this cartridge.

I am considering getting a complete 6.5 Grendel upper and magazines for my AR platform, just 'cause; although my Ruger M77 Compact with scope would be lighter and more compact. Not real high on my priority list...yet.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

My daughter and probably about 115 pounds. She killed her first deer at 10 with a .223 and it did the job fairly well (the range was short and the deer was a small doe that was perfectly broadside).

Now she shoots her mother's Ruger M77 in .243 Win and loves it. She was popping soda cans with no problem at about 70 yds the last time we were out.
Recoil is subjective, but my wife and daughter are both petite ladies and they handle it well. And neither are country girls either. They're yuppie subdivision girls.

 

[cdb1]

My daughter started deer and hog hunting when she was 16. She had reached full growth a few years earlier and is 5'7", and 135 pounds. Even at her height a youth stock fits her best.

Bought her a youth 7mm-08. She didn't like it at all. Sold it and bought her a youth .243. She wasn't thrilled with the recoil but could handle it. The rifles were Vanguards which aren't light at all. She also had been dove hunting for several years with a semi auto 20 gauge and that recoil didn't bother her. The dichotomy there I believe is because there is a big difference in felt recoil between shooting standing vs sitting.

In my experience a 25-06 recoils much more than a .243.

I used to be dead set against using a .223 for deer. Not anymore. I don't but have no problem with doing it and that would be a simple solution for the OP. I believe the 6.5 Grendel has merit as a deer cartridge. I loves my 6.5x55 but believe it is a little too much for a young woman's first deer rifle. And of course that would apply to the .260 Remington and 6.5 Creedmore Creedmoore Creedmoor.

There is also the fact of different recoil tolerances among people. The OP's daughter might shoot a .270 and think it marvy. My baby girl is now 26, a college grad and very successful mortgage broker, but with her recoil is numba 10.

I believe a 22-250 with a 1:7 barrel twist would be fantastic as a light recoiling deer cartridge. I want one for my daughter and one for me.

Every female I know that has experience shooting is a dead shot, including but not limited to my daughter and 82 year old mother(at least she used to be. Dear Mom hasn't donned camo and anointed herself with deer piss for a number of years now).

 

[RevJim]

My 67 yr old cousin has been using a 22-250 since she was in her early 20's in East Texas. She has always been a slender girl, one of those platinum blondes who bruise easily too ( I know, I got a lot of switchings from grandma for slugging it out with her as kids (we were raised together). Just a 55gr softnose factory round...and my uncle uses one too! I killed a lot fo big game with a 220 Swift and the 55gr Trophy Bonded bullet. A 22-250 with a good 55gr game bullet will do the same!

 

[Gordon]

I think the .223with the right bullet is plenty for white tails with good placement. For years I hunted deer , mule and Blacktail (which are smaller than white tail, a mule deer is a good sized whitetail) with a light .308, I used .270 Winchester before that , which of course is very good but I never had a Featherweight . In the early 90s I dragged out my .224 Weatherby Magnum Varmintmaster with Norma 55 grain ammo as everyone was telling me on the big ranches how good a .22-250 was on Blacktail. So I started shooting the .224 magnum and suddleny noticed after 3 or 4 years I never needed to trail a wounded deer , even 20 yards ! The modern ammo for .223 hunting has got to be a great deal. I was loading 55 grain Nosler Partitions into my .224 Weatherby at about 3300 FPS and at 300 yards it jellies the innards or almost severs the head on a neck shot before I sold it for a LOT of money to a rich guy as e thought it was a recoiless death ray

 

[Hookeye]

My wife weighed 100# and shot a Rem 600 with buttplate, .243 win.
Off bipods right around an inch, for 5 shots at 135 yards.
And she shoots maybe once every 4 yrs. Not a gun person LOL
Said the rifle bonked a little but was fun.
Wearing T shirt in summer.
75 gr varmint loads so yeah, not the recoil of a deer load. But if that stock wore a Pachmayr decel pad, and she had a coat of some sort it'd kick LESS than it did then.

I was 105# and 5' 4" when I graduated HS. I ran a .243 win since 8th grade And shot bigger.

 

[Gtscotty]

My daughter started deer and hog hunting when she was 16. She had reached full growth a few years earlier and is 5'7", and 135 pounds. Even at her height a youth stock fits her best.

Bought her a youth 7mm-08. She didn't like it at all. Sold it and bought her a youth .243. She wasn't thrilled with the recoil but could handle it. The rifles were Vanguards which aren't light at all. She also had been dove hunting for several years with a semi auto 20 gauge and that recoil didn't bother her. The dichotomy there I believe is because there is a big difference in felt recoil between shooting standing vs sitting.

In my experience a 25-06 recoils much more than a .243.

I used to be dead set against using a .223 for deer. Not anymore. I don't but have no problem with doing it and that would be a simple solution for the OP. I believe the 6.5 Grendel has merit as a deer cartridge. I loves my 6.5x55 but believe it is a little too much for a young woman's first deer rifle. And of course that would apply to the .260 Remington and 6.5 Creedmore Creedmoore Creedmoor.

There is also the fact of different recoil tolerances among people. The OP's daughter might shoot a .270 and think it marvy. My baby girl is now 26, a college grad and very successful mortgage broker, but with her recoil is numba 10.

I believe a 22-250 with a 1:7 barrel twist would be fantastic as a light recoiling deer cartridge. I want one for my daughter and one for me.

Every female I know that has experience shooting is a dead shot, including but not limited to my daughter and 82 year old mother(at least she used to be. Dear Mom hasn't donned camo and anointed herself with deer piss for a number of years now).

https://shop.whittakerguns.com/product/38416

That 22-250 is an 8 twist, not a 7, but it should stabilize most of the heavies and might meet your, your daughter's and the OP's needs. I'd still go with something more common for the OP, but a fast twist 22-250 is a neat option.