.243 Lee Collet Problem (not any more - brain fade issue.....)

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Feral_Goz

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Was loading up some .243 cases tonight (only had to do powder and projectile) and found that once the proj. was seated I could easily twist it around and pull it out. My BIL ran all the cases through a Lee Collet die.

Figuring he didn't the die up properly I re-ran the cases through (after I adjusted it as per the instructions) and I could still twist the proj. out. Stripped the die down and measured the mandrel. It came out as .240. This is the same as the projectiles I am using (Highland) so I figure the necks need to be a bit tighter to hold the proj. properly. The inside case mouths measure .240

I lubed all the cases up and ran then through the FL die and measured the inside of the case mouth. Came out at .235-.237. Seems that they are going to seat the proj. OK now.

Does anyone know if the mandel in a .243 Collet die should be .240? I am thinking it should be less.

The cases are a mixture of Winchester and NNY (Marketed as Highland in Australia). The NNY cases look like they are annealed.

I'm off to tear down the Collet Die and to make sure it is clean. I have a set of Collet Dies for .223, .270 and .303 and haven't seen this problem before.

Any help/suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks
Feral_Goz
 
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I think I may have found the answer. I checked Lee's website and the mandrel part is listed as .2415" I then checked a large sample of the projectiles I have and they were all .2415". This would explain why I could easily pull the proj. from a case.

May be an under spec. batch of projectiles. I checked the specs from Sierra, Speer and Hornady which were all .243.

For some reason I was thinking that the diameter should be .240" when it should really be .243".

Feral_Goz
 
Feral: You've come to the correct conclusion. Nothing wrong with your Lee Collet Die; something wrong with your bullets. Just checked some of my Sierra .243's, and they are, indeed .243" in diameter.
 
Yes, your bullet diameter should be .243.

Just wanted to comment about the use of the LEE collet neck die. Don't be too aggressive with the die. Sizing the neck doesn't take much leverage from your press at all and a light touch will make more consistent loads. I use a Redding Ultramag press, the ram is tight in the guide so I have to work the lever with a purpose (not a bad thing). It just makes me pay extra attention to the sizing step.
 
Necks should be 0.001"-.002" under bullet diameter when useing the Lee collet die. 0.240" should work just fine if the bullets are the right diameter (0.243"). The Lee collet die instructions recommend double hitting the case while rotating 180* and if the case neck are still too loose turn 0.001" of the mandrel with emery while spinning in a drill. Removing too much metal won`t make the case neck any tighter but will ruin the die. Lee I think will polish the mandrel for a couple bucks if you aren`t sure you can do it properly.

I take mine apart when I get them, and clean the collet and polish any burrs I find. I then give it a light lube. Lee just doesn`t polish up any of their tooling and it`s all rough straight from the box compared to RCBS, Redding, ect.

When you set up the die the ram should cam over just a bit when sizeing. Too much pressure will break the die (don`t ask how I know :cuss: ) Set the die to the raised ram and lower the ram and add 1/8 to 1/4 turn deeper, testing as you go. I seat the die deep and use it by feel anymore, I know when the die has worked the case about all it`s going to ( been useing one for over 10 years or so now) and never fully raise the ram. It takes some familiarity with the feel of the die working the brass to do it this way but I get good tension.

One last thing and I doubt it is your problem. The older brass gets, the more it work hardens. Hard brass doesn`t move as easily as new soft brass, and won`t get as tight with a collet die as it would with a normal die that over sizes the neck and expands it back out.

The only time I`ve had a problem while useing mine were when I tried to use one on cases that I`d turned the necks on. The necks were too thin too let the die work them properly. I knew this was likely before hand, but had to try it for myself just to see.
 
Rockstar,
Thanks for the confirmation.

Flashhole,
I hear you about the sensitivity of the Collet Die. I suppose that is the price one has to pay when you don't need to lube the cases the same way as when FL sizing. I still lube up the neck area of every 5th or 6th case just to be sure.

Ol'Joe,
Thanks for the info on neck diameters. I was thinking about tracking that down today and you have saved me the trouble. Now is as good a time as any to tear down all of my dies and give them the once over. The NNY brass was harder to process. I think this is because they are annealed. Am i right in that annealed brass is harder?

I was looking at neck turning tools not too long ago. After a few hours of research I came to the conclusion that in a factory rifle, not shooting for BR groups, I could spend my time doing other things. Good info though on your findings with neck turning and the Collet Die. The beauty of this hobby (necessity at times) is that there is always something new to learn.

The thing I have learnt over this is to never assume that I know the specifications and to always check them when I run into problems. Also that support is but a new thread away.

Thanks for your help.

Feral_Goz
 
Annealing brass makes it softer, not harder. Annealing prevents split case necks, if done properly and timely.
 
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