.243 vs 7mm-08, Component Availability

[another pake]

I'm planning to make my next rifle purchase one which will be used by any of my many grand kids who frequent our farm. Besides the obvious deer hunting we do a lot of plinking and just plain shooting for the fun of it. Much of our shooting involves 22s, but invariably the dads will haul out center fires as well. Too often the kids are trying to contort themselves to shoot their dad's rifle. I want to buy a rifle more suited to the kids size (10 years to 15 years)but not necessarily "black plastic entry level" either. I've actually got my eye on a model 70 Featherweight Compact in .243 or 7mm-08.

I consider both of these to be "kid friendly" as far as learning what center fires are about, particularly recoil. I want them to become comfortable developing the right habits. I want to have a couple of developed loads. One for targets at 25 - 200 yards. The other for medium sized game, coyote and deer at similar distances. Long range shots, except for occasional gong shots, are not terribly important.

I do reload.

Now to my questions.

Can you recommend a general load or two for these scenarios?

From a component standpoint in today's market, and that is primarily bullets and brass I'd guess, does one look better than the other? Right now there are a lot of, "Not in stock, no back order" tags.

Your thought are appreciated.

 

[d2wing]

Weatherby makes a nice youth rifle in .243 and .223 on sale at Cabela's for $400. Between those two the .243 has less recoil.

 

[Chuck R.]

I went through the same decision this summer for my 11 year old, but split the difference and went with a .260.

I don't know IF there is any difference in component availability, as I've been shopping for .243 and 7-08 brass to convert to .260. It looks like a lot of the cheaper .308 based cases (REM-WIN etc) have hit the unobtanium status. Plenty of the tier one brass available though (Nosler etc.)

I also reload for a couple friends with .243's and have been able to find bullets. Luckily one of them had about 300 rds of once fired .243 or we'd be SOL for this season ( a bunch morphed into .260).

In the .260 I've been loading at Nosler 100 BT at about 2750 for practice and whitetails (36.0 AA2460) which equals a lite .243. From our stand his shot is under 100 yards so I'm not sweating the reduced MV. In his little REM MOD 7 it's a comfortable shooting load. Over the next couple years I'll ease him into the 120s at standard MV.

Chuck

 

[MrBorland]

Can you recommend a general load or two for these scenarios?

For "kid-friendly" loads, read up on Hodgdon's H4895 "60% Rule". I loaded some up for my 7mm-08 and was pleased (though I settled on 70%).
https://www.hodgdon.com/PDF/H4895 Reduced Rifle Loads.pdf

For really reduced loads, look into using Trailboss and 100gr bullets.

For full-power 7mm-08 loads, I use 45.0gr IMR4350 over a 120gr Nosler BT (2.80" COAL) or Barnes TTSX (2.735" COAL) with good accuracy and effect.

 

[CarJunkieLS1]

I'd go 7-08 all the way. You have a huge amount of 7mm bullets available and IMO brass availability is equal. You can take .308 brass and neck down to 7mm...As far as plinking and hunting with the game you listed at the ranges you listed a 7-08 with 120gr Nosler Ballistic Tip @ 2700fps will be deadly on anything you'll shoot with it and will kick like a kitten.

My wife says her 7-08 loaded the same way as I mentioned above actually kicks less than her .243 does with factory ammo. They are the same model rifles and stocks BTW. Guess which one she hunts with and shoots more...

 

[Inebriated]

Mr Borland pretty much suggested what I was thinking, so instead of reiterating that, I'll throw out an alternative...

Have you considered an AR in .300 BLK?

I know it's not what you asked for, and I know that a lot of guys prefer to have kids learn on a bolt gun. However, 300 BLK is a super light recoiling cartridge that kids won't have any issues with, would offer you .30 cal bullet selections and a very effective cartridge out of a 16" (read, lighter) rifle, and if you load a good bullet in either one, you will have no problem dropping deer at 200 yards. You can also throw in a very nice trigger, limit them to 1 round at a time and carry 5 round mags in the field, adjust the stock, grip, handguards, etc. to their needs, and adjust the overall rifle weight to what you think is necessary to balance ability to carry with any recoil mitigation.

Again, I know you didn't ask for it, but I think it does actually have a very good application for what you describe, and the cost of a Featherweight would easily build you a good, lightweight AR in 300 BLK. Ignore me if you're uninterested in a different style of rifle or cartridge.

 

[Panfisher]

I load a somewhat reduced load for my wife and her .243. I say somewhat because it still usesv100 grain bullets that will punch completely through deer but is mild enough you can see the impact. I admit I like shooting it too. Although a good bolt action .223 would make a nice kid friendly rifle too. Components for 7mm or 6mm are no problem to find.

 

[Offfhand]

Think .260 Rem, a happy medium between .243 and 7/08 with better component selections

 

[oneounceload]

When I had my No1 in 243, it REALLY liked the Sierra 85BTHP behind 4350 whereas my Model 7 in 7-08 LOVES the Nosler 140 partition with the same powder with a 120 Sierra SP in a close second

Both are great with the 243 being better for smaller deer, coyotes, etc, while the 7-08 is great for everything larger

 

[another pake]

Thank You, One and all for your responses. They are exactly what I had hoped for. And if anyone else has ideas, please add them.

Inebriated, no I hadn't previously considered the .300 BLK but I'll give it some thought.

 

[witchhunter]

I bought both my boys their own .243 when they turned 12. I loaded 85 or 90 grainers for deer and coyotes. They performed perfectly, both had 1 shot kills at 150 and 200 yards respectively. That said, they could have used 260's or even 7/08's and it wouldn't have mattered. I am thinking of a 260 or 7/08 for a range gun and I haven't seen any W/W or R-P brass for either one. I don't think the ballistics will matter too much with either of the 3 for deer at medium range that a kid would shoot. The 243 will shoot a 58 grainer faster and flatter, but the 7mm will shoot a 160 grain payload, the 260 is in the middle. I plan on getting whichever one is available in a rifle that I like.

 

[bangswitch]

If you have problems finding .243 or 7mm-08 brass to load, just resize some .308 brass. Run it through the caliber die you have, and trim to length. If you neck .308 down to .243, you may need to ream the case neck a little, but 7mm-08 comes out fine.

 

[surveyor]

I'm in the process of dusting off dads old 6 mm varmin rig, it has a 1:10 twist, and that would put the upper limit around 90 gr..
75 and 87 gr projectiles have been hard to find..while I did find some brass, it seems to be made of unicorn tears..

Lighter and heavier projectiles have been easier to find..
At least with a 243 you can form cases from 308..

I haven't looked at supplies of 7 mm component, so I can't help there..

But 4064 powder seems easy to find in my area..

 

[gamestalker]

I have an old Winchester model 70 Feather weight, and it was one of the rifles my boys cut their teeth on. And Remington also offers a couple of light weight rigs that are very fitting for a new, or smaller shooter to handle.

Regarding which cartridge to go with, I feel strongly about the .243 win. being a very good one for beginners and youths to learn with. OTOH, the 7mm-08 produces significantly more recoil, enough so that it could make for a rather unpleasant experience for a younger, smaller individual.

Components aren't exceptionally difficult to find for either cartridge, but .243 win. is certainly more popular. I can pretty much walk into just about any of my favorite LGS's and find .243 win. brass, and usually a larger variety of bullets also.

For all practical purposes concerned, and with appropriate loads, both are quite suitable for most hunting and paper punching needs alike, no major difference there really.

GS

 

[BigBore45]

I have a Single shot rifle that has 2 barrels that i started my wife on. One was in .223 rem and the other in .243 win. I used the same scope on both barrels for same feel/sight picture. She never even noticed the .243 when she shot at animals with the coveralls on. Just an option that worked for me. saves on the ammo to, can not shoot a single shot as fast as a good bolt gun.