2nd Amendment case (D.C. handgun ban) argued

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Remander

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http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/07/AR2006120701001.html?nav=hcmoduletmv

Scope of 2nd Amendment's Questioned

By MATT APUZZO
The Associated Press
Thursday, December 7, 2006; 8:49 PM

WASHINGTON -- In a case that could shape firearms laws nationwide, attorneys for the District of Columbia argued Thursday that the Second Amendment right to bear arms applies only to militias, not individuals.

The city defended as constitutional its long-standing ban on handguns, a law that some gun opponents have advocated elsewhere. Civil liberties groups and pro-gun organizations say the ban in unconstitutional.

At issue in the case before a federal appeals court is whether the Second Amendment right to "keep and bear arms" applies to all people or only to "a well regulated militia." The Bush administration has endorsed individual gun-ownership rights but the Supreme Court has never settled the issue.

If the dispute makes it to the high court, it would be the first case in nearly 70 years to address the amendment's scope. The court disappointed gun owner groups in 2003 when it refused to take up a challenge to California's ban on assault weapons.

In the Washington, D.C., case, a lower-court judge told six city residents in 2004 that they did not have a constitutional right to own handguns. The plaintiffs include residents of high-crime neighborhoods who want guns for protection.

Courts have upheld bans on automatic weapons and sawed-off shotguns but this case is unusual because it involves a prohibition on all pistols. Voters passed a similar ban in San Francisco last year but a judge ruled it violated state law. The Washington case is not clouded by state law and hinges directly on the Constitution.

"We interpret the Second Amendment in military terms," said Todd Kim, the District's solicitor general, who told the U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit that the city would also have had the authority to ban all weapons.

"Show me anybody in the 19th century who interprets the Second Amendment the way you do," Judge Laurence Silberman said. "It doesn't appear until much later, the middle of the 20th century."

Of the three judges, Silberman was the most critical of Kim's argument and noted that, despite the law, handguns were common in the District.

Silberman and Judge Thomas B. Griffith seemed to wrestle, however, with the meaning of the amendment's language about militias. If a well-regulated militia is no longer needed, they asked, is the right to bear arms still necessary?

"That's quite a task for any court to decide that a right is no longer necessary," Alan Gura, an attorney for the plaintiffs, replied. "If we decide that it's no longer necessary, can we erase any part of the Constitution?"

___

The case is: Shelly Parker et al v. District of Columbia, case No. 04-7041.
 
there are already 2 or 3 threads on this in Legal & Political. One even contains a transcript of sorts on the arguments put forth.

Search is you friend.
 
[primal scream]Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrghhhh!!!!![/primal scream]

There's a huge amount of scholarly writings and even a report from a committe in Congress from the early 80's that supports the RKBA as an individual right.

I hope the attornies for the DC gun owners are smart enough to present it in their briefs. But since IANAL maybe they shouldn't - I just don't know.

What I do know is that if the supremes so decide they can settle the issue of the RKBA as an individual right and wipe out a lot of gun control laws with the stroke of a pen and maybe even incorporate the 2nd into the 14th.

If the DC gun ban is overturned it seems from this non-lawyer's point of view that many, many gun laws in not a few states would be relegated to the status of not worth the ink or the paper they are written on.

What I fear is that they will consider that the cost of the potential chaos that overturning the DC gun ban could cause would outweigh the benefit. In that case, considering the court's past 10 year history of giving power to the government and taking it away from the people it is very possible that they would decide in a way they know to be wrong - i.e. that the 2nd protects an individual's right to keep and bear arms.

At worst gun owners every where will have but a short time to enjoy their hobby before states and municipalities ban all guns.

At best the Supremes will write their opinion in such a way that they will have weasled out of their responsibility to decide and using lawyer speak make their decision apply only to DC.
 
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Clean97GTI said:
there are already 2 or 3 threads on this in Legal & Political. One even contains a transcript of sorts on the arguments put forth.

Search is you friend.
That may be but the folks that hang out in General may or may not visit L&P.

This is a topic that deserves to be discussed by everyone. I for one had only the barest knowledge of the DC Gun ban case and was under the erroneous impression that it had been decided once and for all. I applaud the OP for starting a thread about the subject here in General.

If the course of the discussion turns out to duplicate the nature of the discussion of previous threads on the topic history shows us that the moderators will merge this thread with another or even shut it down.

Why not let the highly competent THR mods do their job...
 
"That's quite a task for any court to decide that a right is no longer necessary," Alan Gura, an attorney for the plaintiffs, replied. "If we decide that it's no longer necessary, can we erase any part of the Constitution?"

Exactly. *** seriously Constitution in D.C apparently does not matter anymore.:fire:
 
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