I'm sure that this isn't the first time this question has been asked but I'm a newbie so please forgive me. I've hunted white tail for years in South Texas, never shot over 200 yards and most from say 75 to 125 yards. I'm going to Montana this November with my trusty Rem 700 .30-06 hunting mule deer so I'm thinking I'll have shots from say 200 to 300 yards. Looking at ballistic charts I'm thinking Federal Premium, 165 grain nosler ballistic tips. Am I on the right track?
.30-'06 Ammo
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The Bushmaster
Member
Any quality ammunition that you and your rifle shoot well. It doesn't matter who made it as long as it's accurate in your rifle and you can hit with it.
GJgo
Member
Yep. Personally I'd still use a bonded bullet like the Accubond on Mule Deer, but any quality projectile in the 150 or 165 weight range will get the job done.
Art Eatman
Moderator In Memoriam
You won't hurt anything by going up to a 165-grain, but it's not particularly any kind of necessity.
My father loaded 150-grain Hornadys for some forty years; I've mostly used Sierra 150s. As near as I can tell, Bambi doesn't know the difference.
Being a bit conservative, if elk were in the deal I'd use 180s...
My father loaded 150-grain Hornadys for some forty years; I've mostly used Sierra 150s. As near as I can tell, Bambi doesn't know the difference.
Being a bit conservative, if elk were in the deal I'd use 180s...
I am with Pacsd, my 30 yr old savage like the remington core lokt. I only move up to 165 or 180 when hunting elk and using 30-06. The 150 grain bullet is more than enough juice at 300 yards for deer. No need for over kill in my opinion.
Most young or new hunters do not realize that you need at a minimum a 100 grain bullet for deer to make a humane kill.
Most young or new hunters do not realize that you need at a minimum a 100 grain bullet for deer to make a humane kill.
Sunray
Member
Hi. What bullet/ammo are you using now? Sighted in for what distance? Any 165 will kill any game you care to hunt, anywhere. Doesn't have to be a premimum bullet. A premium bullet won't make any difference either. Sighted in at 200, a 165 drops like a brick past 300. Energy isn't enough past 400.
Hunting deer in Montana really isn't much different than Texas. It'll just cost you more. $542 for a general deer only licence with a 4,600 quota. $912 for a general deer/elk licence. 17,000 quota. Hunting anywhere but in your home State is expensive.
Hunting deer in Montana really isn't much different than Texas. It'll just cost you more. $542 for a general deer only licence with a 4,600 quota. $912 for a general deer/elk licence. 17,000 quota. Hunting anywhere but in your home State is expensive.
Sunray, I haven't been to Montana yet but where I hunt in South Texas is very brushy. I originally said that most of my shots were between 75 and 125 yards but actually I've had much closer shots than that rattling. I've been using a Federal Premium 165 grain nosler partition. Maybe I don't need that heavy a round or premium ammo but it's a confidence thing.
From what I've seen in Montana I'll be stalking on the open plains so that's why I'm thinking 200 to 300 yards.
Thanks to all for the heads up, now I'm off to the range!!!
From what I've seen in Montana I'll be stalking on the open plains so that's why I'm thinking 200 to 300 yards.
Thanks to all for the heads up, now I'm off to the range!!!
Art Eatman
Moderator In Memoriam
A 165-grain, zeroed at 200, will be about six inches to seven inches low at 300. Right at two feet low at 400. The problem beyond 200 is wind; beyond 300, guesstimating distance and wind.
WTBguns10kOK
member
165's are unnecessary unless it's just for the fun of it. 150's drop large muley bucks, and I shot a smaller one one with a .243 as well. They're not that strong. Since you're not hunting elk or bear you don't need premium ammo either. Just find out where your gun shoots and take shots you're comfortable with to distance. The wind can be very difficult.
41 Mag
Member
While it isn't Montana, I will share with you the load and a hunting story from one of my pop's hunts years ago.
He was invited on a cull hunt for mule deer on a ranch out around Big Bend. I don't know the detail surrounding it all but I know how it all went down. He had always shot an O3A3 which he sporterized back in the early 60's, and as such he mostly shot surplus ammo through it as well. For target loads he simply shot the 147gr ball ammo, and come deer season he simply pulled the FMJ, neck sized the cases and seated a 150gr Sierra spitzer flat base.
During the hunt there were a total of 7 hunters, and a guide who spoke very limited English. Pop said every time the fellow would spot a deer it would take them 5 minutes to calm him down enough to understand where he was wanting them to look and then another 10 or so to find the mule deer he was pointing at, up on the canyon ridges.
There was one thing about my pop, you never bet against him when it came to shooting. He took many a dollar putting a BB through the eye of pigeons roosting in the decks of the place he worked. Anyway the fellows would shoot in rotation. He said they all had this that or another type of magnum and none of them seemed to be able to hit the sides of the canyon much less the deer. IT always came down to him and his ol '06. He might shoot 3 or 5 times but in the end he killed every deer they had tags to get on that hunt. He said he had never shot so far or so many shells to kill so few deer in his life.
This was before laser range finders and back in the early to mid 70's. The fact remains though mule deer haven't gotten any tougher, and the bullets have only gotten better. I can also say that if your within 300 yards of any mule deer and hit it honestly with either a 150 or 165gr load through the boiler room you'll have your deer.
If I were you and your already shooting good groups with the load your using I would use it and be happy.
I wish you the very best of luck and hope you find your trophy.
Take care,
He was invited on a cull hunt for mule deer on a ranch out around Big Bend. I don't know the detail surrounding it all but I know how it all went down. He had always shot an O3A3 which he sporterized back in the early 60's, and as such he mostly shot surplus ammo through it as well. For target loads he simply shot the 147gr ball ammo, and come deer season he simply pulled the FMJ, neck sized the cases and seated a 150gr Sierra spitzer flat base.
During the hunt there were a total of 7 hunters, and a guide who spoke very limited English. Pop said every time the fellow would spot a deer it would take them 5 minutes to calm him down enough to understand where he was wanting them to look and then another 10 or so to find the mule deer he was pointing at, up on the canyon ridges.
There was one thing about my pop, you never bet against him when it came to shooting. He took many a dollar putting a BB through the eye of pigeons roosting in the decks of the place he worked. Anyway the fellows would shoot in rotation. He said they all had this that or another type of magnum and none of them seemed to be able to hit the sides of the canyon much less the deer. IT always came down to him and his ol '06. He might shoot 3 or 5 times but in the end he killed every deer they had tags to get on that hunt. He said he had never shot so far or so many shells to kill so few deer in his life.
This was before laser range finders and back in the early to mid 70's. The fact remains though mule deer haven't gotten any tougher, and the bullets have only gotten better. I can also say that if your within 300 yards of any mule deer and hit it honestly with either a 150 or 165gr load through the boiler room you'll have your deer.
If I were you and your already shooting good groups with the load your using I would use it and be happy.
I wish you the very best of luck and hope you find your trophy.
Take care,
DM~
Member
The 165's are a better "all around" choise over the 150's, and as you are already use to it, it would absolutely be my choise! Also, it will give much better penetration on less that perfect shots too!
DM
DM
bgtusker
Member
Stick with the Nosler Partition 165 grain bullet, Montana muledeer are a little bigger than a whitetail and you may run into some harsh weather in November, use the good stuff. Take your range finder with you on your trip and try to keep your shots under 250 or 260 yards. First go the range and group some, sighted in at 200 yards. Good luck !
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If you are going with a light for caliber bullet in the 06 do yourself a favor and nix the use of ballistic tips. 150 or a 165 or a 180 are all fine for deer but in the 150 or the 165 go with a bit more stout of a bullet. A Montana mule deer buck can push 300 lbs pretty hard for a big one and you might have to take a shot that isn't perfect broadside hunting magazine posed. So use a bullet that is going to give you a bit of penetration.
My recommendations are Nosler Partition, Hornandy InterBOND, Nosler Accubond stuff in that category.
My experience with ballistic tips in a light for caliber bullet like a 150 or a 165 .308 is that they give explosive expansion and rapid kills on small deer and large deer but only if the shot is perfect. If your angle is off you are in for a heap of trouble with a light for caliber BT.
My recommendations are Nosler Partition, Hornandy InterBOND, Nosler Accubond stuff in that category.
My experience with ballistic tips in a light for caliber bullet like a 150 or a 165 .308 is that they give explosive expansion and rapid kills on small deer and large deer but only if the shot is perfect. If your angle is off you are in for a heap of trouble with a light for caliber BT.
JerryM
Member
A 165 grain bullet would do the job. The highest priority is what your rifle shoots best.
I never felt the need to use other than Speer, Hornady, or Sierra bullets for deer. If I were to go to so called premium bullets I would go for Barnes X if my rifle shot them well. My next choice would be Nosler partitions.
Personally I prefer a bullet that expands fast on lung shots. Accordingly, I never liked partition bullets.
Regards,
Jerry
I never felt the need to use other than Speer, Hornady, or Sierra bullets for deer. If I were to go to so called premium bullets I would go for Barnes X if my rifle shot them well. My next choice would be Nosler partitions.
Personally I prefer a bullet that expands fast on lung shots. Accordingly, I never liked partition bullets.
Regards,
Jerry
Years ago I read a lengthy article that convinced me the 165 is the best load in the .30-06 unless you are shooting things that really need a heavier bullet. I have used the 165 Partition exclusively ever since. I am sure other bullets will also kill, but the 165 is a good one, the Partition has never failed me and my rifle likes the load.
Thanks to all who responded I truly appreciated your input. I've been shooting at the range several times since posting and from conversation there and posting here it is apparent that there are pretty strong opinions both pro and con for the Nosler Ballistic Tip vs. the Nosler Partition. From my observation it seems that most, but certainly not all, of the negative comments come from shooters using higher velocity and to a lesser extent, lighter round. Meaning the faster the round, say a 140 grain ballistic tip 7mm mag, would have greater penetration failure than a 165 grain ballistic tip .30-06, all other factors being equal. Is my logic flawed?
H&H you brought up an excellent point, angle to the deer. Hadn't thought about that, thanks.
And thanks again to each and every person that took the time to respond!! Back to the range. Hopefully the wind will die down soon, 200 yards was tough today.
H&H you brought up an excellent point, angle to the deer. Hadn't thought about that, thanks.
And thanks again to each and every person that took the time to respond!! Back to the range. Hopefully the wind will die down soon, 200 yards was tough today.
My personal experience with the Nosler BallisticTip has caused me to not hunt with them. I shot a deer with a 150 gr BT in a .308, the bullet blew up on the hide and did not penetrate well at all. I found the deer finally, dead, but have stayed with the Partition since and have never failed to have complete penetration and an exit. I admit that one failure is not a scientific study -- but I usually shoot only one deer a year and it was enough for me. I do use the BT for practice, since they are about half the price of the Partition to load.
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