I am hunting a power line, and I want to start trying 500 yd. shots. What would be a good bolt gun to purchase. I am currently shooting a BAR in 3006 caliber, love the gun and the caliber, but not sure about it's accuracy at 500 yds. . Would appreciate any advice from any or you 3006 bolt gunners out there.
30 06 bolt action: most accurate?
- Thread starter tggdeer
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Why not take your current rifle out, set the targets at 300, 400 and 500 yards and try it before spending cash needlessly...unless you simply want a bolt-action rifle. 
Now that's legitimate reason in and of itself.
Myself, I prefer bolt-action over any other. Take your choice of manufacturer: Browning, Remington, Ruger, T/C, Sako, Savage, Weatherby Vanguard, Weatherby Mark V, Winchester, and on-and-on. They'll all shoot accurately enough for 500 yards.
Geno
Now that's legitimate reason in and of itself.Myself, I prefer bolt-action over any other. Take your choice of manufacturer: Browning, Remington, Ruger, T/C, Sako, Savage, Weatherby Vanguard, Weatherby Mark V, Winchester, and on-and-on. They'll all shoot accurately enough for 500 yards.
Geno
Theoretically, any good bolt gun will be MOA at 100 yards and will be minute of deer at 500, but there are a few extenuating circumstances... drop, wind, retained energy, lower velocity and bullets that will no longer expand properly, a shooting position that is much larger than MOA... at any rate it won't be the rifle that is the limiting factor.
You owe it to the yourself and the deer to spend some time with a chronograph, ballistics calculator and the shooting range before you go off deer hunting with ANY gun at 500 yards.
http://www.handloads.com/calc/index.html
The following ammo (2960fps MV) will be +/- 3" (MPBR) at about 285 yards. Not too bad. Velocity and energy calculations match what is listed at Hornady below. ~2000fps/1460fpe at 500 yards, should still be enough. It's pricey though. Drop is ~35.5", wind drift is 19.5" with a 10mph cross wind.
Standard 156gr 30-06 ammo will be ~2800fps MV. Velocity energy at 500yd will be 1870fps/1280fpe, so you're getting close to the limit of reliable bullet expansion. Drop is 40.2", wind drift is 21".
http://www.hornady.com/store/30-06-Springfield-165-GR-InterBond-Superformance/
Drop at 500 yards for Hornady Superformance .30-06 165gr ammo is claimed to be 40.7", but I get 35.5" low at 500yd when sighted in 3" high at 150yd.
You're going to have to practice at that range, have a range finder you trust, have a chronograph so you know exactly what your MV is to calculate you trajectory and wind drift, have a scope good enough to see that far, and use something like a Mil-Dot scope.
I would go with a 7mm Rem Mag or a 7mm WSM at that range. You'll retain 2240fps/1715fpe but with 5" less drop and 5" less wind drift at 500 yards. With a .30-06 you're on the edge. Not so with a 7mm Mag.
Federal has all of this stuff calculated for you for their ammo. Here is the 140gr Nosler Accubond 140gr 7mm WSM:
http://www.federalpremium.com/products/details/rifle.aspx?id=388
You owe it to the yourself and the deer to spend some time with a chronograph, ballistics calculator and the shooting range before you go off deer hunting with ANY gun at 500 yards.
http://www.handloads.com/calc/index.html
The following ammo (2960fps MV) will be +/- 3" (MPBR) at about 285 yards. Not too bad. Velocity and energy calculations match what is listed at Hornady below. ~2000fps/1460fpe at 500 yards, should still be enough. It's pricey though. Drop is ~35.5", wind drift is 19.5" with a 10mph cross wind.
Standard 156gr 30-06 ammo will be ~2800fps MV. Velocity energy at 500yd will be 1870fps/1280fpe, so you're getting close to the limit of reliable bullet expansion. Drop is 40.2", wind drift is 21".
http://www.hornady.com/store/30-06-Springfield-165-GR-InterBond-Superformance/
Drop at 500 yards for Hornady Superformance .30-06 165gr ammo is claimed to be 40.7", but I get 35.5" low at 500yd when sighted in 3" high at 150yd.
You're going to have to practice at that range, have a range finder you trust, have a chronograph so you know exactly what your MV is to calculate you trajectory and wind drift, have a scope good enough to see that far, and use something like a Mil-Dot scope.
I would go with a 7mm Rem Mag or a 7mm WSM at that range. You'll retain 2240fps/1715fpe but with 5" less drop and 5" less wind drift at 500 yards. With a .30-06 you're on the edge. Not so with a 7mm Mag.
Federal has all of this stuff calculated for you for their ammo. Here is the 140gr Nosler Accubond 140gr 7mm WSM:
http://www.federalpremium.com/products/details/rifle.aspx?id=388
jpwilly
Member
A bolt action may not offer you anything more than your BAR. What does your BAR group at 100-300yrds?
millertyme
Member
I'll trade you my Remington 721 for it.
unwise11
Member
I have seen some videos of a member on here who has shot his Howa 30-06 out to 600 yards at a steel block.
I can attest for the .5 MOA accuracy of mine in .308
I can attest for the .5 MOA accuracy of mine in .308
jp willy
I am shooting rem. 180 grn. core lockts/56 grnains of H414 and managing a consistent .75 inch gouping at 100 yds. I am thinking of trying some 180 grn. ballistic silver tips from combined technology. The bullets trajectory and energy at 500 yds. looks to be sufficient for white tail . 42 inches of drop with 1487 lbs. of energy.Sighted in at 200 yds.
I am shooting rem. 180 grn. core lockts/56 grnains of H414 and managing a consistent .75 inch gouping at 100 yds. I am thinking of trying some 180 grn. ballistic silver tips from combined technology. The bullets trajectory and energy at 500 yds. looks to be sufficient for white tail . 42 inches of drop with 1487 lbs. of energy.Sighted in at 200 yds.
Even a 2 moa rifle will shoot to 10" at 500 yards, in theory.
Since you're handloading I'd pick a bullet with a higher BC as it will shoot flatter and be less affected by wind at the longer ranges. I think the corelocks have a relatively low bc. Something like a 165gr Ballistic tip would be fine.
Like others have said. Go out and practice on paper at 3,4, & 500 yards shooting from the same postion(s) that you would use hunting. If you don't hunt off a bench, it won't so you much good to practice that way.
I've found it way easier to shoot 1" groups at a 100 than 5" groups at 500.
Since you're handloading I'd pick a bullet with a higher BC as it will shoot flatter and be less affected by wind at the longer ranges. I think the corelocks have a relatively low bc. Something like a 165gr Ballistic tip would be fine.
Like others have said. Go out and practice on paper at 3,4, & 500 yards shooting from the same postion(s) that you would use hunting. If you don't hunt off a bench, it won't so you much good to practice that way.
I've found it way easier to shoot 1" groups at a 100 than 5" groups at 500.
jpwilly
Member
A high BC bullet like the Nosler Ballistic Tip .507 BC good for 1900fps / 1500 ft lbs +- @ 500yrds. Set up a 12" shoot and see 400-500yrds and see what you can do in the field. I think since the BAR can shoot 1" @ 100yrds I'd say your good to go with the rifle.
kaferhaus
Member
So have most match shooters with the best equipment money can buy.
"Hunting" at 500yds is dicey at best. Shooting "decent" 500yd groups off of a benchrest is tough enough, in field conditions it isn't happening.
Not that you have to be MOA at 500 to kill a deer, any of the slightest mistakes in range, hold etc gets you a miss or worse a wounded animal that you'll never find.
The vast majority of hunters have no business taking shots at deer sized game any further than 250yds and that's too far for many....
Go to a range with a buddy let him set the targets out so you don't know the distances, get into a "field" position and see how you do.
I bet it ain't pretty....
Measure off 500 yards...
then see what a deer size target looks like. I have a Finn Mosin Nagant M39 that will do 1/2 inch at 100 yards all day long but I would not even attempt a shot at 500 yards. In fact, I have never shot a deer over 60 yards. There are 6 sets of antlers over my garage.
It is going to take alot of practice and ammo to shoot 500 yards and hit what you are shooting at....chris3
then see what a deer size target looks like. I have a Finn Mosin Nagant M39 that will do 1/2 inch at 100 yards all day long but I would not even attempt a shot at 500 yards. In fact, I have never shot a deer over 60 yards. There are 6 sets of antlers over my garage.
It is going to take alot of practice and ammo to shoot 500 yards and hit what you are shooting at....chris3
Its called deer hunting, not deer sniping. Learn to shoot good groups on paper first. Give the deer a break with attempting 500 yard shots, it is a terrible thing to gut shoot a deer, or blow its leg off, and have them wind up a crip. It really is unethical hunting today when we know better, to 'experiment' on deer vis a vis 500 yrd shots. You will get a lot of satisfaction scoring well on paper at that range, and have lots of fun working up those loads to the results you want.
Kachok
Member
No semi-auto will match a bolt gun at 500 yards. Tikka T3 is scarry accurate, Savages are really good too. I recomend 270 WSM for long range shooting. High BC bullets and 3300+speeds combined with a case that is very prone to accuracy, make for a great long range shooter.
Just my opinion, but make your 500 yard shots at 1-gallon jugs full of water, not animals that could be crippled or maimed and suffer needlessly. IF you can CONSISTENTLY hit a milk jug full of water at 500 yards, dead-on, EVERY TIME, then maybe you have the skills necessary. If you miss even once, that represents a maimed animal.
Again, JMHO.
Again, JMHO.
Freedom_fighter_in_IL
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Old saying that I have stated on here many times " Just because that rifle can do it does NOT mean that YOU CAN!" 500 yard shots on live game is way to iffy for even the most experienced hunters. I am perfectly capable of making a reliable kill shot at 500 yards all day but I still don't do it. There are way to many factors when shooting on live game outdoors. You have wind, unknown range, obviously little practice, and then you have an animal that is alive and MOVING. I use the same argument for long range rifle as I do for long range archery. Some people tend to think that you hear the bang and the bullet is already there. INCORRECT. At 500 yards, that bullet is going to take around .5 second to get there. In that half second that deer could have stepped right when you pulled the trigger. OOPS gut shot. Hurt deer that you more than likely will never see or find. Ever tried finding the exact spot you fired to from long range? It is FAR from easy. And you will find little to no sign from a LD shot in the gut. My advise, learn to get closer. That BAR is perfectly capable of 250 yard shots and I would stress that you should work within that range. Make it a hunt not a shoot.
TheGrimReaper
Member
tikka
There are some good '06s out there.My personal favorite is the Savage Model 110 series. I have owned the Rem 700s the Win 70s and two Savages that have both been sub MOA out of the box with factory ammo (but each gun likes a certain ammo and load, you have to find it) at 100yds. Having said that, I was told some 30 years ago that you should only shoot as far out (on game) as you are able to hit 10 out of 10 in a dixie paper plate reliably, from a position that you are most likely going to be in when hunting. For me this is going to be kneeling, standing, or prone when I am hunting. Unless you shoot comp, it will come as a surprise just how crappy a person can shoot off-hand at 100...especially when buck fever gets ya good.
As for the round, the 30-06 is more than adequate for game, two legged or four legged out to 500 yds, we have been proving that since 1918, but it is ALL about skill at that range. Practice until you are totally sick of it, and then practice more. Just $.02
P.S.--Deer sniping: dude I love that
As for the round, the 30-06 is more than adequate for game, two legged or four legged out to 500 yds, we have been proving that since 1918, but it is ALL about skill at that range. Practice until you are totally sick of it, and then practice more. Just $.02
P.S.--Deer sniping: dude I love that
robertbartsc
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500 yard shots are too far. ...get closer or hunt something else.
BrocLuno
Member
Burris laser ranging scope to start with. Prone with good support second. Then maybe for 100 milk jugs as a test. If they all blow up, cool - you can do it If not, hmmm - maybe dial that range back some?
If not, hmmm - maybe dial that range back some?unwise11
Member
Since you are loading try Sierra matchking 175 BTHP's.
those are very accurate and I know alot of people who hunt with them in the form of Federal GMM.
But, 500 yards is a longshot, and can be done by .308 and 30-06 with headshots or very well placed neck shots, a 300wm or 338 lapua would actually be useful.
those are very accurate and I know alot of people who hunt with them in the form of Federal GMM.
But, 500 yards is a longshot, and can be done by .308 and 30-06 with headshots or very well placed neck shots, a 300wm or 338 lapua would actually be useful.
SpeedAKL
Member
I do not recommend 500-yard shots on deer with a .30-06 unless you are an excellent shooter. It's certainly doable and the '06 will have enough retained energy to get the job done, but you need to be confident that you can make a clean kill at that range first. Even if that is the case, a fast 7mm or .30 magnum may be a better option due to flatter trajectory and retained energy.
"Its called deer hunting, not deer sniping. Learn to shoot good groups on paper first. Give the deer a break with attempting 500 yard shots, it is a terrible thing to gut shoot a deer, or blow its leg off, and have them wind up a crip. It really is unethical hunting today when we know better, to 'experiment' on deer vis a vis 500 yrd shots. You will get a lot of satisfaction scoring well on paper at that range, and have lots of fun working up those loads to the results you want."
I couldn't agree more. I've seen far too many cripples over the course of the years from just this sort of thing and the paper plate measure is a darn good one.
As Dirty Harry said, "A man's got to know his limimtations..."
If you can't keep 5 shots into the circumference of a paper plate, you need to get closer and practice more until you can.
IMO, the Good Lord didn't put deer here so we could target practice. Those that do so show great disrespect.
I couldn't agree more. I've seen far too many cripples over the course of the years from just this sort of thing and the paper plate measure is a darn good one.
As Dirty Harry said, "A man's got to know his limimtations..."
If you can't keep 5 shots into the circumference of a paper plate, you need to get closer and practice more until you can.
IMO, the Good Lord didn't put deer here so we could target practice. Those that do so show great disrespect.
Hangingrock
Member
More like 100yds or less. We use to participate in running deer shoots. The target suspended from cable on a wheeled frame would traverse X-distance at the 100yd line. Firing from standing most got one shot off some two. The 1st shot aimed the 2nd who knows. We are not a nation of riflemen. Mostly hits in the big middle or the ass end.
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